I have been talking about this lately, kind of fitting. @PaulL I know we also talked about some of this as well as the carnivores https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjM9AC7pTws
Zero Carb Information Videos
MeganNZ
(Megan)
#302
Watching the video you linked @Naghite (Everything You Know About Keto Is Wrong). Heās talking about the downside of constantly trying to keep insulin low (+/- and ketones high) out of a belief spiking insulin is bad etc. Heās talking about how essential insulin is for all sorts of essential body processes. I canāt remember where I heard it but what I heard is a response to food only accounts for 1/3 of the insulin our bodies make throughout the day. If this is true, where does that fit into continually trying to keep insulin being a potentially bad thing? Our body makes a lot regardless of what we eat and donāt eatā¦
Also, what are the chronically high ketone levels needed to develop Hyperketonemia?
Naghite
(Michael)
#303
My cousin is type 1 diabetic running Keto. Most of his insulin is a baseline drip with less than 30% being bolus for meals. So absolutely constant carbs are bad but equally zero insulin spike tells the body there is no food around regardless of energy reserves (fat).
Not sure of hyperketonemia, but in general I would think it is about signalling, meaning it is not the level of ketones per se, but the time without leaving ketosis. Just a guess here.
While hardly new information, the internet is full of people who are stuck on the antiquated carb insulin model so much that they cannot handle any information which tells them to raise insulin in any wayā¦ā¦ akin to not seeing the forest from the trees.
Fangs
#304
Yup!!
as much as it has become an evil, it is vitality and massively important to the physical body truly. Balance of knowing when the evil we made insulin becomes the āgood guyā and thinking must flip. so agree.
PaulL
(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing)
#306
Hereās Kelly Hogan on the need some people have for more fat, and her experiment with eating more fat. She cautions that it is not a panacaea, but it does help some people.
MeganNZ
(Megan)
#307
Good video, I like how she puts it: If what you are doing is working for you, stick with what you are doing. If it isnāt you may want to give this a try.
It requires you to enjoy eating fat tho, which is what I really struggled with when I tried it for 5 or 6 weeks. I hate the taste of butter and ghee (even hidden in stuff like carnivore hollandaise sauce) and really dislike the taste of beef fat. I ate mostly pork belly and very fatty pork shoulder, and the pork belly made it quite expensive.
I also didnāt feel good eating this way, in fact I felt more and more awful, physically. A huge confounding factor here tho is I was sleeping very poorly at the time. Half way thru my trial I decided to stop the 2 meds I take at night to help me sleep (especially stay asleep) and I was waking every 30 to 90 minutes, all night every night. After 2 months of this I restarted them because the toll it was taking on me was getting extreme. Anyway, this confounding factor really messes up knowing how Iād feel eating very high fat, much lower protein (for me, b/c I tend to eat a lot of protein), but I definitely noticed my very low energy get even lower as soon as I started eating this way.
I question how healthy a diet of mostly pork belly and shoulder pork is, too. Commercially raised pigs are fed rubbish and they arenāt ruminants, so all that rubbish goes from their meat to my body. Plus, from a micronutrient profile, itās not ideal.
Iām still steadily losing weight so Iām continuing with my usual form of carnivore, eating whatever the heck I want from my list of carnivore foods I enjoy eating (which is quite short), eating however much the heck I want, and whenever the heck I want. Zero tracking, zero windows in which Iāll eat and not eat, zero care for the time of the day or how big or small my meals are etc. At some point I half expect it to stop working and Iāll probably need to take a look at my macros. I donāt eat a lot of fat and I eat more protein than my body requires, especially for someone who does next to no physical activity. I need a woe to be sustainable tho, as soon as it feels like a diet (like if I have to start limiting protein, for e.g.) Iām going to struggle. Lots of emotional baggage attached to things like deprivation and have toās which I will need to find ways to work thru and overcome.
So far on carnivore Iāve lost about 17kg (started May this year) and have another 8 or so to go. Iāve very tall for a woman (6 foot 2 inches/188 cm) and in tights and a fitted t-shirt Iām looking awesome. Height really does help you look less overweight 
Some of my skin isnāt wanting to bounce back to its youthful elasticity now Iām 61 and have gained a lost off and on throughout my life, so Iām probably going to be stuck with these progressively emptying batwings and a flap of hanging skin on my lower belly, but I can live with that.
