Carnivore Rocktober - ZC Carnivore 31 day challenge October 2022

MeganNZ · 2022-10-26 04:36:23 UTC

Hi FrankoBear, thanks for asking
I’ve been digging around in Marty Kendall’s Optimising Nutrition website (thanks Michael!). Went thru every micronutrients’ list of bioavailable high amount foods, picked foods I would enjoy eating and constructed a personalized food list. Low carb, really watching fat, higher % of protein. I also restarted the 2 meds I’ve been taking at night time for years to help me sleep better. I gave my body 2 months to learn to sleep ok on its own and it didn’t happen. I’m still waking a lot but over all my sleep quality and amount has improved.

Starting to feel a lot better. Pain is easing, mood is a lot more even, energy much improved.

Thanks to everyone here for the support over the past months. Wishing you all the best!

VictoriaA · 2022-10-26 08:40:09 UTC

Morning! Thanks for a nice welcome! I’m trying to find time to read all the carni threads but life is hectic and work is full on.
The beef ran out yesterday, I love beef but 10 days of just beef was probably not a great plan. I’ve defrosted a kilo of pork belly for the next 3 days which has freed up some freezer space.

I love the simplicity of carni, it fits into a busy schedule easily and I’ve not had to go shopping which saves a few hours per week. I’m assuming the weight loss will stop with time? I don’t have scales but I feel a lot smaller even though I’ve had 900mls of thick cream and a kg of mature cheddar this week.

@Naghite , do you enjoy liver please? I’m trying to as it’s full of nutrients but struggling with the texture and taste.

Have a lovely day folks!

FrankoBear · 2022-10-27 04:02:17 UTC

2.45am woke up with atrial fibrillation. Took about 6 hours to sort it out at home. I’m tired from lack of sleep. But mainly I feel like I’ve been in a boxing ring for many hours being punched in the chest. When the episodes happen, since recovering from COVID in the middle of the year, I’m knocked out for a day.

I know that many on the WoE say they don’t, or don’t need to, add salt to their food. I am happy for them. This heart beat and heart rate arrhythmia are one of the real and main side effects of a low insulin diet with lapses in salt/electrolyte control for me. It’s one of the main factors why people say eating this way is dangerous. I choose this danger compared to obesity and diabetes.

This happens when I am in the groove and hitting all the plan goals. @VirginiaEdie has often counselled me about oxalate dumping, and how that problem severely strips the body of minerals as the oxalate dumped mops up many of the positive cations, like magnesium and calcium that are so important in regulating the body’s electrical system, including the heart’s natural pacemaker cells. So, oxalate dumping is a factor high on the differential diagnosis list.

But we also know about the low insulin loss of sodium through the kidneys. Then the body responds to retain sodium by sacrificing and losing magnesium through the urine. If we are eating magnesium depleted foods, or magnesium absorption is blocked, then we end up low in magnesium. Potassium is probably in the mix as well.

Anyhow I started supplementing magnesium citrate hourly until I got loose stools and a laxative effect. I had a large mug of salty beef bone broth at 5am while listening to the pre-dawn bird chorus calling the dawning sunlight. By 8am I awoke from a short doze with a heart rate of about 60bpm. Along the way I also dosed with aspirin because there is an increased risk of stroke during an A-fib episode. During the night a had 4 full bladder wees that showed I was dumping body water.

It has been a lazy day recovering. I had bacon and eggs at about 1pm. The A-fib workout was not enough to prevent me partaking of my coffee addiction, proving it is a substance addiction. Last night’s dinner was lamb chops and halloumi cheese. Yesterday I had gone out for a few walks that I could feel in my leg muscles by dinner time.

I’ll focus on salt, supplements and bone broth to give my body things I need to correct or offset imbalances. Steak for dinner tonight.

Here are two black cockatoo tail feathers, 2 different species of large black native parrots, found in the woodlands near and around our property.

I need to find some snails. What other higher magnesium ZC food options are there? Probably marine. Back to the ol’ @Fangs favourite, surf&turf!

https://www.ketogenicforums.com/t/atrial-fibrillation-magnesium-ketogenic-eating-yoga-oxalates/36218/157?u=frankobear

Naghite · 2022-10-26 10:49:38 UTC

I did not like liver when I started. I used to overcook it and then eat a little bite with something else I liked. After a few months of doing this, I started to quite like the taste. Now I lightly cook liver and enjoy it, a little. The only food I really have a tough time with is kidney. I do not add any spices and find the urine taste in kidney to be a bit much. My wife uses spices to make kidney, and while hers tastes good, I like to avoid any herbs and spices in general.
Try dicing up the liver and cooking it with ground beef mixed together, many people find that is enough to mask the taste and get used to it.

