Scared to start fasting - I'm always hungry!


(Bethany Greenwood) #52

Yeah, that’s my problem see. . .I haven’t lost my appetite, I didn’t want to start fasting when I still get very hungry. As so many people talk about loosing their appetite I thought I might need to make some adjustments to get to that point?

I am thinking of asking to drop a day at work too as I definitely have issues with stress.


Sounds more like chronic stress to me.
Yeah- why dont you just do keto, track your macros, and if you want to try anything- then try IF 16/8 to begin with. But I lost weight on regular keto eating 3 meals/day too. And you know- sometimes we stress ourselves! Like trying to rush ourselves and push ourselves too hard - just keep calm and keto on.


BTW, to add to my post above, I’m also doing 16/8. I eat between 12pm and 8pm.

(Bethany Greenwood) #55

Ah, yes! I didn’t think of adding oil to a broth!! Have you tried putting it through a blender to try and get it to mix a little better? Now that I’m at home for a while I will have all the equipment I need to create great Keto lunches :smiley:

I’m still struggling to eat my protein powder without something to sweeten it, but I think this has more to do with the powder I have since I can now drink coffee without any sugar. Which one do you use?

I can’t get past 10 am. . . even if I eat at 9pm lol.


I have not tried a blender, I’m to lazy to do that. I don’t think it matters much, you get extra OO at the start, but that works for me. The protein supplement I use is Body Fortress Whey Protein chocolate (Walmart). I drink it with a few clumps, it mixes poorly, If you have a blender, I recommend it for mixing the whey powder. It’s not unusual for me to finish my day with both an OO fortified Broth and a separate glass of water with scoop of chocolate whey powder, just to get my macros up, I still never have reached the Cronometer recommended 2134 kcals, although I noticed another calculator suggested 1968kcals, I haven’t reached that either!

(Kirk Wolak) #57

Bethany, 20g of carbs… I wish. My body (due to massive inflammation, I believe) cannot tolerate more than 5g and keep me in ketosis.

Please read the book: The Obesity Code by Dr. Fung. He runs The Fasting Method (IDM Program).
I was a consulting client of theirs!

Anyways, KETO is NOT about grams of carbs. It’s about STOPPING the INSULIN production caused by the carbs, and getting your body into Ketosis.

Are you making Ketones? That’s what’s important. It’s the lack of glucose swings (caused by insulin) that makes your hunger easy to manage.

How many times are you eating?

And the point is not to each as much as you can (I have packed away 3lbs of bacon in a single setting). It’s about eating heavy fat/protein until you are completely sated (FULL). But only doing that 1-3 times a day, eventually 2 times a day, then OMAD (once a day). But over many weeks is fine.

TFM generally recommends a FAT fast. Eating all the avocado and bacon you want. FOR DAYS ON END. The point is to get bored with the food choice. It’s a psychological trick. Then to get busy walking, or house work, or work, whatever. Distract your mind. Eventually you find your hunger signals stop.

But I read what you are eating, and if you have ANY inflammation I am screaming… NOOOO!
Cut the dairy! Immediately. And the Soy creamer. Your coffee is black for now or have water.
NO ARTIFICIAL SWEETENERS until you figure out your Levers.

And this is an article I wrote that describes the core levers that can cause stalls:
The Levers of Power (What to Measure, What to Control) to avoid stalling/stalls

HTH, and feel free to ask more questions.

Personally, I think you can FUEL your body (food), or Feed your Palate (Tastes). And when I review what you are doing, you doing the latter, just in more of a KETO style. If eating your food is producing Dopamine from the enjoyment of the tastes, then you are just subbing one addiction for another as "Dr. Cywes @CarbAddictionDoc would say). He is worth listening to as well… He is a bariatric surgeon, who prefers to use Keto/Carnivore with his clients since even those who get the surgery will gain the weight back if they don’t fix their ADDICTION to carbs/food!

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #58

:+1: :+1: :+1: :+1: :+1:

(Bethany Greenwood) #59

I am producing ketones and I eat 3x a day. I have Dr Fungs book and will be reading it in the next few weeks.

I see what you’re saying but I’m not currently interested in not enjoying my food or only eating once a day. I don’t have masses of body fat to loose, I just want to use IF for a while to get to my goal weight but don’t want to force my body to ignore hunger cues.

The post that you linked though, I have a couple of questions 1) are you saying even if I have 5g carbs, if I get stressed my glucose and insulin will rise? 2) what happens if you are 24 hours into a fast and you get the worst news?

Because if just some bad news can stall my weight loss then that is most certainly part of what is happening here. :frowning:

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #60

I make hot ‘creamy bone broth’ using this stuff , whipping cream and cacao butter. You will probably find the cacao butter ‘tastes sweet’, even though it is 100% fat, mostly saturated.

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #61

@Bethany I’ll let Captain Kirk speak for himself. All I want to say is that eating for fuel in no way implies not eating what you like. It’s just making better choices rather than letting your taste buds be the final arbiter. It’s letting yourself expand your horizons. I like what I eat and over the 3+ years of keto have learned to expand my choice of foods greatly. A lot of stuff I used to think was great, I no longer miss nor care about any more.

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #62

You may find these of interest:

(Kirk Wolak) #63

Understand that you got here by ENJOYING your food too much.
And it is ENJOYING Food that messes up your bodies natural hunger signals.
Are you:

  • Hungry

  • Starving [Only felt this before Keto]

  • Low Glucose

  • Bored

  • Needing a Dopamine Hit (mental hunger/craving)

  • Nutrient Seeking

  • Drained

    Those are feelings I can detect from learning to be hungry and listening to my body.

    You have to be willing to be uncomfortable… But that will come.

