The strict ZC philosophy is not to limit food at all. Some eat 4 lbs of meat in a day! The line of reasoning is that your body needs all the nutrients and energy. So don’t worry about “overeating.”
Wow! Just found an interview with Dr Toth:
How can one be eating so much protein on a ketogenic diet? I thought the idea was to eat “moderate” protein based on lean body weight. Dr. Ron Rosedale suggests protein levels even less than the Dudes for optimal health and longevity. I believe protein can increase insulin through gluconeogenisis if too much is consumed.
Does anyone else agree that an meat diet still needs to be “moderate” with more fat consumed to satiety?
Well yes you want to eat fatty meat but when your carbs are nearly zero and you’re not taking in unnatural substances, your body isn’t having to process those.
This blog post and the links in the post to previous articles by Amber and Zooko should answer your questions:
The point being that yes, it has to be moderate, but it should be, naturally. ZC/Carnivore is a mostly fat diet, if you are eating fatty meat, or compensating for lean choices with tallow, lard, or butter.
Other things to consider:
- Carbs are more insulinogenic than protein is. So if you are suddenly going from 20g carbs to none, you can probably eat some 30 or 40 grams more of protein for the same net effect. (Edited to add: that’s nearly half a pound of steak!)
- Depth of ketosis is not the be all and end all of a ketogenic diet. Except in very specific medical situations, if you’re mildly ketogenic, there is probably little benefit to being more ketogenic.
- Unless you are diabetic, you can probably stay in ketosis with more protein than you think.
Yes, like Amber said, protein only prevents ketosis in those who are diabetic or severely metabolically challenged. Plus, fatty acids are still the primary fuel source, and ketones secondary. Eating carnivorously naturally produces at least 60% fat in the diet, if not 80%.
So, 4 days without any sweetener (Coke Zero was my caffeine addiction). The ‘Hunter’ diet is easy, as I’ve been mostly doing zc since November.
My stomach is sooo bloated! Is there any way this could relate to the Coke Zero?
I seriously look preggers. I’m not wanting to even look anyone in the eye I’m so disgusted with my gut.
Edit: I did a bunch of Google ‘research’, found out that ditching the caffeine can cause temp water retention, bloating even. Lots of my ‘symptoms’ related well.
When I first began ZC my belly went flat, so looking forward to this resolving soon.
Turns out that I ‘accidentally’ consumed more carbs from the meat sources I used the last two days to eat to hunger. I had looked at the tiny 0.2 per serve, that ratcheted up with the amount I had, oops, live and learn. I certainly recognised an increase in cravings more easily afterwards, and did eat a blob of cheese, but interestingly, this faded fast. I wonder if this is because it was animal based…
Six days for me now. I tested my blood glucose after I woke and it was 8.3. I am so upset. Seriously. Is this way of eating really beneficial for t2d. On the upside,I love this! I am a carnivore no doubting that. I have energy, again, I feel good, sleep good, it’s just the glucose has me worried.
I’ve heard that the more insulin resistant you are, the more your body retains water when you eat carbs. I’m just starting day 4 & I’m down almost 7 pounds in water weight. Another reason not to go back to carbs - instant weight gain!
The only (possible) negitive effect I’ve had is sleepiness. Hopefully, going to bed a little earlier last night will help.
Were you already keto before ZC? Did you greatly increase your protein in the last 6 days? You can go ZC without really being high protein too.
I’m also assuming that you were getting lower bg prior to the last 6 days?
Yes my bg was between 5.6 and 6.4. I had been on keto for over a month, more like 6 weeks, before ZC. I IF 20/4 when it was just keto, and was doing great. I AM doing great with ZC, I love it, it feels good, energy, body feels so good, and just the freeing and less stress of what to eat makes me feel happy. I am just wonder will this all level out over time,kind of like the adaption with keto.
How is it 1 and 2 hours after eating? Had you checked those in the past?
Being the morning fasting reading always makes me think dawn phenomenon and even a little cold can create a bg issue for a bit. Any chance you may be getting some sniffles or anything?
Dawn phenomenon- for high reading in the am
Someone suggested this (Dawn Phenomenon) to me also and recommended testing two hours after waking. A good idea except I seem to forget and have my coffee first. Grrrr!
With a little digging into Dr Toth’s blog, I found a very detailed account of a Crohn’s patient who used her experience with the condition and the paleo-keto diet as taught by Dr Toth to earn her college graduation degree. It’s very detailed. While the “rules” allowed for 1 piece of fruit daily, honey for sweetening, small amounts of vegetables, she mostly ate meat, bacon, eggs, offal, broth and greaves (rendered fat – pork rinds?). Spoiler alert: she recovered her health. Here are the details if interested:
Again 8.3. BUT. I was reading a post on fb, just seeing what was going on,and a post caught my eye. After reading the comment it made me go back and think what DID I eat over the last 2 days,so beef, beef,jepp some more beef and,pork rinds. Helvete, that has to be it. So I have thrown the bag out and will test again in the morning. I think I have found my bad food. Thank you for helping and making me think.
Same with me. By the time I was on my 2nd coffee I finally decided to open my IPad, read this dawn phenomenon, have no idea what this is,lol,so also a good reminder to find out.