young female with no priod for nearly decade ` still cannot feel good after one year of carnivore

(Y Z) #1

super tierd of doing carniore woe, super lethargic, no energy, sleepy all day (i usually OMAD)
am 27 years old.
did a lot of cardio and restricted eating during college, at age 19 i lost my period (yes, you heart it right, i have not have my period for over 8 years). i experience a lot symptoms during the past few years: mood swings, cold hands and feet, osteroporosis, extreme thinking, depression, stress, poor sleep (usually wake up around 1 am), cannot and do not want to get along with people, eating disorders - my lowest weight 40 kg heavist 55 kg, etc.
i do not know if i need to heal or not, i could live this way - although very painful and does not look like worth living, so, any suggestions?

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #2

From the symptoms you describe, you are most likely not eating nearly enough food, including not enough protein (the coldness and osteoporosis). The lack of energy you describe sounds as though you are not getting enough fat, either.

Dr. Anthony Chaffee, who posts on YouTube as the “plant-free M.D.,” says that hunger feels a bit different on a carnivore diet. He says that if the meat tastes good, then we are hungry, and we should eat until the meat stops tasting good, and not stop when we think we ought to have had enough. So buy fatty cuts of meat, untrimmed, if possible, and eat for as long as it tastes good. I suspect that such an abundant diet may help the symptoms you describe.

Carnivore eating makes such standard dieting practises as portion size and calorie control irrelevant and unecessary.

(Y Z) #3

Thank you for your response, Paul. I appreciate your insights and suggestions. I will definitely consider increasing my protein and fat intake as you suggested. It’s interesting to hear about Dr. Anthony Chaffee’s perspective on hunger and the carnivore diet. I will try to pay more attention to my body’s signals and eat until the meat stops tasting good, as you mentioned.

I am 150 cm tall and currently weigh 50 kg. Since starting the carnivore diet, I have gained weight - before, I was about 42 kg. I have to mention that I currently practice OMAD, partly because of my eating disorder - once I start eating, I cannot stop. And the meat still tastes good no matter how much I have eaten :joy: .

I do gain a lot of weight during the days when I prime with a carnivore diet (no limited eating time window, eat whenever I want, and however much I like). Maybe I still cannot let myself go on the psychological and mental side of myself. Thank you for sharing this information with me, it’s very helpful.

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #4

Hi YZ welcome to the forum :blush: You will benefit from being here with so much good info and help, I’m sure some woman here will comment too.

Eating carbs for many people is damaging, for you too I’d imagine …

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #5

People forget that being in ketosis is not a weight-loss diet, it is a weight-normalisation diet. Many people put on muscle and increase their bone density, even while losing fat. The advantage of not eating carbohydrate is that in such a situation, protein and fat have no effect on insulin secretion–other than the bare minimum required for life.

The British fitness trainer and food activist, Sam Feltham, did an experiment in which he ate 5000 (k)cal a day for 28 days on a ketogenic low-carb diet. He gained a few kilos, but it turned out from a DEXA scan that he had lost fat and gained muscle. A win all around, in my book. I wonder what his results would have been if he’d eaten strictly carnivore.

Part of the problem with the standard Western diet is that osteoporosis is common, especially as we age, and we are inundated with advice to eat and exercise in such a way as to leave us perpetually hungry. It’s a high-insulin diet, and since insulin is the primary fat-storage hormone, that means we get fat, even while cutting calories. It’s nice to know that it is possible to eat in a way that provides the exact opposite results.

(Robin) #6

Hello and welcome!
If you are eating recommended food, there is no problem with overeating. Just watch your carbs. And if you’re hungry, eat.
It’s a whole new mindset than what we grew up with.

Keep in mind, keto does not cure everything, nor is it responsible for everything. If you had all of these symptoms before, keto should at least help.

Don’t rule out hormones. I would be seeing a doctor or gynecologist for your lack of periods. This is like athletes who demand too much of their skinny little bodies.

I would also step away from the scales for awhile. They can mess with your head!

(Alec) #7

Hi

  1. When you say “carnivore” can you pls tell us a typical day of eating for you? What exactly do you eat?
  2. OMAD sounds to me like you are restricting… why are you doing that? As Paul says, you should not be restricting on carnivore… you should eat fatty meat until you no longer feel hungry (or when the meat starts not tasting good).
  3. Your weight sounds low to me. As Robyn says, I think you need to step away from the scales, and eat! And trust your body to do its thing… you should not worry about weight when you have health issues…. Fix the health and the weight will optimise… and I think for you that may mean higher weight.
#8

She wrote she can’t stop eating. I totally understand, if it’s a huge chore to get satiated (my only reason not to stop on carnivore) once, I don’t want to do it multiple times a day. Sometimes I eat for 2 hours (well with breaks, carni food is usually super dense and I don’t eat slow) to get rid of my hunger, FINALLY! And that food is easily enough or more than that. Overeating and wasting money and energy and being hungry for hours AGAIN doesn’t solve anything, it just makes things worse.

OMAD can be the opposite of restricting, eating as much as one wants when it’s a lot that they want! It isn’t always the case, of course but it can be. And perfect satiation for a day… My OMAD days are wonderful, I dislike being hungry (and working hard to change it) and it’s minimal on OMAD.

