I wish there were more discussion of our starting metabolic state when we fast. Fasting when your body knows how to burn fat vs fasting when only a sugar burner are two radically different states. If you’re a sugar burner, fasting can put you into a physiological panic, since unfueled brain = coma/death.
I know that Dr Fung often starts folks off with a long fast right from the get-go, but those patients get lots of testing, plus support and advice about electrolytes, etc.
While I absolutely agree with you, that sugar burners should not try this at home, I started with IF and it was great (do as I say not as I do obviously).
Had been on a moderate carb diet for years (not very successfully except when for the prior few months when I did not cheat too often) trying to eat no flour or gluten, did eat rice, beans and quinoa and sweet potatoes and sometimes corn. Fasting was extremely easy the first month, I fasted between 24 and 48 hours a couple of times a week, attending a bunch of scheduled special events in between where I ate what I wanted within reason (mostly in compliance with moderate carb). It was much harder to fast in April when I went keto until I started feasting before fasts
I think extended fasting can be dangerous. I think not fasting is more dangerous. EF is the best weight loss tool. If you can do it.
Patients go to the ER with electrolyte issues everyday Keto or not. Usually from BP pills. If you haven’t put someone in the ER from low sodium or potassium then you aren’t a doctor.
I didn’t watch the Periscope Live thing.
Dr. Nally’s patient base is much different than Dr. Fung’s. Dr. Nally primarily sees older retirees.
Context is king.
Dr. Nally also pushes other products.
Both have valued opinions in their context.
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Dr. Nally also pushes other products.
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Ain’t that that the truth? $10,000 for one of his website packages! Wow. Affiliate commissions must be great…LOL
I don’t have anything against anyone selling products or services.
I’m just pointing out that they both sell products and services, and will have accompanying biases.
If he can get 10K for one of his packages, more power to him. If he can’t, he’ll have to lower his price.
I’m biased towards many things including bacon…In the interest of full disclosure.
Exactly! Finally somebody said it!! Hard to be objective when one promotes product sales. Think big food, big pharma - none of them are interested in anyone not eating or getting sick from eating (the wrong stuff).
Unless I really am sweating out water, when I’m fasting I don’t feel the need to drink all that much. Couple cups of coffee in the morning, and maybe a glass or two of water the rest of the day. The "drink lots of water to help flush out toxins" makes a gut-basic sense to me, but I wonder how much of a demonstrable bad effect there will be with drinking less, if any.
When eating salt and carbohydrates, I get thirsty and drink/retain a bunch of water. Keto and fasting gets rid of it, and as long as the urine does not get dark, as long as there’s no thirst or feeling bad going on, what the heck?
Good point. Always have to remember the incentives that are at play, especially since we humans are so good at convincing ourselves that WE are above being influenced by those many factors that we think we can ignore, things like advertising, the opinions of others, what makes us money.
I find Fung clear almost to a fault on the subject of keto, T2D, obesity, and fasting. He has never been one to hand out medals for fasting, especially to commemorate some macho endurance fasting. All is for health; nothing is for fame or bragging rights.
That is funny @Dread1840 
I have this same fear that I will have to do extended fasting the rest of my life in order to keep the weight off. I don’t mind fasting with IF or even alternate day, but it seems like a lot to have to do this forever.
Thank you so much. I am struggling with my weight loss even with fasting. I keep gaining the weight back after each of my extended fasts. Going in big circles. Trying to figure out what is going wrong in my re-feeds that is causing so much weight to come back. I am starting to worry that maybe fasting isn’t the answer…which would leave me hopeless
I so relate to your struggle. I finally feel I might be on to something. First of all, I am tracking food in Chronometer and it is interesting to see how easy it would be to overeat the fat sources, especially the liquid ones (heavy whipping cream). It’s just something to be aware of - I need to measure so I don’t accidentally over feed myself. Yet I am also listening to my hunger, not letting calories guide my diet.
Second is being consistent with fasting. I always enjoyed the dramatic blood-sugar and weight-loss results of a long extended fast (up to 7 days for me), but then I would let several days/weeks go by without any shorter fasts. I can’t let too much time go by between fasts, my blood glucose climbs and the weight comes right back. I think there is sweet spot somewhere in there where I can do a rare long fast with a couple of 36-42 hour fasts a week, and stick with two meals a day on the eating days. I imagine everyone has to play with this to find the right routine for them, and also may need to switch it up occasionally to keep the results coming.
Agree! I was taught in Medial Technology School that the 2nd most common reason for ER admits were BP related issues. Truth. Working nights that first year and we were all trained on the Chemistry tests even though my primary department was Hematology.
Dehydration, people messing with their own medications very common. Many a 2am phone call to the ER for potassium levels.
Thanks Darcy. I am learning that lesson the hard way. Thank you so much for the insight. I have decided not to allow more than three days of a refeed cycle. And I will continue to IF during that time. What seems to be working for me now is 5 days fasting and 2 days eating. I save my eating for the weekends in order to be able to participate in social events. I also keep everything keto. No more eating outside of the plan
It’s also possible that Dr. Nally is preaching to those who are not in the choir. We here on the forums seem to be intelligent, well-read, very thoughtful self-experimenters. I think his concerns about electrolytes and taking exogenous Ketones as a meal replacement are valid, but, raise your hand if you would undertake a Fast that way… I think we know better. Is it safer to warn those who need the warning? Probably.
Also, as for the sugar burner vs fat burner attempting fasting, part of the horrific feelings are probably carb-withdrawal as much as anything else. A fat adapted person should be able to go 18-24 hours between meals feeling nothing more than the occasional wave of hunger. A little salt or a tsp of coconut oil can make that “side effect” go away.