PaulL
(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing)
#308
You are probably one of the people who do not need extra fat. You might be someone who needs extra protein, in fact.
Iām surprised to read, in several posts, not just yours, that pork belly is so expensive. In my supermarket, itās about half the price of bacon, and comparable to the price of ground beef.
MeganNZ
(Megan)
#309
Hey Paul, Iād love you to be right about me being someone who possibly needs extra protein lol. Rump is the only steak I can afford and itās not at all fatty. I really donāt like mince (ground beef), but I have discovered a way I can eat it. I mix a raw egg and a wee bit of grated cheese in it and make patties, then eat them cold from the fridge. I try to keep as much of the fat from the pan on the patties by not draining them on a paper towel, but still lose quite a bit from the cooking process. Pork is the only truly fatty meat I enjoy. Thankfully pork shoulder, when on a good special, is also the most affordable meat I eat. The cheapest beef mince here is $15 a kilo! The cheapest rump steak is $22. Bloody criminal if you ask me. I could buy all sorts of ultra-processed āproteinā at the supermarket for half the price. Crap like chicken nuggets, for example. Mince used to be poor persons food here when I was growing up, now itās almost approaching a damn luxury.
Pork belly is expensive because itās become trendy. I bet when it un-trends itāll stay expensive.
Iām thinking about becoming a cattle rustler!
PaulL
(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing)
#310
If my arithmetic is correct, A$15.00/kg is about what we pay for mince here in the northeast U.S., too. But the other cuts of beef are all more expensive.
I like pork shoulder, too (which my supermarket calls a āpicnicā), and in my local supermarket it works out to a little over a quarter of the price of beef mince. And itās tasty, too!
MeganNZ
(Megan)
#311
On a really good special pork shoulder is just over half the price of beef mince here.
Still thinking about becoming a cattle rustlerā¦
PaulL
(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing)
#312
Wow! Thatās not cheap. Since youāre from NZ, how do you feel about lamb? We get a lot of New Zealand lamb here, and I like it a lot. Iād have a tough time choosing between pork shoulder and lamb.
MeganNZ
(Megan)
#313
Lamb is around $22-$45 a kilo, depending on the cut and whoās producing and selling it. Itās not often on special either. The cheapest available is usually shoulder chops, they are gristly and chewy and really not that nice. I think almost all of our lamb is exported.
MeganNZ
(Megan)
#315
lol yup! New Zealand is a great place to live, but itās not a cheap place to live anymore.
Shinita
#316
All items has a range but I would say pork belly is way cheaper than bacon and ground beef here. Beef and bacon are both so expensive I avoid them but I have many other problems with bacon so no big loss :). (I still have some bacon cubes in my fridge, that is half price compared to slices and it spices up my eggs, I just need to add 1 egg for every 10g or something to balance out the salt. Itās a great ratio so fine 
I do like bacon flavor, I just hate the salt burn and not sure about the fat, it depends.)
I never buy pork belly seither, itās sometimes tempting but waaaaay too fatty to me and a tad more expensive than my cheap porky favs with way more meat. Fat is cheap, I want protein for my money! (And my taste points towards fatty but not super fatty meat and I tend to overeat fat anyway.)
Just fat tissue is super cheap (unless you buy some smoked fancy-smancy home-raised thing), a tad below chicken on saleā¦ Or IDK, I am very lost lately with this inflation where some prices almost double in a few months but cheaper and more expensive prices change very differently, they get closerā¦ And one supermarket may sell the same item for almost twice as much sometimes (I think itās just a trick to make one wanna use their cards and apps and therefore going there more often. no way the super price sensitive average Hungarian would waste so much money on already luxury item butterā¦ the new price is 3-4 times as much as the sale price last year while salaries donāt change much. but the special price is easily way more than the normal one elsewhere, the latter is only a doubled price from last year. crazy. I didnāt remember this from before. okay the apps and cards in every chain are moderately new).
Same here (except a leaner, nicer pork with a price cap since many months), along with 70/30 scrap pork. But they produce too much lard so I canāt eat them often - and pork shoulder isnāt one of my favs (itās fine but not chuck the perfectionā¦), I just canāt resist the price and hey, it gives me very many calories for its price and pretty much protein tooā¦ And I
used to overeat it like crazy but itās fine now I think.
But itās one of my chosen cuts so yep, I grab some when I see it on sale. It would be definitely my first choice if I wanted to (and could) eat higher-fat lower-protein. Or if I didnāt like the taste, the other, lean cheap pork with a bunch of even cheaper fat tissue.
