Jimmy Moore goes carnivore, eats much higher protein

(Karim Wassef) #61

no animal died … not really carni … something has to die I think.

(Todd Allen) #62

Richard, thanks for the post. It supports my speculation about my own experiments with protein. I have a genetic neuro-muscular wasting disease, SBMA, with roughly 50 kg lean mass. I’ve found roughly 100 g/day protein to be my sweet spot allowing for modest increase in lean mass while fat mass stays fairly stable. I trialed 3 months adding roughly 50g/day of whey protein while keeping the rest of my diet roughly the same. I gained weight fairly fast, about 5 kg over 3 months, roughly double what one might expect for the increase in calories. I was pretty excited as by tape measure and skin fold calipers I thought I was building muscle fast and figured the rapid weight gain was added water/glycogen along with the muscle. But dexa showed the gain was half fat and much of it appeared to be intramuscular fat which I suspect is a significant problem with my disease.

I didn’t measure insulin during this time but in hindsight I’m guessing it went pretty high. Curiously over those 3 months many symptoms I experienced when pre-diabetic such as crazy high urination, disrupted sleep and night sweats came back with a vengeance despite just a modest increase in my fasting blood glucose of roughly 10 mg/dl, perhaps they are more driven by hyperinsulinemia than by blood glucose. I speculate that high insulin by day was increasing fat storage and then around 4 AM insulin would fall low enough, maybe as cortisol cranked up, and I would rapidly go from cold to overheated as some fat burning kicked back in keeping me from accumulating noticeable subcutaneous fat but not of much help for sleeping muscles.

(Chris) #63

Milking cows doesn’t cause the cow to die…

(Karim Wassef) #64

Exactly - not strictly carnivore.

(Chris) #65

Sure, but by who’s definition? I mean we can hem and haw over what’s allowed, but I don’t see how that’s going to get anyone anywhere, and I’m certainly not some authority figure that wants to tell other people what is and isn’t allowed on their diet. I simply don’t care what other people eat. I care about information.

But if you really want to get into ancestral diets, dairy and blood were major drinks for those tribes that subsisted primarily on large animals.

(Karim Wassef) #66

Carnivore … English dictionary :smiley:

An animal that eats flesh

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/carnivore

I’m just playing by the way - don’t take it seriously :flushed: :smiley:

(Chris) #67

Notice how it doesn’t say “eats only flesh” in that definition, convenient how Big Dictionary controls how we define words!

(Karim Wassef) #68

That’s really interesting! We’re you lifting at that time? Weights, cardio, HIIT?

(Banting & Yudkin & Atkins & Eadeses & Cordain & Taubes & Volek & Naiman & Bikman ) #69

Depends how much sour cream he’s adding to that ribeye, I guess. :wink:

(Todd Allen) #70

Yes, I was doing about 20 minutes of calisthenics most mornings and about 20-30 minutes of weight training every other afternoon or 30-60 minutes of brisk walking, bicycling or swimming on days I wasn’t lifting.

Since then I’ve gradually shifted with improving results to doing more calisthenics and weight training and much less cardio, just once every couple weeks though I get 30 minutes of high heart rate from a nightly very hot bath, and I break the calisthenics and weight training into brief sessions averaging about 5 minutes, spread throughout the day for about 45 min/day total trying to maximize intensity.

(Running from stupidity) #71

Couldn’t agree more (except for the trying to be a better person bit), even if he was a “typical” N=1, which he’s clearly not.

However, this is a great thread, so that’s a plus :slight_smile:

And last week it was Big Bun as well!

We have to remain on guard, always. #VIGILANCEBROTHERS

(Doug) #72

Somewhat, but if one eats flesh and plant food, then one’s an “omnivore,” so I think with carnivore it’s understood that animal matter is the deal.

(Chris) #73

Yeah, that was me subtly pointing out that the dictionary definition is shite. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

(Running from stupidity) #74

Ahh. I see.

You thought that was subtle.

:slight_smile:

(Alex) #75

speaking of animal matter… :rofl:

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(Chris) #76

I :heart: ruminants. That’s a handsome cow right there.

(The amazing autoimmune 🦄) #77

I was listening to the low carb md podcast where they interviewed a keto dietician who said that she recommends higher protein for post menopausal woman because they need the extra meat due to absorption issues,bone and muscle health.

She also stated that in her experience with her patients that women and sometimes men of this age group don’t lose very easily on the traditional keto percentages so she adds in more protein and reduces the fat and they lose more weight. I believe her name was Jill Klein?, don’t remember her last name. But they only have 10 podcasts so easy to find if you are interested.

(Chris) #78

I just heard a similar one recently, can’t recall which podcast but I’ll dig it up. It was Dr. Gabrielle Lyon.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #79

It’s the ratio recommended by Ted Naiman for protein leveraging. It can be achieved by eating equal weights of protein and fat (since the percentages are calculated from total calories).

Why was he eating nuts on a carnivore diet?

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #80

Not according to Prof. Bikman, who feels we need even more protein as we age.

Personally, I would be surprised. I have watched Dr. Rosedale’s lectures on the topic, and I am more convinced by Prof. Bikman. The insulin/glucagon ratio seems to be relevant in the context.

And the ketogenic diet provides the same benefits as Longo’s FMD.

By the same kind of logic, one would assume that eating fat makes one fat.

Why ever not? :grin::grin::grin: