Keto Coffee Ghee vs plain unsalted or plain butter + are heavy cream really a no go?

(Keto life n' a little hippie ) #1

Checked out keto on youtube, a lot of stuff. Almost hard to grasp. One thing I noticed is they all preach Ghee in coffee. Why is that? Is dairy bad? How could that be, people are eating cheese on keto, right?

And there are lots of folk on the tube saying to drink salted water. Well I tried. Not gonna happen. Ever swallowed sea water?

What adding salt to keto coffee? Or just using plain salted butter? Butter should add some salt, right?

And some of the videos said no to heavy cream. Why is that? No problem having heavy cream and still consume less then 20 carbs a day. Why is butter better then heavy cream? I get that there are more fat in butter, but I also add mct to mine, as well as some coconut oil. So why a dash of heavy cream for taste?

Have I missed something regarding keto coffee, dairy products or in general read the wrong info on this? I’ve been having super results so far, and I had my fair share of keto coffee with mct/cocnut oil/heavy cream and I do loose weight.

Could it be that many are advocating ghee to generate sale of overpriced butter? I wouldn’t buy ghee, its cheaper and easier to make myself. But I rather not go via the step of clarifying the butter, I’d rater just dump the plain n salted butter straight into the coffee.

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #2

I think the concerns about dairy are overblown. Yes, some people are sensitive to all dairy and some to lactose. But if you’re not, there’s no issue. Ghee is ‘clarified’ butter and all that means is plain butter heated to remove the water and any residual milk protein and/or lactose. So ghee is pretty much pure milk fat. It also does not require refrigeration and will keep a very long time at room temp. You could make it at home if you cared to.

I use ghee, whipping cream, mct oil, coconut oil and powdered whey in my keto coffee each morning. This is not a ‘fat bomb’ but instead a full keto meal to my current macro ratios. By the way, if you add any fat to coffee, you will get a much better coffee if you use a blender. Also, I find that a little salt makes the coffee flavour more intense. It does not make it taste ‘salty’.

Final note about salt. I drink salt water - it is NOT like drinking sea water! 5 grams of salt dissolved in a liter of water is quite pleasant.

Question from first timer
(Full Metal KETO AF) #3

Hi Idunno, I think it depends a lot on the reason and context that you’re drinking fatty coffee. For instance, if you are doing IF and drinking that coffee during your not eating window ghee, or MCT oil would be superior for keeping insulin low during your window. And protein or carbohydrate interferes with that low insulin state.

If you’re drinking that coffee with food or haven’t advanced to beyond three meals a day yet HWC is fine if you enjoy that. It’s all personal experience on keto finding what works for you. I used cream for the first 10 months and just last week decided to cut it and drink black coffee again. It stimulated further weight loss.

I don’t drink salt water, never have. I use plenty of salt cooking to keep me straight and consume salt heavy foods like homemade sauerkraut, pickles, bacon etc.
If I get headaches or cramping I reach for a jar of salt grinder sized Himalayan Pink Salt Crystals and down 3g. like pills with a big glass of water. That fixes my up. :cowboy_hat_face:

(Katie) #4

I dumped the dairy. Many people find that any lactose sugars in dairy is a source of inflammation for them…me too…I just never knew it until I dumped all dairy and cleaned up my eating,

I put a tablespoon of butter in my coffee…also Himalayan salt (it doesn’t have a strong taste of salt plus it has lots of other trace minerals).

(Cancer Fighting Ketovore :)) #5

I don’t really want to give up my heavy cream (with MCT powder), but I need a way to keep fat up and control my protein.

(Keto life n' a little hippie ) #6

Hmm. TBH I really don’t get that pink himalayan salt. Sure it got (trace) minerals. But the amounts are so smal it probably shouldn’t matter? I mean 1 multivitamin a say should give you higher content of minerals, right? But I don’t know, I am not a chemist or a doctor or expert of any kind. But for my simple mind all the fuzz about that pink salt seems to me like snake oil as even regular sea salt or table salt might contain what you need of electrolytes and even some trace minerals. The rest of the minerals should come from the food or even the multivitamin supplement pill, or plain mineral supplement pill - and in much higer doses then in the salt.

Could be I am just, grumpy and with aged have turned into a skeptical old fart :wink:

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #7

@idunno Pink Himalayan salt is the fashionable, exotic, “the tre kool du jour”. Redmond Real Salt is better. It has more minerals and costs less.

(Susan) #8

I just looked it up, and where you can get it in Canada; and we would have to buy it online, and it is more money for us. I think it is only cheaper if you live in the States.

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #9

@Momof5 but I found a 26 oz bag at Loblaw’s City Market. So who knows?

