New member- Arin

(Arin Morfoot) #1

Thinking to start a keto lifestyle. What do you recomment?

I asked on different forums, and all suggestions are so primitive.

(Max Scotthorne) #2

I started by listening to the podcast and looking into the science. I know its hard changing what we have been told since we were young. Just remember since we have had the food pyramid the epidemic of obesity and diabetes has escalated.

I would say have a look into keto and study it. Examine some of the recipes and try a few out see if you can see yourself eating like this everyday. I’m not the hard sell type but if you try the diet out for a few weeks (dip your toe in the water) you may find the benefits convince you (feeling energized and satisfied).

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #3

Welcome to the Ketogenic Forums!

In addition to the 2 Keto Dudes podcasts, you can also get good information from the Low Carb Down Under channel on YouTube. They typically have a number of conferences throughout the year and invite knowledgeable researchers to present talks. I like these talks because they are pitched at a popular level, yet they always include citations to the scientific literature, so that I can follow up on any points I want to learn more about.

Only you can decide whether a ketogenic diet is for you or not. For myself, I can say that keto has reversed my insulin-resistance, lowered my blood pressure and my heart rate, reduced my systemic inflammation, cleared up my skin, and improved a whole host of blood markers. I also lost eighty pounds (36 kg) of fat effortlessly and without counting calories.

(Allie) #4

Learning about keto and actually living ketogenically for a while before (badly) advising someone to cycle in an out of it… :thinking:

(Marianne) #5

I was terrified when I started keto because I thought I needed complex instructions or a “magic formula” based on years of conventional dieting. The two most important things I learned (and basically keto in a nutshell - for me, anyway - were:

  1. Keep the total carbs under 20g/day;
  2. Eat clean, one ingredient foods. It’s okay if you combine them to make a dish, but don’t use anything fake or processed. I never did “recipes.” Meals consisted of a pure protein (meat, pork, chicken, etc.), and a steamed vegetable with butter and salt.

Good luck to you.

(Chuck) #6

I started by researching for books and internet documents. I read books by doctors that are believers of keto, I read books by scientists and I read lots of articles from individuals that have experience with being on keto and low carbs. I had done Atkins diet before and found that there isn’t that much difference except for the fact of fat over protein. I started slowly by decreasing my carbs and increasing the fat intake. Then I created my own goals. I also purchased keto recipe books that not only has means, but snacks, smoothies, fat booms, etc.

(KM) #7

“Keto” simply means eating few or no carbohydrates. (Edited: and a low or modest amount of protein. The main point is the carbs, ymmv re more or less protein depending on your body and your goals.) This causes your body to metabolize fat for fuel, a state called ketosis. Honestly, it can be as simple or complicated as you make it.

Some people eat only animal products, some people eat a “clean” diet of natural organic ingredients which they may eat individually or combined into recipes, some people eat exactly what they’ve always eaten, minus the foods that have a lot of carbohydrate in them, and some people rely on commercial products which typically try to replicate high carb foods (“keto bread”, “keto bars”, sodas and snacks full of artificial zero carbohydrate sweeteners and so on.). As long as you are restricting your carbohydrate consumption to the point where you are in ketosis, you can do it any way you want and it is still “keto”.

One shorthand you may see on this website is N=1. N refers to the sample size of an experiment. N=1 simply means that all of us are experimenting on our own bodies to see what works, because people are different in terms of how many carbs they can eat or what foods may not work for them. I would say keto is complicated only because at its best it is a personal journey, not just generic rules.

Good luck to you. As they used to say, keep calm and keto on. :+1:

#8

I never did keto then. I tried but failed keeping my protein that low.
I still consider it keto as I apparently got fat adapted :wink:

Of course we all have our own protein needs and tolerance to high protein so it’s not so easy to say what is low and high… I consider 1.5-2g/kg for LBM an okay range, some get away with 1-1.5. (I eat way more than 2 because I can’t help it. But it’s quite fine for my body. I must have a higher need.)

Very true.

(Allie) #9

And I can’t be doing it now… :rofl:

(KM) #10

I’m trying to list some basic keto beginner moves. Keto is not ordinarily a high protein diet; although some people remain in ketosis with no concern over protein intake, some don’t. N=1, usual advice is don’t overdo the protein, or if you’re having issues getting where you want to go, try dropping it down. I would agree that drastically dropping carbs is the first and most important concept.

(Chuck) #11

It depends on the person, I am reading a book by a keto nutritionist that says it depends on what you are trying to accomplish. If you are stalled in fat loss you may need to eat less fat, less carbs and more protein. I have seen with myself that I started gaining a little weight and I reversed it by eating less fat and more protein.

