Deeper State Keto (90 Day Cut) - My Journey!

(David) #64

What Matt and Megha did on DSK was amazing, also how different the results they experienced. It doesn’t sound easy. Good luck and please keep posting :smile:

(What The Fast?!) #65

At the end of the program, you do reverse dieting - slowing increasing your macros back to a maintenance level. You may gain a couple lbs of water back if you increase carbs from the 10 total grams, but you will maintain the majority of your loss. We’ve seen it with others that Robert (KetoSavage) has coached. Reverse dieting is fairly common in the bodybuilding/fitness show landscape. If you skipped this stage and just upped your calories to maintenance without building them back up slowly, then yes - you would load all the weight back on.

For your reference, I have been keto over a year and while I have at least 10-15lbs (4-7% body fat) to lose, my weight has not dropped. I have done IF, multiple day fasts, more protein, less protein, carnivore, etc and have not been able to lose weight. I’m also a cyclist and extremely active - fasting negatively affected my athletic performance and caused me to lose my period/menstruation cycle, it seems my body just didn’t react positively to it. I am doing the DSK program in order to finally lose the excess body fat. I’m documenting it here so that others can see my experience. I’m happy to answer questions from those who are interested and would love any support from this community, as I’ve been participating in these forums since March of 2017.

Your comment seemed very black and white and I wouldn’t call it supportive - hopefully this info gives you the full story. If you’re not interested in seeing my progress on this program or disagree with the premise, please feel free to mute this thread.

@Chance Totally! Seeing Megha and Crystal go through huge plateaus on the scale really helps keep me motivated. I’ve only lost 2.2 lbs so far, but I’m noticing my clothes fitting a little looser. Fingers crossed!

(Lonnie Hedley) #66

If you have similar results as Megha, you might not lose much more on the scale, but instead see gains in muscle mass and reduction of body fat. Which should still be the results it seems you’re looking for.

(What The Fast?!) #67

Totally. I’m not letting myself get freaked out by the scale. Though…I definitely have body fat to lose, so I imagine I’ll have more losses than she did. She was super small to start with. I’m at 147.3 right now - and on a 5’ 3" frame, I’m certain I can get down into the low 130’s without being too thin.

According to my recent DEXA, I have 97lbs of lean muscle mass, 47lbs of fat, 31.5% body fat. Let’s say I gained 5lbs of lean mass (which would be CRAZY in 90 days - I’m not lifting heavy, I’m doing reformer pilates 2-3 days a week and road biking 3-4 days a week): at 135 lbs, I’d be 102lbs lean mass, 28lbs fat, 21% body fat.

I’d love to see results of: 99lbs LBM, 31lbs fat, 24% body fat. I’m working hard at hitting macros exactly on target and am working out 9-12 hours a week right now between cycling and pilates. (I know this is a lot of hours, but I’m also training for a century ride, so it means a lot of hours on the bike.)

I have a client dinner tonight and it will be the first time I’m eating out at a restaurant. Definitely ordering a ribeye and have already scoped the menu to make sure I can fit it all into my macros! I’ll go back to a “lazyish” keto once I build up to maintenance calories again - I don’t mind being super strict for a few months but am very realistic about living my life when not in a “cut.”

Thanks for all your continued support @hedleylo

(John) #68

How about an update! Interested to see if something finally worked for you.

(Lonnie Hedley) #69

Agreed.

(What The Fast?!) #70

@jmbundy @hedleylo @collaroygal @Chance WELP…I’m just over 4 weeks in to the program, here’s my update:

Weight loss: nill. I’m actually up a half pound at the moment.
Inches lost: a little here and there, but it fluctuates because I may be more bloated from one day to the next. I posted some progress pics on Instagram (@deeperstateketosis) and people said they could definitely tell a difference from Week 1 to Week 4 and my boyfriend also said he can see a difference.


