I'm having problems again... Help

(David Epstein) #1

Hello folks… I was diagnosed type 2 three years ago and told to take metformin. It was a big low in my life for me. Yet another tablet to take for the rest of my life. I was 59 years old and just recovered from a 3 x CABG. I was also told that I’m obese… I was, still/am on 3 hypertension meds and statins. So I wondered if I could do something about it. The diabetic nurse said lose weight. So I found out about this thing called KETO, and went straight into it blindly… Within three months I was not a type 2 and did not need metformin anymore; however I’ve been told they will never take me off the diabetic register. I’m what you call a “Type 2 diabetic in remission”, so I get free eye scans and my feet checked every year. I also have arthritis, uveitis, some auto-immune problem and get fatigue often. This screams out Insulin Resistance, so I was hoping the KETO diet will help pass these afflictions and get me sorted. Sadly just under a year into this way of eating things in my body started to go weird. I had lost 3 stone, but felt tired in the afternoon and never felt alive as so many people on KETO say. As I have hypertension I was very wary of taking electrolytes. I ate a lot of kale, avocados, meat, Himalayan salt etc, so I did not feel that electrolytes where missing from my diet. My hypertension stayed stable but never changed as so many people on KETO say that they do not need so many meds for high blood pressure anymore. I started weeing a lot at night (disturbed sleep) and got bad lower back ache, however the arthritis in my shoulder had nearly gone. So at that point in my life I decided to eat normally.

This was a mistake even though my interrupted sleep had stopped and the pain in my back had gone. Unfortunately within 4 months I’d put a stone back on and my arthritis came back with a vengeance. So I was worried I’d end up as T2 again. This time round I a purchased a KetoMojo and jumped back into the Keto diet armed with keto electrolytes. By day 20 things seemed to be fine I was experimenting with different amount of salt and how it was affecting my blood pressure and how these electrolytes where affecting my wellbeing. By 30 days I was not happy at all with the results. I felt I had taken some very cheap speed , I was literally buzzing and seeing red spots at night in the dark (quite scary) . So I stopped taking the extra salt and the electrolytes. I waited a good week before I made a big pot of beef curry with tons of kale and spinach with loads of beef bullion, (it was very Keto), there was enough for a week. By this time I’d been on the keto diet 30 days and slowly going into becoming fat adapted, the ketomojo meter showed me I was between .5 and 1.5 for the past 3 weeks. So I started to live on this curry and felt fine, until my blood pressure went ballistic. Last Thursday 16th April my BP went into hypertension stage 3, 201/111. I got quite scared and after a few days of it sometimes going down to 157/97 I decided to go to A&E. Weather I did the right thing I don’t know as there this Covid thing around. Anyway they gave me extra meds which only bought my BP down slightly. I spoke to my GP the next day. He just said carry on with the extra meds. But I knew it was not going to work. One extra tablet will not bring ones BP down that far. So last night my BP went 200/110 and at that point (it was 1:30am) I wondered what would happen if I ate some carbs. I rummaged around and found an old jar with lentils in it so I made a small Dhal, ate 100 grams of it and to my horror, surprise, quite pleased within half an hour my blood pressure dropped to my normal of 144/84. WTF is that all about then??? I’m now not in Keto and I’m quite scared to go back into it… I can’t find anything on the Keto diet causing such a rise in blood pressure. On the ketogenic forum there are loads of post on BP going slightly high but not dangerously high as my readings. There is nowhere for me to go or ask. I think it’s got something to do with insulin resistance, but how do I control this problem?