#12

Indeed, it isn’t. High protein isn’t a requirement, not even advisable, it just doesn’t necessarily stop ketosis or cause any problems. One can be in ketosis on high-protein, moderate-protein, low-protein and even at zero protein. If I fast long enough, that’s inevitably keto :wink:
High-protein may be a problem for some but not for all of us. At least it depends how high, there is too high protein for everyone but not everyone can realistically reach it without even wanting to. My body always was happy with my protein intake, I simply stop desiring it after going quite high so it never gets insanely high and my very high days don’t happen every day. That probably won’t be good.

I try to drop my protein but it doesn’t let me… I am hungry with little. But as I have no problem with it, I accepted it never will be low and merely try to minimize it, whatever it means. Without overdoing fat. It would be interesting to see how low I can go with fat in focus… I love experiments. And avoiding excessive amount of protein for reasons.

(Bob M) #13

I was thinking of starting a thread “If you’re stuck at a weight, try…”, and then listing things to try:

1- nothing
2- eat less fat, more protein
3- eat more fat, less protein
4- eat more animal fat, less protein
5- avoid dairy in all forms
6- avoid dairy other then fermented
7- get more sleep
8- avoid alcohol
9- …

I have found that I gain weight eating more fat, such as butter. But other people find butter to be filling.

(KM) #14

What I have read is that for some people, their bodies will convert protein to a type of sugar if their sugar/carb intake gets low enough. If that is happening to someone who is trying to get sugar out of their blood, the next step would be limiting the amount of protein available for conversion.

(KM) #15

You should do this!! For me, a 3-5 day water fast causes a notable weight drop. I rebound water / fiber weight, but my new normal (at more or less the same food intake as before), is 1-2 pounds less, which I’m assuming from my shape/feel is fat. I’m also assuming when I get to Phinney weight, I’ll probably rebound 100%, at which point I’ll probably accept my poundage as what the universe has in mind for now.

(Chuck) #16

Then there is myself that my blood sugar is always at a very near the too low point. I don’t eat food with sugar and don’t even care for the taste of sugar. I have done great in the past on the Atkins diet. While I eat meat and other protein I have never been a huge protein eater. I have journaled and logged my meals, snacks and drinks most of my life. I have had all sorts of lab tests done. My enemy is grains, wheat, oats, rice and processed corn. I can eat corn on the cob without issues just not processed corn. I can even handle a whole grain rice in small amounts. I have never seemed to have issues with potatoes but to be safe I am staying away from potatoes and any grains, processed or not. I know the big fear here is insulin resistance, I have been tested and haven’t shown to be my problem. My concern is that the test the doctors use don’t really work. My grandmother was a diabetic, and my sister is pre diabetic. Even when I was my heaviest I showed no signs of diabetes that the doctors could find.

#17

Doing nothing, I am good at that :smiley: It didn’t work. Sigh.

I typically should go for less fat, less (or at least the same amount of) protein (less plant carbs if I happen to have more than a few grams a day too), less meals (if I do it right, this one triggers the first two). And more exercise. I am a lazy, often moody one, I always need more exercise… Especially proper workouts, I am quite happy with more muscles if less fat doesn’t seem to happen :wink: It even helps in the long run…

@kib1: Yes, such people exist. I am soooo glad I am not among them, I would be doomed. I can’t get satiated without my high protein and I like my protein sources in bigger amounts anyway.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #18

That used to be the belief, but subsequent research has shown that the reality is far more complicated. The body has numerous ways of dealing with excess protein, most of which do not involve turning amino acids in to glucose. In fact, there are as many amino acids that can only be turned into fats, as there are amino acids that can only be turned into glucose (and there are a few that can be turned into either).

What is true is that in the absence of dietary glucose (a/k/a carbohydrate), the liver makes the small quantity of glucose that the body actually needs. This process is primarily under the control of the hormones glucagon and insulin, but there are many other factors that also regulate gluconeogenesis.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #19

“Too low” is a matter of context. If you have plenty of ketones to feed your brain, your glucose can go surprisingly low without ill effects. This was demonstrated by George Cahill in the 1960’s, in the course of his work on fasting in human beings. However, when the body is in glucose-burning mode and blood glucose drops, that is an emergency.

The key phrase is “that the doctors could find.” You may have been fine, or your insulin may already have been struggling to keep your glucose in check. But since the American Diabetes Association recommends not measuring fasting glucose, we usually never know there’s a problem until glucose starts getting out of control.

(Chuck) #20

I have had many fasting lab test, at varying fasting times even as long as 24 hours. I was cautioned from the point I could understand what diabetes was that because of my grandmother’s diabetes that I had to be careful. That actually drove me to fear deserts. But no one ever said anything about carbs in general. I guess I should’ve realized that while in boot camp and afterwards that my energy levels weren’t what they were before going in the Navy. I look back over my journals and piece together that my evil food is grains. Potatoes in reasonable quantities hasn’t seemed to be an issue and I can take it or leave it. But let me eat a slice of bread and I want the whole loaf. Not else will drive me to want to binge eat other than anything with processed grains.