(Susan) #10

Oh, okay, I just looked it up online and the only link I found was the one. I got a large container of the Pink Himalyan a while back, when it was suggested on the forum, and it was about $12 and I still have lots left. I just eat 2 tspns a day and 3 or more is fasting. Thanks for the info, I can try and talk my hubby into going to Loblaw’s sometime maybe… (we don’t live near any) when I run out.

Apparently Walmart has it too, but in a big bucket.

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #11

@Momof5 Thanks for reminding me. I work at Walmart so I can have it delivered to my store.

(Susan) #12

That is great =).

(Cristian Lopez) #13

Ok let me correct you for some things you misunderstood, and yes, I am well informed around nutritional science, I study it like kids my age would bing play Fortnite.


  1. Okay, so let’s talk about what is happening with a multivitamin and why it may not be the best thing for you. I’m not discounting it. I’m not saying that everyone should avoid taking a multivitamin. There are some subcategories of people that might want to take them, but I want to talk about some reality when it comes down to just popping pills. The simple thing is we have to look at this. If our bodies have the ability to take in all these minerals and all of these vitamins at once, don’t you think there would be a food out there that truly encompasses all of them?

You see, normally we have to eat different subcategories of foods to ultimately make up our nutrients. Now, if it was so easy as just popping a pill, I think that a lot more people would be really, truly healthy and if it was really possible to absorb all those vitamins and minerals at once, I think we’d have some foods that contain all those vitamins and minerals. We have to remember that we require specific enzymatic functions to truly synthesize and utilize different vitamins, minerals, and metals within the body. Each vitamin that we take in each mineral that we take in has a different process to actually being utilized and if we take them all in at once, we’re not really allowing the body to do that efficiently.
You’re much better off knowing what is going to work for you and isolating specific vitamins and specific minerals for your type, for your bio individuality. So the thing we have to look at with multivitamins and we have this constant competition going on. Okay? We have constant competition of different minerals that sometimes need to be elevated and sometimes need to be lower, but we also have way too much of specific minerals.

  1. Ok let’s talk salty!
    No not angry, I mean like salt salty.
    So your skeptical about Redmond’s real salt. Well, there’s a reason why it’s got so much hype.

The least healthy of the salt options - highly processed

Traditional table salt:
Generally obtained through salt mines/ processed to eliminate minerals with a chemical added to stop clumping. Iodized salt has iodine added, which is a trace element that we need for health, however this is found naturally in alternative salt options.

Pink Himalayan Salt:
A healthier salt option as it is mined from salt caves that are stone ground.
Benefits Include-
Trace minerals and elements remain
Provide good taste and color
May contain around 80 trace minerals and elements - some of these include iodine, magnesium, zinc, iron and potassium.
Minerals play an integral part in our health, including but not limited to:
Thyroid health
Hearth health
Bone strength
Weight management
Nervous system function
The way we eat leads many to be deficient in minerals - due to lack of soil quality and lack of quality food consumed.

Truffle Salt:
This is the healthiest option and is earthy with an almost meaty flavor.

Sea salt with pieces of black or white truffle- Sea salt contains the trace minerals and elements.

A fungi that grows underground
Mushrooms and truffles have been known to have health benefits since early civilization.
Nutrients include:
High in protein
All essential amino acids
Many essential minerals, including?
Health benefits:

  1. DAIRY!!!

Ok simply, there is one source of dairy I will ever consume in my life, ghee. Pure milk fat.

Now, the rest of the story with milk, well, I hate dairy, I hate it, milk,butter,cheese, cream. Natures baby formula. But, I will give you my most non-biased approach at it.

What this means for dairy:

  1. Antibiotics:
    a. dairy cows live in some tough conditions and consume a diet that is high in protein and low in fiber, opposite of their natural diet of grass, which is high in fiber and low in nutritional density. They are fed this way to increase production, however it makes cows sick. (2)

b. To keep cows healthy enough to produce milk, they are fed antibiotics. These antibiotics are passed on to us when we consume dairy products. This could lead to antibiotic resistance, and it is not fully understood what health problems this could pose. (2)

  1. Hormones:
    a. milk contains natural hormones and growth factors - think about it - milk is produced in mammals to create the nutrition and resources for a small mammal to grow to be large. These hormones are meant to bring an 85 lb calf to a full grown 1,500 lbs (4). In addition to these naturally occurring hormones, synthetic growth hormones are frequently used to increase the production of milk. These hormones are readily available in the dairy we drink and may affect our normal hormonal function. (3)

i. One hormone added to cow’s milk, insulin-like growth factor (IGF-1), has been implicated in increased breast and prostate cancer risk. In a study of nearly 22,000 participants for 28 years published by the Journal of Nutrition in 2013, it was found that those who consumed greater than 2.5 servings of dairy products daily had an increased risk of prostate cancer compared to those who consumed less than one half of a serving per day. (7)

Aren’t there other nutrients that you need from milk?

