Ilana's beef binge buster thread

(mole person) #101

@David_Stilley Evil, evil, evil!!!

(mole person) #102

Without a mechanism of any sort I wouldn’t hang my hopes on elevated blood glucose being any more healthy in a person on a ketogenic diet. High blood glucose is toxic. A higher fasting glucose due to glucose sparing isn’t really a higher blood glucose as HbA1c tests show but I’ve heard several keto clinicians say now that they see symptoms of rising insulin resistance and symptoms of metabolic syndrome in some of their patients who go the high protein route. I wouldn’t be concerned, however, as long as your HbA1c continues to be good or improve.

People keep saying this but ignore the fact that one of the major demands for gluconeogenesis comes from consumption of protein.

Protein consumption leads to insulin secretion to build proteins out of amino acids. This insulin secretion, however, also removes blood glucose and fatty acids from the blood. The body has a concurrent glucagon response to protein consumption which stimulates gluconeogenesis. Protein consumption always stimulates glucagon and it’s actually moreso on a ketogenic diet (Ben Bikman himself makes this very point). So yes, gluconeogenesis is demand driven, but protein consumption is a major driver of that demand.

(mole person) #103

Woooooo hoooo! 104.0 on the dot. 7.2 pounds in 14 days without any fasting. That was easy too. It makes me wonder where my body would go if I kept it up.

That’s an experiment for another time however. I’m going on my trip tomorrow (pushed back a day due to high winds on a day we’d planed a crossing of a big lake) and the food I’ve packed is more keto. A bit of cheese, tomato and onions in some sauce bases, and nuts and seeds. Also, single malt scotch. I never have it at home anymore, but for me, a late afternoon drink is just something I adore while camping.

I’ll do a final weigh in tomorrow morning before I go.

(Susan) #104

Yay!!! Congrats Ilana Rose! Have an awesome camping trip.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #105

There is a certain amount of glucose that happens as a result of breaking down fatty acids and protein I thought, and I understood this as being normal and within the scope of healthy eating. It isn’t the same thing as eating exogenous sugars and jacking BG levels that way. That morning spike of glucose and adrenaline is completely a normal part of a working metabolism. We can’t affect that even if all we eat is meat. It’s part of normal circadian rhythms. It’s meant to get us up and going so we don’t start the day sluggish until we eat. I suppose overeating could cause storage as fat but I am nowhere near that eating up to a pound of meat on my heaviest days lately.

Rose, where you suggesting that eggs are evil or the ice cream and honey? :joy::joy::grin::cowboy_hat_face:

(Liz) #106

Congrats and have a great trip!

Just got to thank you for your info on how you cook your beef, tried it today and ate the best beef short rib ever! I will follow this method from here on in…so juicy and fatty, just with some salt delicious :+1::grin:

(mole person) #107

Yay! I’m so glad someone else is enjoying it.

It was a revelation how good it is. I started doing it after I began sous viding. I noticed the fat stayed on if I sous vided at low temps (130 F ish). I think the first time I did it in the oven it was because my sous vide was already in use. I was shocked to find superior results with a fraction of the cooking time. Basically the juices stay in and that’s a massive improvement. The meat is just as tender, rare, and fatty as from sous vide cooking but much more flavourful and juicy as a result of the oven slow cook.

Short ribs cooked this way are amazing. It’s one of the few cuts that I don’t add extra beef fat to.

Now that I see others might try this I should make a correction. The chuck roast I did above was still way too tough at 6 hrs and even 8 hrs. I’ve gone back to using sous vide for 48 hours for this cut. Eventually I’ll try 10 hrs in the oven and see how that goes. If that doesn’t fly I’ll stick with sous vide for this cut.

(mole person) #108

Yes, this is what I was saying. Also that glucose sparing (or physiological insulin resistance) can result in higher fasting blood glucose in the keto adapted.

But this doesn’t mean that a very high protein diet doesn’t negatively affect blood glucose levels. If you see your fasting glucose trending the wrong way and your HbA1c doing the same while on a ketogenic diet that high protein is a very likely suspect.