NSV’s: I’m doing great on my bike. My performance is improving on this higher fat percentage for sure. I started at 80%, went down to about 78% and am now back at 80% and will be working up from there. It’s hard to keep protein that low, especially as my calories continue to drop as the program progresses, but my performance is definitely improving. I hit a bunch of PR’s today on my normal ride, and this was on a day when my legs weren’t fresh. I’m very impressed with that. (This is also in combination with the fact that I’ve been getting active release massage.)
Hunger levels: I’m for sure hungry, but I can deal with it for another 2-3 months if I finally start to see changes.
Emotional/Mental: Restricting isn’t that hard and it’s nice that there’s an entire community all going through this same process. The two women who went through the program as they were developing it (Megha and Crystal) went through giant stalls, so it’s nice to know it’s not just me. That being said, it boggles the mind that I’m not losing actual pounds this far into keto. I mean…it’s been over a year. I’m barely over 5’ 2"…at 150 lbs, I have plenty of weight to shed. That part is very hard to deal with, emotionally, TBH. Everyone says not to compare yourself to others, but let’s be honest - that’s not really possible.
Overall perception: I’ve only had one “off plan” meal - I ate keto but wasn’t accurate about tracking because we went to a steakhouse I also had a martini and a glass of wine. I have one other “off plan” meal planned - that’s tomorrow night, but I’m going to look at menu and build it all into my macros as closely as possible. I do plan to drink (it’s a work dinner, I’ll have 1-2 drinks, but I won’t have any other carbs that day in order to compensate).

I’m going to stick with it, 2 more months of reducing macros and then at least 30 days of “offboarding” which includes building calories back up to a maintenance level. If/when the program is successful for me, I may try to rebuild calories to a higher level of maintenance so I can do another cut in a few months.

(John) #71

Look smaller to me! If I hadn’t lost a lot in the beginning I would probably be in a similar boat. I lost all my weight in the first few months and nothing since. I started cycling and the muscle actually pushed me up in weight. Despite rarely cheating I have been at the same level for over about 18 months. I’ve tried fasting, IF all that stuff and it just came right back, it is like my body is determined to stay where it is. Trying another IF right now with really high fat and no booze, if this doesn’t get it I don’t know what will.

I have a friend that gave it a try for 90 days last year and didn’t budge an ounce or an inch, we have a facebook page for locals with about 200 and she is the only one I know that had this issue. Really wish I knew why but for some reason it just really doesn’t seem to work for a few people.

I know you have done about everything there is to do but I don’t remember if you track ketone levels, if you do are they high? I would be curious if some people just don’t produce many or utilize them as well as others.

Edit to add: were you a lot larger before by any chance? The places that don’t seem to go away for me are the places I was fattest before, not sure if it is skin related or what.

(Tovan Nhsh) #72

I can tell a difference in the progress pics. Pretty noticeable IMHO.

(What The Fast?!) #73

This is exactly my experience. I’ve done a lot of fasting but it always came right back. I used to weigh about 35lbs more, but I lost that weight many years ago. Yes - my thighs and back are the worst, definitely genetic. :smiley:

I do track ketones (blood) and since starting DSK, they are generally above 2 or 3. When I do extended fasts, they also get super high.

(Mary) #74

Holy cow! That’s a huge difference in the back shot. And your lovely, wide shoulders really make your waist and hips look narrow.
Nice job.

(Mandi) #75

How are things going @KetoLikeaLady?

(What The Fast?!) #76

Honestly… very frustrating. I’m trainjng 6 days a week, hitting macros, and haven’t lost anything. Slight difference in pictures but not as much as you’d think for what I’ve done over the last 7 weeks.
I may be going back to the beginning of the program to increase calories and give myself more runway to cut from. I think I didn’t start high enough for my level of activity and training and my body is hanging on to everything it can. That’s the only thing I can think of for why I’m not losing.

(Lonnie Hedley) #77

Have you reached out to Matt, Megha, Robert, Crystal for tips? Curious how interactive they are with people on their plan. I know they do Q&A videos, but wondering if they actively answer questions for people in the program.