Every nutrient that you can obtain from milk, such as calcium, potassium, protein and fats can all be obtained from whole plant foods, such as vegetables, legumes, nuts and fruits.

It is important to reduce the causes of chronic inflammation in our diets, and the hormones in milk, whether organic, raw milk or regular milk with even more hormones added in, can lead to inflammation.

Cut dairy out of your diet for 30 days and see how you feel. It you find better digestion, increased energy and improved health, you are likely one of the majority who have an inflammatory response to dairy.

If you do decide to continue eating dairy, do so in small quantities and be sure to consume organic, raw dairy.


  1. Dairy: 6 Reasons You Should Avoid it at All Costs […]

  2. The Big Business of Dairy Farming: Big Trouble for Cows […]

  3. Health Concerns About Dairy Products […]

  4. How Much do Cows Weigh […]

  5. Milk, dietary calcium, and bone fractures in women: a 12-year prospective study. American Journal of Public Health. June 1997 […]

  6. The Dangers of Dairy […]

  7. Whole milk intake is associated with prostate cancer-specific mortality among U.S. male physicians. Journal of Nutrition. 2013. […]

Reply if you need more sources for everything I went over, also credits to my boy Thomas delauer for all this lovely info I compiled.

(Keto life n' a little hippie ) #14

Well I am not gonna tell anyone what to choose or how to eat. I am still not convinced about the pink salt. My core belief is to eat various food sources. And even from the favorite animal we can have different sources of goodies. Many people today never eat internals. I do and I’ve always liked it. Growing up each fall when animal was slaughtered there was plenty of animal blood going around so blood was added to lots of products. Like sausages, and even pancakes. In special stores I can still get those sausages, and also the sell it as a “meat loaf/pudding”. Delicious.

I also eat wild animals, and even birds. They eat the most healthy and we should eat more of that meat. And I use even the carcasses to make bone broth, often I mix in ie oxtail for collagen, richness, textures and taste.

I also eat wild fish, cod in the winter, mackerel in the summer, trout all year and salmon in the spring and summer. Great sources of protein and fat.

Then there are the greens and berries. They are also chock full of vitamins and minerals. Before keto I ate all kind of vegetables, beans and lenses. Now I only do the keto friendly ones. But even if the variety has narrowed down, I still think they are healthy and probably will give us what we need.

For a few years I’ve been struggling with vitamin D in particular. So I do regular blood work to monitor the levels as I do prescription strength D vitamins. They also check other vitamins and minerals and I never dropped in those levels. That tells me, that even with my previous bad eating pattern, all the ice cream, chocolate, pepsi cola and crap I consumed the core eating must have been pretty darn good when I kept normal levels on the rest, except B vitamins, dont remember what number it was. But I got a pill for that and I was not so depleted that I needed it a shot.

I could be wrong about this, the proof will be in the continuous blood work. If that show low levels of anything I will look into pink salt. If not I just keep on trucking.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #15

Two possible issues with dairy: (1) lactose intolerance (if you are not of Maasai or northern European descent), and a reaction or allergy to milk proteins. If these aren’t problems for you, then dairy is fine, as long as you keep track of any carbs it may contain.

People who don’t eat a lot of carbohydrate excrete sodium more readily, so we may have to work a bit to keep our salt intake up. The sweet spot for maximal health is 10-15 g/day of sodium chloride, which helps regulate potassium, magnesium, and calcium, so supplements are generally not needed. If you are eating real, as opposed to processed, food you are not likely to need supplements. Generally speaking, anyway.

(Allie) #16

Make it however you want to. Mine is currently salted and with ghee & coconut oil only, but that’s because I’m on a dairy free month, normally I add a splash of hwc.

(mole person) #17

There is no reason for you to worry about dairy at this stage of your weight loss journey. People eventually get stalled on keto. If you do it long enough it will happen to you as well. When this happens dairy is the culprit for many people and dropping it respurs their fat loss.

You have to keep in mind that the reason we drop carbs to <20 grams is to influence our insulin. But carbs are not the only thing that cause insulin to rise and so sometimes you have to look beyond the carb count. Dairy proteins are uniquely insulinogenic. As a result they can stall losses while still being inside the carb count.

But… There is NO reason to worry about this if you are happy with your rate of fat loss. Right now you are doing great. No need to change a single thing.

Ps. I agree with you completely about the pink salt.

(LS Conway) #18

Love Thomas D!!

(B Creighton) #19

Ghee is used in cooking really only because it enables cooking at higher temperatures than 350F. Otherwise, there is nothing to recommend it. Actually, on the contrary. Its high temperature processing tends to greatly oxidize its cholesterol. Butter is much safer. Indians have a higher rate of CVD than the rest of the world despite having more vegetarians than the rest of the world… they also eat a lot more ghee than the rest of the world. I would steer clear of ghee, and ignore its hype.