What my dog taught me about CI:CO

(system) #1

Originally published at: http://blog.2keto.com/ci-co/

I’ll get to the bit about my dog in a minute, but first let me tell you about the Calories In : Calories Out theory. It goes a bit like this; Calories that you eat – Calories that you burn = Fat that you store It’s a very simple theory, if you want to decrease your body fat,…

Wife is doing it all correctly, but meter says differently
Fat loss on CICO?
How much veg do you eat a day?
Species specific nutrition -duh!
(Tom Seest) #2

Sorry, every time I read this post, I think of this:

(Scott Shillady) #3

@richard I absolutely love this article. Is there a way for any CICOphants that get in to automatically be redirected to this.

(Larry Lustig) #4

Nothing whatsoever to do with keto, your article, or your point, but everytime I see the title I think of this:

(Tom Seest) #5

Glad I’m not the only lunatic.

(Larry Lustig) #6


(Tom Seest) #7

Will that confuse the Canadians?

(Jacquie) #8

Not this one. :wink: Actually, I’m a dual citizen (US and Canada).

(L. Amber O'Hearn) #9

I’m surprised we don’t call ourselves Loons.

(Jennie) #10

How does one lower the level of basal insulin? Are there methods other than IF, longer fasts, and HIIT work outs? Maybe I’m asking the wrong question. If I’m female and I’m not “losing” does it even matter? I feel great, have limitless energy, barely need sleep, mental clarity, desire to exercise, etc. Should I even think about the scale? I just want to get to the weight where the doctors are “happy”. So on one hand, I could care less about that number. On the other hand it would seem that number kind of tells the medical professionals how “healthy” you are.

(Keto Krazy) #11



I’ve found that trying to please other people becomes an exercise (look, a pun!) in futility. It’s too bad establishments like the medical and insurances industries use the wrong metrics to gauge health. And that doesn’t even begin to describe the anti-fat mentality of the average citizen.

I believe lowering basal insulin levels is a long term process that can take many years. It has a lot to do with the rate of turnover of adipocytes (fat cells), which die off and get replaced with new, healthy ones at a rate of about 10% per year. The older ones no longer respond to insulin correctly.

@richard and @erdoke will explain it much better I’m sure.

(Ross Daniel) #13

Great article and explanation! I’m a controls engineer and the t-stat analogy is a very good one. I work with a bunch of other engineers of course, and after I lost 50 lbs on Keto, they wanted to say it was all because I was at a calorie deficit. I tried to explain that its not simply CI:CO and that the body isn’t a closed system, there are far too many variables and things like internal metabolic regulation that vary and a simple CI:CO model cannot illustrate. It is frustrating, because they should know better. They are controls engineers! Feedback, PID loops, process variables, you name it are the norm around my profession. It gets complicated, but even they have been brainwashed by years and decades of bad diet/nutrition advice. I will start using the thermostat analogy if the subject comes up again, and I will see what they say to that… /rant

(Kieny Poppen) #14

I loved the article, thank you.

(Morley Knight ) #15

Well. … our dollar coin is the Loonie. I guess I’m stuck searching for the next “keto for a dollar” post. Loony keto has to be somewhere. Lol

(Jacquie) #16

Another Canadian! Welcome! :slight_smile:

(Azrael Stone) #17

This is a great read. It still leaves me a lot to figure out, having tried to change my diet to be something that supports my body and makes me feel good to little avail, but I hope to find it along the way.

Also your dog is beautiful and I cried a little bit at the pictures.

(Derek I. Batting) #18

Excellent anecdotal article. I will certainly be sharing this with folks as the CICO argument occasionally rears it’s ugly head.

(Kerri Hines) #19

Having your child diagnosed with T1D teaches you this lesson too. They suddenly start dropping weight like crazy but are eating constantly!
Get diagnosed and follow teachings on using insulin and counting carbs only to gain weight at an incredibly fast rate. For teens and young adults, that are very easily upset with the weight gain, they very quickly learn how to lose weight fast. Take less insulin. But they don’t necessarily eat fewer carbs.
Nobody understands how well insulin puts weight on the body better than an adolescent T1D! They’ve had it figured out for a very long time. Just not how to do it without sacrificing health… because they are never offered support on how to achieve weight maintenance by using less insulin. That’s crazy talk!
Jdrf loves sharing stories of pro level athletes with T1D and how they can do anything. I guess that’s the underlying message. Train your body really hard.
It really sets these kids up to feel like they are doomed no matter what they do. Trying to act as their own pancreas but having actually no knowledge of how one functions and what insulins full role in the body is.

(Jay Morris) #20

Richard - First off let me say I fully appreciate the write-up a well as the awesome pictures of your dog.
I do not argue your statement on the CI:CO model not being correct (mostly in fear of a dog bite), however I fear that this maybe misconstrued by some like myself as a Keto monopoly “Get Out Of Jail Free” card.

For myself and others that created our obesity situations (or maybe diabetic situations) through large eating based on emotional cue’s - the concept of “eating to satiety” can be thrown out the window given the right (or wrong) emotional conditions as some of us can experience a never-ending hole in out guts, regardless of the amount of fats we eat.
In addition I have seen Dr. Fung’s reports where cortisol is increased based on stressful factors, and this looks to raise insulin, further advancing weight gain.

Now, I must note that I have stayed a solid Keto for the last 8 months, and would like to say that my emotional eating has been heavily suppressed, and almost non existent. I have had some emotional/life changes that have helped correct this, as well as certainly a happier mood based that (without a doubt) can be attributed to the way I now eat, as well as the results I have gotten from my diet.
However, that “addiction” will likely always lurk in me, and does exposes itself in times of happiness now - where a good BBQ or family gathering will push me to eat WAY more protein and fats than I should, and this certainly leads to some temporary weight gain. This gain is lost after a few days of normalized Keto, but if one was to continue this path consecutively, it would without a doubt result in weight gain based on an over consumption of calories to energy expenditure.