(KCKO, KCFO) #78

I think you might have a good plan going with starting over with higher calories, since you do a LOT of exercising.
You might want to consider adding another rest day. You are putting a lot of stress on your body with your current schedule.

Hang in there, I have faith you’ll get yourself sorted out and just be AMAZING.

(What The Fast?!) #79

WELL…I have a HUGE UPDATE today…

In the last 7 weeks of this DeeperStateKeto protocol, I have:

  • reduced my caloric intake weekly, per the DeeperStateKeto protocol (starting around 1735)
  • maintained a fat percentage between 78-84%, per the DSK protocol
  • trained intensely, around 90-110 miles a week (with climbing) along with a variety of reformer pilates classes 3x/week for strength training
  • eliminated alcohol intake
  • eaten every meal at home except for 2 work dinners and 2 In n Out protein burgers

Here are my results:

  • Lost 1/2 pound of lean mass, per DEXA scan
  • REDUCED my RMR by 200+ calories, significantly damaging my metabolism, per my RMR test
  • Increased power on the bike (I assume due to Pilates and the high fat percentage)
  • Decreased performance after calories get below about 1650
  • Seen a slight improvement in pictures
  • No real difference in measurements

Here is what I have learned:

  • I thrive on a very high fat %
  • 10 total carbs a day is totally doable and doesn’t affect my riding at all
  • I need more protein than 50-60g a day, as I barrel through glycogen quickly on my rides (HR averages in the 150’s) and I need protein to replenish
  • I need more calories overall…probably a lot more than I’m eating right now
  • My body is SUPER stressed out from all the training without enough fuel
  • Restricting calories, even on a ketogenic diet, results in lowered metabolism, no matter what anyone tells you
  • A “cutting” protocol requires a pre-cut increase in calories so that you can have a larger runway to cut from
  • IF YOUR BODY IS IN STRESS MODE, IT WILL NOT BE ABLE TO ACCESS STORED FAT. This is my number one takeaway - based on CICO math, I should have lost 10lbs in the last 2 months - I was burning 3200-5200 calories a week through exercise, on top of my normal daily activities, and only intaking 1500-1750 daily. For some reason, even though being fat-adapted means I SHOULD have been able access my stored fat for energy, my body wasn’t allowing that to happen - instead, it decided to slow down metabolism. (I assume this is due to stress from working out.)

I’d love to hear some science behind this, if anyone has it. @richard I think you’ll find all this interesting, as you know my story. I wonder if the stress signals stopped my fat metabolism from coming into play and accessing stored fat for energy? I can’t think of anything else, since my fasting insulin is so low already.

@ketodave - tagging you so you see the update, since we talked about this when I started

@collaroygal @hedleylo @Mandilou looping you in. :slight_smile:

(Mandi) #80

This is incredibly interesting. Based on what you’ve said, do you think going with a full carnivore diet would be right for you?

(What The Fast?!) #81

I did carnivore for 30 days. I felt great but didn’t lose anything (I gained a few lbs). HOWEVER, I do think carnivore is great and maybe I would have started losing if I stuck to it for a longer period of time. I think it’s a very difficult diet to do for social reasons. The amount of meat I needed to eat to be full was just…embarrassing, to be honest. :slight_smile: As a woman who was struggling with her weight, I constantly felt the need to justify the diet to other people and explain that “you see, maybe if I stick with it, I’ll start losing weight by eating massive amounts of meat.” :slight_smile:

I may experiment with carnivore in the future, but for now, I love cauliflower pizza and spinach salad.

(KCKO, KCFO) #82

Looking forward to seeing your results based on your current perception of your issues. I think the last point really nails it.

Keep going, you will get there.

(What The Fast?!) #83

You have been so supportive, I really appreciate you - your support and suggestions along with the fact that you listen to me rant about all the madness over the last year. :slight_smile: