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(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #13

This is a plausible hypothesis on the surface, but I think the reality is more complicated. There are documented cases of people who ate enormous caloric loads on a low-carbohydrate, high-fat ketogenic diet and still lost fat. We are talking 3000-5000 calories a day, here.

On the other hand, a DuPont executive who lost a goodly amount of fat on a low-carb, high-fat diet in the 1960’s was written up in a case study, where it was mentioned that a single extra apple would cause him to put on weight.

Moreover, and for what it’s worth, one study I read demonstrated, by using radio-labeled foods, that it was the dietary carbohydrate that got converted into fat and stored, whereas dietary fat got metabolised.

(squirrel-kissing paper tamer) #14

I also hate exercise. I’ve written posts about it. But unfortunately this body doesn’t care about my feelings. I also have a physical job and quite honestly I find it unfair that I ALSO have to work out when my feet are sore and my back is tired after a long day of work. That being said, I understand my heart rate didn’t go up or stay up. So for me, sit ups and walking on the treadmill is all I’m willing to do and it helps tremendously. Best wishes.

(Gregory - You can teach an old dog new tricks.) #15

Your comments are well taken… I think I may have oversimplified my suggestion which as you say sounds plausible.

I also agree it is certainly more complicated than that, and as variable as there are people.

However, I think people can sometimes be misled about the amount of fat they can eat when “ketoing” to lose weight.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #16

You’re right about that. No one should be choking down fat past the point where their hunger is satisfied. It’s not an “all you can eat” diet but and “eat what your body tells you to” diet. But I do think we worry more about calories than is necessary. As Prof. Bikman points out, the human metabolism is variable, and the body has ways of wasting energy when it wants to do so.

#17

Sounds like you gained some metabolic flexibility and was just burning through them. 50-80 is still very low carb when you remove the keto word from the equation.

You job is just your job, your body is adapted to it and it’s not working for you in place of a workout. If being in Ketosis makes you physically sick, don’t do it, plain and simple. I’d argue your diet log would explain why that’s happening but at any rate dont’ do it if you don’t enjoy it. It doesn’t take Ketosis to loose weight. But never working out isn’t good either, it’s healthy. It good for your body and metabolism. Do you track what you eat?

I’d much rather sleep in on weekends than be in the gym at 6am, I’d also rather go straight home after a long day at work rather than go in, even if it’s to sit on the couch or pass out. But I also like having muscle and being healthy and never want to be obese again. So what I want doesn’t really matter. I need to pick what I want more, my goal, or whats easy/fun. I used to constant choose the easy/fun. I lost over a decade of my life to obesity thanks to it.

Seems to me the EASY thing is to start cranking everything down and do what you gotta do, if you’ve been trying to loose 20lbs for years, you’re doing it wrong. Don’t forget the definition of insanity!

Good Luck!, you’ll do it!

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #18

@MG1


You may also find this of interest:

#19

For me, the feelings you describe are usually an electrolyte problem. I just take an extra dose of my potassium pills (I’ve needed to supplement potassium for decades) and have some egg drop soup with some sea salt added.

(Mg ) #20

I am 22 years clean. I had hepatitis c for around 25 years… I cleared it totally two years ago. Officially cured. You may have a valid point here.
Never even thought of that.
They say it takes about two years after you’re cured to actually have the liver up and running correctly.
I wasn’t sick at all with my hepatitis because the doctors believe getting it, and actually getting clean around the same time without even realizing it…, probably saved my liver tons of damage.
When I get into ketosis if I don’t get sick then your point is more valid that you may think.
Thank you so’ much!

(Mg ) #21

So then what do I do? I get your point but what should I do? I was going to start to push into ketosis last night and got so worried I’d get sick this morning. I have to watch my grand baby.
I can’t drop a pound above 21-25 carbs. That’s when my own body gets into ketosis.
I tried to drop this extra fat at 30. Won’t budge.
My PCP can’t really help because he is totally unfamiliar with ketosis and the lifestyle. He grasps it, but admits it’s not his speciality.
I tried locating a doctor who is and it is difficult. They send you to a nutritionist, who in turn isn’t a doctor.
My doctor did say he believes my body is comfortable and healthy at this weight which is why this machine won’t budge
Something about the body not willing to work with you if it’s healthy and strong at the weight you’re at???
He also said the body holds on to excess weight for survival in famine etc…
I plateaued. And it’s not moving from this weight.
Example :
Dropped down in last ten days from 50-80
Carbs to easily 27-30 (so I don’t get sick)
NOT A HALF A POUND came off! Not a half a pound. 11th day at that count. Not one stinking pound.
How is that even possible?
Bottom line if I wanna do this I gotta risk perhaps feeling sick because above ketosis without exercise, I’m done. Nothing will move me below that 20 pounds.