Do other countries even have pork fat tissue? In slabs with skin or cubedā¦ It is a thing here as it is used for so many things, scratchings, sausages, zillion dishes optionally or mandatorily start with frying itā¦
I am aware we Hungarians have a thing with fatty pork so the variety and fattiness is probably quite pronounced here compared to many other countries but I donāt know details and there are so many other countriesā¦
But we have light pork loin too. I still canāt process that (even though I get it, people are into super lean meat. but stillā¦), pork loin is, like, super lean to begin with (okay, it has a thin fat layer but the super lean meat requires that. and more) so I never liked itā¦ But normal cuts never get trimmed. That would be the end of the world or something similarly tragic. And we have especially fatty pork breeds like Mangalica. Itās trendy now, again.
So I am immensely grateful for my body to like pork. My extreme low-carb is only possible with it. Maybe I could eat 100g gluten every day too but I doubt itā¦
You use NZ dollar, right? Thatās even less than the Australian oneā¦
Yep, beef is that expensive here too (not like I know the prices now and our Moms taught us never to buy mincemeat anyway. but it sounds right it itās in NZD) and 620 NZD is a not uncommon salary (and not everyone is alone for that amount)ā¦ No wonder people barely eat ruminants here and the amount diminishes even more. It did before the inflation but now? Beef mince or any of the cheapest beef cut is a luxury for many of us, maybe something for special occasions. I never tried steak despite my curiosity, thatās another level entirely.
My SOās Mom donāt even buy pork, just the cheaper chicken. But itās still thigh, thatās not sooo bad.
Sorry. This topic and me shouldnāt mix.
That was chicken frame, buttered bread (??? butter is insanely expensive! why not lard on butter?), a potato dish with the cheapest sausages and the cheapest sausages themselves here. Never mincemeat, pure meat was considered expensive.
No, even worse, cheap and bad Vienna sausage (we donāt call it āsausageā in my language), itās watery and various things go in there, especially soy at some point of timeā¦ (Of course there are good Vienna sausages. And ones even not choosy cats donāt want to eat.)
No idea why eggs and meat are considered expensive here still, itās the cheapest food for me or very close (obviously only for chosen meat) but I canāt get satiated by fat or carbs so yeah, I must have protein. Without much carbs. Almost all plants are out. Gluten is the only exception.
I think it is trendy here since many centuriesā¦ Okay, that probably helps.
And if it was more expensive, people would buy all the other super fatty pork I supposeā¦
But itās just my guess based on my limited knowledge.
Fattier meat is usually a bit cheaper here. Widely available but cheaper. See pork shoulders. Pork loin always was among the more expensive ones. Chicken breast was super expensive compared to thighs, costed multiple times as much - but now it has a price cap so they got closer. But chicken breast has a rapport with dieters and bodybuilders while lean pork hasnāt.
Of course. Thatās how things work. It would need some very serious drop in interest to change that I suppose.
Itās āscapulaā in Hungarianā¦ 
I think I never shared that info.
And I still donāt know how to translate āthighā. I usually just say leaner pork, it has the price cap and I learned to love it, itās leanish but tender and it has lovely fat layersā¦ And I can use other tricks when I ate off that partā¦ But I suppose āthighā is green ham and I suspect itās often the butts of the pigā¦ If I buy it in the right supermarket chain, itās at least 3 times less expensive than the cheapest beef (lower leg. a bit sinewy, more work but makes great stews). Price cap so it couldnāt change since last October. But all pork stayed affordable, itās amazing.
Lamb is VERY expensive here (maybe not as expensive as in NZ but closeā¦?), rare too though the hypermarket I frequent has it.
We almost bought red deer meat at our last shopping as it was the cheapest ruminant 
We would have bought that little amount of beautiful temptation but we had freezer space problems and seafood plans. Next time.
We had some mouflon this year (a beautiful wild sheep, not rare here, the wildlife park nearby have them so my SO who often crosses the forest to work after 5am sees them sometimes), that was cheaper than beef too and more interesting Never had mouflon before.
Fangs
#317
Fangs
#320
eh, I thought it would be a tad better but I guess Chaffee could not āreallyā give big info because he just doesnāt know the guyās real life med history or ? I thought it contained tho a bit of good info to pass on to others tho.