Naghite · 2022-10-26 10:53:44 UTC

From Vitamins, Minerals in Beef Organ Meats you can see there are not many magnesium options. After 17% per ounce of snails, the next largest is 3%. I buy canned snails which gives 4 ounces per can (2 meals for me) at under 2 dollars a can. Check the cannned meat aisle in the grocery store.

Shinita · 2022-10-26 14:50:28 UTC

Hunger continues, I ate a bunch of liver before lunchtime
This 500g chicken liver won’t last over 24 hours (but without holding back, it could have been a few hours, Alvaro helped too)… I think I will fry 1000g next week. I wanted to experiment with different types of pâté, not eating the stuff up as it was It was really delicious for hungry me this time.
(Eating it every week makes me bored of it but I take some break and it’s all good again.)

I will try to get some other organs before I overeat liver regularly…

Liver is a pretty common thing here, I liked that all my life but I am actually choosy about the animal. Chicken liver is everywhere and I like it, beef is sweet but I like it, pork is way too agressive and hard but okay when cooked right (I don’t bother with that, mine isn’t good so I never buy any), turkey was horrible, rabbit is nice but its flavor is very subtle… Duck liver is the best but I only had it as a kid, I go for the cheap, easy to get options
But chicken liver has a liver taste too. Sometimes I like it, sometimes it’s too much but I always can mix it with meat, that helps. But this is for chicken liver and that has a strong liver taste, milder livers are probably easier to eat…? But only if you like them, my SO hates beef liver while I love it We both like chicken liver and kind of dislike pork liver. BUT I kind of like pork liver pâté so all the fat tissue and water and spice definitely helps.
Kind of = not my fav but nice here and there, in moderation. I easily get bored of it if I consume it often.

I don’t know a thing as overcooking. Overfrying, yes, if it’s charcoal, it’s too much. So I don’t have any problem with chicken liver cooked for 90 minutes But it’s in the oven, the pan version takes a way shorter time. I think I actually like it not fried very very very well unlike for most things…
I wouldn’t eat it after mere 10 minutes though, ew. Or raw, unimaginable. It must be well cooked but it’s fine if it didn’t get even darker brown than it was (I typically go for color changes when I fry stuff, it’s harder with liver but I do see it). Some kind of liver (no idea which) gets harder and worse when fried for long I heard and beef liver needs a super short time indeed, never tried it for longer… But chicken liver needs time. It’s tender so it can’t get hard, it will stay lovely… At least these are my views

I think I heard it smells urine when cooked. Never will buy kidney.
It’s quite fine when I buy a whole rabbit though, it’s very neutral - but boring. I definitely love liver most. And tongue but that tastes like proper meat just a bit different, “creamier”… Best stuff ever!

@VictoriaA: What is the problem with liver texture? Nice, tender stuff (except the pork one when cooked in a way that it gets quite hard), what not to like? I don’t get it and am curious! But if the texture isn’t okay for you, make a pâté (or don’t eat liver, the taste is a bigger problem I fear. liver tastes liver, I can imagine not liking it. but a little should be enough so unless it’s really disliked, it shouldn’t be so hard to eat a bite or two? it depends, of course. if you really dislike liver, all kind, it won’t be easy).

robintemplin · 2022-10-26 15:03:54 UTC

FB… I am always amazed when you work through these fib episodes at home. Did it take you first go to the hospital when they happened? Just curious how you came to understand your body so well and calmly treat at home.
I’ve been having nightly leg and foot cramps again, and sure enough I had been slacking off my regular doses of magnesium citrate with salt water before bed.
How many times do I have to learn this lesson?!
Zero heart issues for me and I want to keep it that way.
You are an inspiration.

Fangs · 2022-10-27 00:03:00 UTC

quite the wild pic. thanks for sharing and that is one massive accomplishment in that person’s life for sure…so very cool!!!

sounds to me you got busy and alot of good energy to use!

any time line to head back to TX?

@FrankoBear
so sorry on your situation but you are managing so well. finding you and your fixes to tackle this issue.

I am a super salter. Always have been. there is tons of talk ALL about how one can cut salt on zc and more. so many do just that but there are those of us who can’t. I know I can’t.