People say you live on 30 carbs a day? I’m like yes… Their like and you can’t lose weight???
Nope! People unfamiliar with keto can’t grasp that. I can’t either.
Shrug

Thanks for replying back

(Mg ) #22

I read that before but never implemented it because I was just so sick I had to stop.
Someone said salt too? Like… Salt??? I read that somewhere as well.
So is what you’re saying is you too were sick in full ketosis with similar side effects and took the potassium? Did it help? How long did it take for you to feel better?
Did you stop ketosis start the pills and then go back into ketosis?
Thank you so much.
What about this salt thing? Ever hear of that?

(Mg ) #23

Robin… I’m 22 years out of heroine addiction. You have a valid point! Hugely valid.
I am a addictive behavior kinda girl! No question. I’ve pivotted it in the right direction however still in therapy to this day to keep a grip. It is obsession. It’s not for vanity, or for even health… It’s tough to admit but yeah I think it’s beating me and I wanna kill that last 20. You absolutely see me. It’s true

(Mg ) #24

You said salt!!! I did deep research for specifics. So hard to find a good doctor who has a specialty in ketosis.
I would cross reference, go back, take note, cross reference etc etc…,
Based on my own blood panels which I am blessed to be able to get via my doc. Whenever I request it…
Based on my own body specific numbers and side effects… I’m concluding,., it very well could be the salt factor for me.
Weird before I read your comment, I just said this to someone who responded to me on here.
Ok,
So any quick advise? I wanted to start to get into ketosis yesterday on my one and only feeding.
Chickened out, I have my grand baby today.
What’d you think? How do you think I should begin implementation?
Thank you so’ much

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #25

Several folks have mentioned salt, so does Ekberg in the videos I linked for you. Salt is necessary to maintain electrolyte balance, but maybe not enough by itself. Ekberg also mentions the importance of micro nutrients. My recommendation for both is to use either Redmond’s Real Salt and/or Himalayan pink salt. Both salts are packed with micro nutrient minerals.

#26

But why would someone lose fat at 30g carbs or 10 or 3? it’s not about carbs…
It’s all about calories for me. Of course I never lose fat on keto if I eat much. it’s very complex and not exactly like this for everyone but you really can’t expect fat-loss JUST because you eat few carbs or eat once a day or whatever.

People in famines, in the other hand, well they always slim down as they must use up their bodies. Starving is still bad for metabolism but if you don’t eat, you inevitably lose fat (and muscle) in the end, there is no other way. Even if you eat 100g sugar a day. Energy is a serious thing.
There are unfortunate folks whose body acts like there is famine even if they just eat a little below their energy need. We normal ones simply lose fat without problems (if eating little isn’t considered a problematic thing to do). And there are the ones with bad metabolism and I don’t know what that means exactly but it’s not easy to lose fat on ketosis for everyone.
And there are the magical ones whose bodies waste energy (okay, mine does that too but only if I overeat, it can’t help me losing any fat).

And indeed, when we are normal just a bit chubby, it easily can happen that our body stops cooperating with us, it’s common.

Keto isn’t a miracle fat-loss diet… Ketosis alone isn’t enough for fat-loss at all, it never was for me and I was somewhat careful with my food intake especially regarding added fat.
But I had problematic items I got out and it helped tremendously.
I probably wrote it a few times in this thread… As I am a big believer of the right food choices. And right timing may be important but mostly the food choices.

Electrolytes are important. Some of us just eat our food and all is well, others need supplement some of them.

(Gregory - You can teach an old dog new tricks.) #27

I think everyone that can, has shared some ideas with you.
You have told us a lot about what didn’t work, so it’s time to try something else…

Did you look at the videos amwassil posted?
It looks like Dr, Ekberg has some more interesting topics out there.
Have you looked at any of the fasting information from Dr. Jason Fung?

#28

As for electrolytes, this may help:

https://www.reddit.com/r/keto/wiki/faq#wiki_what_is_.201Cketo_flu.201D_and_how_long_will_i_have_it.3F

(Robin) #29

I love when we meet others who understand our path, our fears, obsessions, addictions, demons… whatever. Just keep plugging away, kiddo!

(Robin) #30

BTW… I too am an addict of booze and cigarettes. I’ve been clean for maybe 5 or 6 years. (can’t believe I don’t know!) I have always said that if I get a terminal diagnosis and have 6 months left, you will find me chain smoking and drunk. I probably don’t really mean that. But I can fantasize.

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #31

@MG1 There’s a lot of very good stuff in this video:

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #32

@MG1 I just posted a video as another topic here. The comment at 17:46 of the video made me think of your trials and tribulations:

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Screen Shot 2021-02-27 at 9.39.41 PM.jpg1246×699 230 KB

There’s a whole lot in that video you will likely find helpful.