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #2


I have no idea why eating carbs should lower your BP. It honestly doesn’t make much sense. I hope you have had your kidneys examined? But I also know that high BP can be due to emotional things. So I was wondering if maybe you harbour some sort of inner resistance to eating keto? I say this because I had high bloodpressure too. It went down not by losing weight but by coming to terms with the fact that my own parents were always envious and did not want me to have things. I know it sounds strange, but I found myself in the situation of when I inherited from them, and bought myself something from this money, I would internally beat myself up and feel guilty for enjoying the luxuries I bought because I had internalised their behaviours. Like I got a little vacation pad on the med and I had all sorts of symptoms just buying a sofa at IKEA for it. Like I had terrible back pains all the way to the store. And somehow - well therapy helped- I overcame this internal conflict and could finally allow myself to enjoy these things as my parents would not let me. I could finally enjoy my blessings and not beat myself up about it- is what I am trying to say. And the weirdest thing about this newly found freedom, is that my blood pressure sank and I halved my BP meds because it was TOO low and I began to feel dizzy because of this.
Later I started keto and basically I dont need BP meds at all anymore.Last time I measured at the doctors office I had 120/80. My doctor told me I dont need those meds anymore. But I was too afraid to stop them altogether maybe because I know how psychological it can be, so I still take a little BP meds, “just in case”. If I can lose another 20 - 30 lbs, I might stop altogether then. So basically losing the weight should be a sure fire way to lower BP. It does not make sense for it to rise because of keto or because of losing weight.
So all I can tell you is that BP issues can be very very emotional - and this is subconscious. Its like what we cannot verbalise and get out into the open affects our body instead.

(Bunny) #4

Take home message: The real problem is sodium and potassium imbalance; too much of one will lower the other and bam your blood pressure goes crazy?

Keto and Blood Pressure

CORRECTION: At the end, it should be “INCREASE” potassium…


[1] How does potassium supplementation lower blood pressure?

[2] Role of Potassium in Regulating Blood Flow and Blood Pressure


[4] Joint Association of Low Vitamin D and Vitamin K Status With Blood Pressure and Hypertension

[5] Proper Calcium Use: Vitamin K2 as a Promoter of Bone and Cardiovascular Health

[6] Vitamin K2 decreases arterial stiffness (cleans arteries) – RCT Feb 2015

Still on keto...but is my BP too low?
(David Epstein) #5

Well thank you very much for an explanation that makes sense. For me to be able to work out my sodium/potassium imbalance I would need to be under a doctor who could do the proper blood tests and change my meds accordingly. Unfortunately I take 100mg of Losartan potassium (which I believe controls potassium). I also take 100mg of Lercanidipine hydrochloride, (which I believe controls calcium). Beside taking 2.5mg of Bisoprolol Fumarate and the most dreaded drug on the planet 20 mg simvastatin. I live in the UK and I’m reliant on the NHS, there is no Keto doctor/clinic. I also can not afford a private practice.
I would not have a clue in working out how to balance these two minerals. But thanks for the science it now makes more sense, and I know that I do not have any other serious underlying medical condition. A close friend suggested I might be going hypoglycemic (which could cause very high BP).


then all carnivores should have too little potassium and too high blood pressure- which they dont. And most on keto lower their BP. So for me this argument would only hold water if this actually happened. At least in most of us doing keto this is not the case.
In the end Eppy- you actually sound totally overmedicated. Maybe you do have an electrolyte imbalance- bt that might be exogenic with all the products you are taking. Measuring electrolytes in your blood is a little thing. Take a 4th test tube of blood and measure with the machine. your doctor can do it and the results are quick. Simples.

(Kirk Wolak) #7

What if it were Oxalates or other plant compounds?
I had to go full on carnivore, but when I did, my edema went away!

So, I have to ask, do you have pitting edema (usually tested against your shin, near your ankle. Pressing hard enough for your fingernail to go white, for 30 seconds, pull it away, do you see a big dent, does it take 10+ seconds to go away completely? If so, you have edema (inflammation)).

Now, inflammation will drive your blood pressure. Want to know how to lower it? FASTING.
But YOU must be careful if you are taking all of those meds.

You know what lowers your BP even more? Moderate exercise (like walking 2-5 miles). Walking 28 miles while fasting, I had to take CAFFEINE to keep my BP from plummeting! Be careful. I had High BP, and still struggle with it on non-fasting days. I only take meds if it is OUT OF SIGHT high (160/100) or higher (that’s EITHER number).

I found SALT makes LITTLE difference. But so did a shit ton of potassium.

Fasting made the most difference when I was NOT SEDENTARY.

Now, I find out that PORK is inflammatory to me. And I eat Bacon or pork of some kind ALMOST every day. When I cut it out, my BP drops, but it takes days to weeks… And is the HARDEST thing for me to do, since ME LOVES MY BACON!

Also, the Curry… If you are lectin sensitive… this could be bad… Does your nose run? Are you sinuses plugged? (Do you feel the urge to turn sides at night to open the side that was closest to the pillow?). That’s all inflammation… And worth figuring out!