I have heart PVCs and I require sodium point blank. Iower I try to go and cut back down on salt worse I get. I tried a few times but have finally finally learned I AM doing me on salt. So my big salt intake is staying and I thrive on it so… I had it rough in my bad times with the pvc issues but since I corrected me in it all I found I also know when I am off and when I ‘need’ certain things and I correct back real fast. luckily I am cruising mostly now but my salt. never gonna leave this ol’ gal

Do you at all times as you need FB cause some of us do have extra little issues we must tackle for ourselves and do zc for ourselves for sure.

------------------today I ate a 1.1 lb. Tbone steak.
then I had a can of tuna and mayo for dinner cause I wasn’t hungry.
now it is about 8pm and oh yea I am hungry LOL
I got me some Taylor Ham, gonna say bye and close the 'puter and go fry up about 6-7 nice thick slices and go enjoy!!

zc on guys

JJFiddle · 2022-10-27 00:27:17 UTC

Yup, leaving Halloween morning, the 31st. A week from right now we’ll be sitting in our own Texas living room having finished the 3 day drive and settling back in.

@FrankoBear Yes, who said no salt? As I understand it, salt and electrolytes are key to stability in both keto and carnivore ways of eating. I never worry about getting too much salt - still have some issues with fat adaptation and salt helps balance fluids as well as minerals.

Another wall to wall day, hubby suddenly decided this morning that we needed to go over the new book of arrangements, solidify the table of contents and listen to everything he’s arranged in the past 2 months. I had planned to make dog food and cut up chicken to dehydrate for treats for Mimsy and continue closet cleaning as we are out of here in just a few days. Then a meeting online and lunch prep and our show (currently Bridgerton) which put anything more up to 4pm! I cut up chicken and put it on to dry, then luckily took a break to write music at the computer because I forgot a 5:45 lesson that’s rescheduled for the boy’s swim team schedule. If I hadn’t been at the computer I’d have missed it.

Anyway, that’s my day. I’ll have to make the dog food after walking in the morning and before the groomers appointment at 10. No work now til Saturday morning when I teach, and Saturday night when we have a long gig, our last in the DC area before packing up Sunday for the trip on Monday.
And my vote: I like liver. Used to eat it with onions and ketchup but it’s good fried on its own, turns out.
Mimsy likes it too. She would kill for it (If a 9 lb dog could kill). I dry it at 115 degrees for her.
Lunch today was 2 chicken thighs air fried, followed by a little bowl of chicken skin cracklins I air fried when I took the thighs out. Late morning I had my hard boiled egg, late afternoon 2 slices sharp cheddar, and tonight, 2 hard boiled eggs diced into mayo.

Karen18 · 2022-10-27 08:43:11 UTC

Hi yes me again lol I was regular as clockwork while still working and slacking now retired haha. Generally though I I find my time being consumed with reading more. Today is in the lounge sitting amongst my lovely thriving indoor plants… I think it won’t be long before they consume me haha. It is wet but very mild outside and we’re forecast 19° today which is high for this time of the year. Only thing with this irratic weather is the constant changing from winter to summer wear and usually over the course of the day, not from day to day!

@FrankoBear fortunately I didn’t have any flu feverish symptoms and the sleep is marginally better. A couple of nights ago, which was the worse night, according to my fitbit, I got just a miserly 6mins deep sleep out of 8hrs 22mins. Knew I was going to feel really tired by last night with being starved of deep sleep and all the coughing but could I get to sleep last night? I knew I would have problems as I had to set the alarm for a 7.30am nurse appt for my yearly long term health review! Remind me not to say yes to such an early appt again… there is simply no need lol

@Fangs I don’t take any cough meds. I used to take a spoonful of the bee sticky stuff, which was my go to whenever a sore throat was imminent but since going carni haven’t touched it. I took a couple of night painkillers a couple of nights ago but then thought I ought to check the safety leaflet and realised I shouldn’t be taking them with blood thinners so today I mentioned it to the nurse and she said she will get my lovely practise pharmacist David to phone me and advise what I can take in this situation. Crazy that I have to check everything I take now but c’est la vie! I can get through this i have strong faith and it could be so much worse, I trust in God to answers my prayers hey good luck on clearing MIL’s house, no easy task as I have commented on my experience on past posts! Just have to bide the time till you can completely focus on it and then get stuck in. I usually get better focused on things when I suddenly have a deadline put in front of me!

@JJFiddle you are so right about not having time to be sick and I am sure once I’m through this that will be it for yet another 4 yrs or so lol () foodie pics look very tasty and made me feel i need to cook a beef roast super soon! mount Kilimanjaro was about the 2nd virtual mount I ran up and down during lockdown before doing them descending height. I will pray he has a good trek back down the mountain.

Some food i have been eating over the past couple of days

I suspect I have already posted some of these foody pics but I will now delete them off my phone so you never have to see them again lol.

Not eaten today as yet because we are nowhere near brunch time, its only 9.20am though I suspect I will be feeling peckish by 11am having had to get up and out of house for the nurses appt. I had the usual bloods taken BP which was a bit higher than the readings I took before leaving the house but then I have been previously diagnosed with white coat hypertension syndrom and it wasn’t too high to be concerned just a bit higher than my readings. Nurse took note of my reading too. She is lovely , she is the one who helped me when I took a funny turn after going, in a great panicky rush, for my vaccines at beginning of the month.

Despite the cough and since i took neg covid test agreed to take my friend to the tea dance yesterday afternoon. Just a bit of light exercise but music was too loud (organiser is deaf) and a bit too intense as he likes to teach dances instead of putting on regular ones everyone knows! By the end of the afternoon my head was a bit shot to pieces and I could feel I was getting a bit grumpy as I hate classes and that isn’t what tea dances are about. My friend only does classes so it didn’t faze her apart from she agreed the music volume was getting to her, she had a brain tumour last year that she had to undergo life saving surgery for. We at least understand each others needs lol.

So I have some pork medallions in the slow cooker, they won’t be fatty enough for me but I will probably add some butter to them. Also have some pork mince left over from last night but that wasn’t that great so it will be a bit of hit n miss food wise today. Snacked on some cheese over last few days but my taste buds were a bit affected by the cough and it just made me feel icky… stupid thing is it doesn’t stop me snacking on it, I just have to then find something else to remove the taste. Not had any rollmops or mussels in fridge this month with cutting back on my outgoings ( need to see what I can live on to save dipping into saving till stare pension starts next june/July time. So far I have been doing amazingly well and have become extremely mindful. I have always been good at logging all my card receipts (the old fashioned way in an accounts ledger) to track bank account but since 29th September I now log all my cash too so I get an amount out for the week and make sure it suffices and so far I have found that, being so mindful, I have been making it last 2 weeks! I don’t think I needed to worry so much about retiring but we can say that in retrospect cant we?

Shinita · 2022-10-27 10:29:16 UTC

At least salt never was my problem. I eat a moderate amount automatically and all is well. It’s interesting to see my phases, one day I even like the taste of salt alone, one day I may find completely unsalted meat tasty, it’s so crazy but I am usually far from both (salt is nice but I dislike it alone, too salty, even a bit but I have my moments when it’s not true).

Dogs in that size tends to act they definitely would try… Or is that just some breeds?

Oh I know that, it feels so wrong to my hedonistic self…

I roasted a cute slab of pork loin. It’s Alvaro’s cut, too lean for me but I jump the fatty parts, Alvaro doesn’t need them, will he? I will ask him but he always liked very lean meat (and moderately fatty meat too). It was on a super good sale, it’s usually not one of the cheapest cuts… So he can enjoy a really lean pork now, I bought the 2 biggest pieces I found, all were nicely fatty on the outside…

Weather is just perfect and we had rain lately so it’s truly just fine this way I go for a long walk today (Alvaro said it’s fowl day in the little town supermarket so we do our best to get some delicious turkey… 5 wing bases would be superb), I am probably not well as I neglected my usual walks, only did my lifting… I want to get over the inheritance thing, it’s so very simple in this case (oh I read some horrible things while searching for info) but I find a way to stress over it sometimes… I tried to figure out the life insurance papers too, not easy but I think I have some better idea about them now. Now I try to FORGET for a while. Being here is therapeutic now.

And the cats should get down a peg (I know it’s not possible :D)… I have very nice but still cat-like cats (eating my scrambled eggs from the pan when I forget about it, being demanding, leaving grass and rodent organs on the doormat, Tofu wakes up with a bite if I pet her while sleeping so normal cat things but nothing too bad) but lately they happened to get a more extra bites. Chewy meat pieces, a little dairy (they all are fine with it, apparently), rabbit and fish (mostly the not edible for us parts but they still loved it) and now they act like I totally have to give them extra things. They will learn. But I like to spoil them a tiny bit, poor cats of poor us, a fish head is spoiling for them (They actually ADORE fish heads, that’s how the nice neighbourhood couple charmed them but these were small trout heads, not much to eat. The neighbour caught some big fish so tossed a big head, I never saw such a happy and possessive cat :D)
I gave them quark, just a bit, it’s always hard for me to consume it when it’s 500g and not creamy but that’s the most common type and I go for the cheapest, it’s not like there is a huge difference between brands - but there is between creamy and drier. It’s still good, I just eat it less quickly and need Alvaro’s help. But the cats gladly help too. If it’s carnivore food, they love it as far as I know. I am not super adventurous with organs and don’t feed them spicy stuff as they are cats but they probably would like those too.

FrankoBear · 2022-10-27 12:15:22 UTC

I enjoy Larson cartoons.

In late spring time the highly venomous snakes are out and about around here. This is a big deadly snake known as a dugite. It is eating a large King Skink (lizard). It made me wonder what skink, or snake for that matter, would be like to eat on a paleo-hunter’s way.

VirginiaEdie · 2022-10-27 13:50:34 UTC

That is something that worries me if I ever visit Australia someday: everything there is highly venomous - spiders, snakes, jellyfish…

Shinita · 2022-10-27 14:37:12 UTC

Yeah and bullet ants… And bunyip but that’s another thing…

I like our fauna. Almost nothing is dangerous. Only humans and stray dogs, basically… We have venomous snakes (2 species, one is very rare, Alvaro says) but they are in the mountains, minding their own business and being very visibly vipers so even Alvaro wouldn’t want to grab them (he has this compulsion to grab snakes. it’s like me and frogs and black hairy caterpillars).

I brought photos and we had lunch and I feel way better.
This pork loin is very, very confusing. Unless I totally lost my ability to tell it and I doubt that, this slab is fattier than the average pork chuck. I never met such a thing before, the ones before all were very, very lean, definitely not my style.
But this? I gained a decent amount of lard from it and that to TRIM the fat as it was waaaaaaay too fatty for me. But lovely.
I wondered which of us will eat more of this (I have some other leftover meat) but it’s not a question anymore. Yum! Whatever I planned to eat today, that can wait, I eat this now.

My dramatically lit little slice, I ate it cold and it reminded me of scratchings:

The big pieces, sorry for the blurred fruit, I didn’t notice but it adds a splash of color…

The high level of fattiness is already visible but this is the other part of the oven pan… (I enjoyed the pattern.)

And I have an almost identital second slab, yay.

Naghite · 2022-10-27 17:36:39 UTC

Breakfast turned into two meals one after other. I was famished today.

And for breakfast part deux.

Hopefully I can go a few hours today before another meal.

Karen18 · 2022-10-27 17:47:22 UTC

With you on that Edith

Shinita · 2022-10-27 17:51:01 UTC

I really don’t understand that stuff but my piece was FULL with fat tissue. I have a big fat pile left. I consumed about 492g pork, fattiness level (even with all the trimming and lost lard) very high but I haven’t any idea how much. I am surely below 120g protein now but I don’t know more. it was very, very, very satiating and easy to eat, soft and nice. Taste is mild but texture is great (after I cut down half of it as it was pure or almost pure fat). No idea what is this but I don’t complain. I will roast green ham next so I can eat up the fatty pieces too.
I got at least 100g lard from the 1700g slab… So it’s WAY fattier than pork chuck, not comparable with shoulders as it’s a very different type of meat… Very soft, tender, reminds me of very fatty pork chuck… So of course I like it.

Finally a really meaty day again.

And I weighed myself today, in the early afternoon with few clothes on. 73kg. No, my body doesn’t want to go back to 75kg and I had some days when it had some chances to gain fat I suppose… But nope. Good. Let’s go lower in November.

robintemplin · 2022-10-27 19:18:33 UTC

When someone asks me what I am doing in my retirement, I say reading more.
So I can relate.

JJFiddle · 2022-10-27 20:41:37 UTC

I’ve been working on November thread names. Something like No-never-plant-vember? Well. It’s in there somewhere!

Shinita · 2022-10-27 22:15:25 UTC

Good luck with the name, I won’t even try, I am not good with that.

As almost always, <120g protein wasn’t enough. I just felt not satiated but when I started to eat, it took some time and lots of protein to stop.
I ate about half of the 1700g fatty pork today… It happens
By the way I won’t worry about calories in November (not like I worry enough about them normally ), I merely try to keep a tiny eating window and eat strict enough, whatever that will mean at the moment. I envision many very meat based days.

Now I feel I ate a bit too much but I was hungry for protein while I was eating… (I guess the fat was too much but I couldn’t get it out, I already trimmed my meat.) Sigh. I know late eating isn’t good for me but I can’t always eat enough during the day and I can’t stand that Maybe one day I can do this right.