Basically what my above post was saying is that this idea people have here that high protein doesn’t impact on gluconeogenesis because gluconeogenesis is demand driven is a red herring. Yes gluconeogenesis is demand driven but the main driver of gluconeogenesis is glucagon which goes up with protein consumption. The more protein you eat the more insulin is pushing glucose and fatty acids back into your cells and glucagon is making more glucose to top up your blood levels. This is why levels of ketosis drop with high protein also. The cells are getting plenty of glucose.

Correct. It’s a different mechanism. When you eat sugar and carbohydrates it affects you blood sugar levels directly. So you can see it easily if you test after a meal, for example. When you eat a lot of protein your pancreas secretes both insulin and glucagon. Insulin is pushing existing glucose out of the blood and into your cells and glucagon is making more glucose to top up your blood glucose. So in spite of all of this extra glucose it does not show as increased blood glucose in people with functioning pancreas’.

You!!! I was saying you were evil for trying to tempt me with ice cream and honey just when I’m finally back on track.

Evil!!! :smiling_imp:

(Full Metal KETO AF) #109

Sorry, didn’t mean to temp you, I thought you had kicked that stuff to the curb and stomped on it till it was dead. I just meant have some eggs if you want! Did you have any? I guess you’re leaving on your trip, have a great time. :cowboy_hat_face:

(mole person) #110

I did have some eggs, bacon too, and I enjoyed them immensely. But then I made a mistake. I made a small bit of almond flour mixed with coconut oil. It wasn’t a lot and I thought I’d be fine but I woke up feeling every bit as awful as if I’d had ice cream. So the trip is put off at least another day as I feel sick and all my pain conditions are troubling me. It sucks; but I just can’t have any of that stuff. It’s garbage for me.

(mole person) #111

In more interesting news I was 103.6 pounds this morning. My lowest ever.

After last night’s idiocy I’ve decided to go back to all beef after the trip for a proper attempt at a true elimination diet again, this time without any coffee. That way I can find out finally what I can and cannot eat as I do careful reintroductions.

It’ll be interesting, however, to see, in the initial elimination phase, how far this weight loss goes as I continue all beef.

(Susan) #112

Awesome, Ilana =). Have a really great trip.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #113

Wow, tough break on that almond flour thing. Or might it be coconut oil? Anyway bummer you had to delay the trip. I hope you feel better quick.

A f-ing gopher is killing all of my garden from underground. Last night my Thai Dragon Chili :hot_pepper: plant. Maybe he’s actually my friend pushing me towards Carnivore by killing all my “edible” plants! :joy::joy::joy:


(Katie) #114

Is your bodyfat percentage perhaps too low causing you have the urge to obtain carbohydrate calories?

(mole person) #115

I don’t think so but I do mean to check it the next time I’m able too. It seems to me that I’ve still got a fair bit of womanly fat. I’m not that lean looking.

(Edith) #116

You look pretty lean in your profile picture. :slightly_smiling_face:

(Alissa McApple) #117

I have totally experienced this same thing! McDonald’s sundae for my birthday and BAM! That same night I had major tooth pain!

(mole person) #118

I just got back from 4 days with my family where I ate really badly. I’m quite ill right now as inflammation gives me terrible cold symptoms. My weight is back at 108.4 lbs which isn’t too bad. I’m going to start the protocol again and continue until my weight is back to 104.0 lbs, I’m back in deep ketosis, I feel 100% again, and my mood and energy levels are back on track. So far everything is pretty messed up. I really have to stop this self destructive behavior.

The only positive is that I do think I’m getting more resistant to migraines. This amount of cheating would have resulted in them in the past and I really had nothing.

This time around I’m not having any cream in my coffee and only one coffee a day.

Back to beef, beef fat, salt and healing.

(Susan) #119

Awww =( I am sorry that you keep having this happen. Do you think there will come a time when you can just not go off when you are with them and tell them you get too sick and don’t want to go through this?

(mole person) #120

I really hope so. It’s not their fault either. It’s entirely me. They actually try very hard to accommodate my needs. I just go off the rails when I know there are things that I like in the fridge and cupboards. My brain just goes into hardcore excuse making and rationalizing.