So, the easiest way to do this is to Stop ALL SNACKING. Only eat during you 3 windows. Eat enough that you wont need to snack.

THEN, start pushing your breakfast later. BUT no SOY in your coffee. Protein and Collagen breaks a fast! For me, HWC breaks a fast, because it’s an allergen.

Your goal should be 16:8 fasting, then?

  1. I am saying I got bad news, and my glucose spiked 50 points! I got caught in bad traffic and my glucose spiked ~20, I had to deal with a deep emotional issue and did not track the spike, but was fasted and fine, until 2hrs later where I was RAVENOUSLY hungry and BINGED on Pepperoni (I make it a point to never break a fast with an ILLEGAL food, LOL).

So Yeah, your emotions can drive Cortisol. I am a STRESS eater by my nature. Now I know the CHEMICAL Profile behind it. My body prepares me for a BIG PHYSICAL Response. (I grew up in a violent environment). I realize that is my body releasing glucose quickly to energize/enable me to FIGHT! After that, I am FORCED to replenish it!

  1. I think I answered that.

So, if you get stressed, I found the best thing to do is to PHYSICALLY Process it. Your body gave you energy, go for a long walk. Practice some deep breathing. You want to destress your body, and change your hormone profile. If you are trapped in an office, go to a bathroom stall and crank out a bunch of squats. SLOWLY until you deplete your legs. That will help tell your body that you handled it. It will REMOVE the excess glucose and REDUCE the insulin response.

Imagine it this way: You get a HUGE 50 point move in glucose (you barely notice, maybe a little shaky). But you know you got hit with stress. Test your glucose if you can. But THAT is the time to deal with it and deplete the glucose. If you don’t your body says “Oops, let me clear that out, here is some insulin”. Which shuts off fat burning, and clears it. But… It over does it as your are more insulin sensitive than you used to be. Then you glucose drops, and you feel it hard. WALK that feeling off… If you don’t the urge to eat will just keep growing…

All of those levers are important to different people to different degrees. My opinion is:

  1. Inflammation
  2. Dairy
  3. Stress

for me. Stress is acute, whereas inflammation is systemic. And thats why NO one approach works for everyone. When you can find someone who reacts like you do, they are the best person to model for what works and what does not.

I am trying to decide to fast longer right now. My last meal was Monday night. My next one Is Tonight or Friday. So if I skip today, I want to be able to hold it until Friday! (I don’t want to eat 2 days in a row for a couple of months due to some inflammation).

(Bethany Greenwood) #64

I know what you mean, I can’t believe that I actually don’t even like potatoes any more!!

(Bethany Greenwood) #65

yes 16:8 is what I am aiming for

Great advice, thanks!!

May I please have soy in my coffee with my lunch when I break my fast??!! :innocent:

It will be interesting to see what happens now 80% off my stress will be gone working from home. . .

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #66

Curious, why are you attached to soy? From a keto perspective there’s really nothing good about soy. Fermented, ie tofu, is OK, but tofu is light on nutrition and you can do lots better.

Soy products

According to Keto Summit, there are a few reasons why soy products, such as tofu and soy milk, aren’t great options for the keto diet. One is that they are high in phytoestrogens, which could affect hormone levels. Another is that many soy products are highly-processed, something you definitely want to avoid on the keto diet. Lastly, soy products are high in phytates, which can bind to minerals and prevent their absorption in your body.

(Bethany Greenwood) #67

I’m not really, it’s coffee I don’t want to give up. I know once I give it up I probably won’t even like it but I haven’t dived into why coffee feels so important to my, why I feel “less” if I don’t drink it…???

It just yet ANOTHER thing I have to get over and I just lost mayo so I’m gonna need some time :joy:

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #68

Coffee’s probably not an issue, although it can be for some. Maybe it won’t be for you. I think you’ve got a few other items to eliminate before you get to coffee. :coffee:

(Kirk Wolak) #69

Yes, if you are breaking your fast. Just not in the morning! [I’d prefer you do HWC since Soy is nasty stuff with all of the estrogen mimicking stuff in it]

So, Bethany, what makes an event stressful? It’s not the event. Scientists have measured this. It’s actually how YOU RESPOND/Internalize the threat/situation.

The happiest day of my Frustrated life was when I realized this Formula:

Frustration = (Expectation - Reality) * EGO

EGO => How much you believe you should be able to control these things, or they should NOT happen to you!

So, we are NEVER Frustrated when we get a free meal for no reason at a good Restaurant. [Reality was bigger than our expectation].

Now, if we are a movie star, and they did not give us free drinks too, and expected us to tip the waitress. Than that same event is Frustrating (especially considering the size of their EGOs)!

Stress is similar. If you can practice rehearsing 1 stressful event, and changing your response to laughter, shrugging, saying “This, too, shall pass!”… Something other than internalizing it.

Start with small stressors. Someone cuts you off on the way to work. Try Imagining you know them to be a wonderful person, who is rushing to the hospital before a family member dies [You can literally change the MEANING of any event, to make it HELP you feel better]. And say to yourself, I hope they make it where they are going safely. [or simply, I choose to forgive them, because if I ever do that, I would want people to understand I am not normally like this!].

Find one stressor per week, and LOVE it until you laugh at it. Then find the next one. Eventually you can build a routine that finds stressors and lets you respond with a common response. Okay, I’m alive and well, glucose under control, let me address this with love/compassion…

Like going low-carb. You have to knock one thing out at a time, until you own it. It’s a process. It will be life long, and at some point, people will stop stressing you out, because you don’t give them the adrenalin they are expecting from your response…

(Bethany Greenwood) #70

It’s more what I want to have in the coffee that’s the problem :sweat_smile:

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #71

@Bethany That gets back to this, ff. Choices.

:+1: :+1: :+1: :+1: :+1: