Carnivore Help! Bowels & Energy


(Chris - carnivoremuscle.com) #41

30+ years for me. It was eye opening. Never had an easy poo unless I was sick or by some miracle until I cut fiber and plants in general.


(Empress of the Unexpected) #42

I am also assuming that going carnivore will pretty much guarantee that I stay in ketosis?


(Elizabeth Stern) #43

Probably but most don’t measure or care


(Peter Schmitt) #44

That is an often discussed topic. As far as I know, most carnivores are in a mild ketosis. Some have really high blood-ketones, even if they have large amounts of protein.
My conclusion is, that you can have much more protein on a carnivore diet and still stay in ketosis, compared to a “normal” keto-diet.


(It's all about the bacon, baby) #45

Jeff Volek, in a presentation that I just happened to watch for the first time, says that you are not necessarily ketotic just because you are eating carnivore/ZC. The key lies in keeping your protein level moderate. He makes the point several times in the lecture that too much protein is directly insulinogenic, which is a point I hadn’t considered. Yet it makes sense when one considers that protein stimulates insulin secretion at half the rate at which carbohydrate does. My guess is that this point has been overshadowed by concerns about getting enough protein, gluconeogenesis, and protein toxicity.


(Empress of the Unexpected) #46

That’s what I was thinking when I posted that question. But I have gotten replies from other posters saying they don’t worry if they go over. I will need to track what I eat today to see just how much protein I am getting.


(Empress of the Unexpected) #47

Actually I just added up what I have already eaten and what I plan to eat and I come up with 60 grams of protein, which sounds about right for me. 5’4", 117 pounds, 60 years old. (Or maybe less?) I have no idea what my LBM is, which makes exact calculations difficult. However, with the belly alone I could visit Alaska without a parka.


(Ron) #48

I would be interested in that presentation, have a link?


#49

The idea with Carnivore/ZC (and it’s a very credible one) is to eat intuitively. It is suggested that your body will eat until it gets all the protein it needs. The satiety comes when that is met. It is very hard to overeat protein. Try it. You should find yourself craving fat if you’ve reached your threshold. I started this worrying about protein limits but if you let your body adjust then it should eat protein to satiety. Then if you’re eating enough fat it’ll burn that all it’ll use your body fat stores. I believe a persons protein requirements are drastically under estimated and your body does the calculations for you. You don’t need any macro calculator. It’s made of protein, it is essential you get enough to maintain it. Don’t worry about Ketosis, Insulin, Blood Sugar. Just ask yourself after a meal ‘how do I feel?’ If the answers great then repeat. If it’s anything else then adapt by what your body is yearning for. It sounds corny but it’s real. There’s too much fluff information out there confusing people. Turn off the headlines and go with your gut, literally. Unless it’s asking for coca cola and a croissant.


(Elizabeth Stern) #50

Volek is not carnivore and doesn’t have experience with that his experience is with ketogenic it’s very different when you’re not eating any carbs or plant matter at all. You get a different body chemistry.


(Elizabeth Stern) #51

if all you’re eating is meat that’s not going to be enough. Your body is not going to use the protein to heal because you’re just giving it the minimum that it needs to function. And if you workout or do any exercises it’s going to need more. I’m afraid you may be setting yourself up for failure if you’re not eating a minimum of 2 lb of meat a day not including eggs dairy and bacon. Some tiny women at a hundred pounds eat as much as 5 lb of meat of day


(Empress of the Unexpected) #52

Interesting you should say that because on another thread a poster was wondering if one could do, say, two days a week ZC and the rest keto. Today, for instance, all I am craving is meat. Are a few meat-only days here and there going to be a problem on keto?


(Empress of the Unexpected) #53

That’s a lot of meat, but as I mentioned, I have done a few days or even weeks of meat only throughout my life with no problems. I just eat until I’m full, and then go back to vegetables, in a few days. I don’t anticipate doing ZC on a permanent basis, I seriously doubt I could ever eat that much meat!


(It's all about the bacon, baby) #54

Here you go:


(It's all about the bacon, baby) #55

I’d love to see your research, since so many of the keto researchers (Rosedale, Phinney, Bikman, Volek, the Dudes, et. al.) seem to have such widely divergent recommendations.


(It's all about the bacon, baby) #56

Since protein is a known stimulant of insulin secretion (albeit at half the rate of carbohydrate), I would be very interested to see some research on this point.


(Chris - carnivoremuscle.com) #57

No, it makes no difference is your goal is to be keto, however you won’t fully adapt to ZC and some benefit of such could be lost.

If you’re not having extreme health issues and do fine with keto, then perhaps there’s no reason to worry about that. However, with more sickly folks and those with autoimmune problems, full adaptation away from plants is ideal, from what we’ve seen so far.


(Chris - carnivoremuscle.com) #58

Probably won’t find anything worthwhile since no one is studying strict carnivores in a clinical setting outside of n=many, and that’s all food surveys.


(Ruth Beardsley) #59

I started carnivore but failed when I travelled out of town and could not get a steak at 4:00 pm when I was hungry. I ate 150 g of cheese that night. I am going to start all over again with carnivore. I intend to eat as much fat as possible, including bacon grease, pork belly and fattier cuts of beef. I, too am curious about protein limits as I appear to be holding an aggressive cancer at bay and don’t want excess protein to feed the mini-beast inside.


(Chris - carnivoremuscle.com) #60

Cheese is still carnivore.