She said meat NEVER stops tasting good. I am the same, food tastes the same, no matter how hungry, satiated or full I am. I personally lose interest at some point and don’t want to eat more (it often happens when I am very hungry, sadly, good thing meat isn’t my only carnivore item) but the taste is still as good as ever.
We just can’t all use the usual advice for carnivore, often it’s physically impossible too. We are different and need different approaches.

Not to me, at all. 150 cm and 50kg? That’s okay, may be even a bit too high, impossible to say blindly. I am 163 cm and I was definitely fat at 62kg (huge belly rolls. of course I couldn’t be fat everywhere with these numbers) and I didn’t have antropied muscles, just smallish ones like most women.

The weight is fine, the problem is the OP’s health, there are very bad things going on there.

I am interested too, what and how much do you eat, @y_Z? I am with the others, eating more may help some…? Maybe you don’t eat the right things in the right quantities for you…? Carnivore can be done wrong too, after all and people have different sensitivities, even a great carnivore diet of one person can be bad for another. But maybe we could have more tips seeing how you eat…

(Y Z) #9

Hi there! Thank you for your questions and concerns. i really appreciate it!

To answer your first question, a typical day of eating for me on the carnivore diet usually includes 80 to 120 g of butter, sometimes even higher, 4 to 6 eggs, and 400 to 500 g of steak every day.

In response to your second question, I am doing OMAD mostly because of my eating disorder mentality. I do not feel hungry and I really cannot have true hunger/full signals. Once I start eating, I cannot stop. However little I eat, I feel disgusted and have no appetite for a long time, thus I chose OMAD.

Regarding your third point, my weight of 45 kg is actually not light for me, considering that I am of petite size. But I do work out - I do strength training, swimming, and walk at least 10,000 steps every day.

#10

Oh. You eat well then. Even exercise! It seems totally right, I don’t have any ideas at this point :frowning: I really hope someone or something can help…

I can’t imagine not having proper signals but at least you give pretty good nutrients to your body. Unless you are sensitive to something you eat (but you would notice it, wouldn’t you?), your food shouldn’t be the problem… Maybe OMAD isn’t compatible with your body if that is a thing, despite you have good reasons to do OMAD…? But probably your problems lay elsewhere.

Good luck finding a solution to live better!!!

(Y Z) #11

:pleading_face::pleading_face::pleading_face:

thank you for attempting to make sense of my post and for explaining this. It’s reassuring to hear that someone shares similar experiences and feelings, and I appreciate your perspective.

A typical day of eating for me on the carnivore diet usually includes 80 to 120 g of butter, sometimes even higher, 4 to 6 eggs, and 400 to 500 g of steak every day.

Sometimes I consider I might not tolerate butter well. I have switched to pork belly and/or fatty fish, such as salmon sashimi. However, with each option, I have experienced diarrhea, sleepiness, and ANGER after eating on the carnivore diet.

Yes, ANGER! towards people surrounding me or even my loved ones for no reason. I felt bad but I cannot control it - there is just so much inside of me that I want to let out - and I do not know how.

I hypothesize that my strong emotions and stress may be due to a lack of outlets for expression, such as love and gratitude. As a young international student living abroad, I often experience self-doubt and identity problems, as well as difficulty fitting in culturally.

There is some pressure from work, but I believe it is for the best. You wake up every day feeling on a mission. That is to say, I cannot feel relaxed even on vacation. I am unsure of what is going on with you and want to find out and get help.

(I am not shy away from saying this) but I think very deep inside, I hope people can come and recognize me. I think I long for a sense of belonging and care.

I had a better body figure doing a low carb low-fat diet but always thought about food. On the carnivore diet, I sometimes feel dizzy and full of fat, but at least you are satiated. From my long history of dieting, I am afraid of being starving anymore. That is why I am sticking with the carnivore diet for now.

(Y Z) #12

i hope this is happening with me lol :rofl:

but considering my age, having a T-score below -2.5 is a little bit scary (attached is part of my reference report)

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(Y Z) #13

Thank you for your suggestions! I am currently eating zero carb and while I’m not sure if the carnivore diet is the best for me, at least I’m not starving on this way of eating.

I have been seeing doctors, both Eastern and Western, and have tried Chinese herbal medical therapy as well as Western hormonal therapies. Unfortunately, none of them have worked for me.

I am trying to teach myself not to weigh myself for at least 3 months. Thank you again for your advice. :upside_down_face:

#14

Do you know your body fat percentage? For hormones, the fat percentage is important, not just the weight. Low body fat, even if the total body weight seems to be “normal”, can lead to low hormones (estrogen, LH, FSH…) and amenorrhoea alongside other symptoms, some of which you have mentioned (osteoporosis, for example). I read years ago that the minimum fat percentage is around 14 or 15%, although I’m assuming there’s individual variety to that. I also feel like your food intake is rather low, considering you’re not sedentiary. I am sedentiary/very inactive and often eat more than you.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #15

I forgot to mention in my earlier post that many new carnivores experience a weight gain at first, and many of them find it to be a temporary thing, as their body adjusts. What matters more than the number on the scale, however, is body composition: if our weight comes from having strong muscles and bones, while our body fat is minimal for our age and sex, who cares how much we actually weigh?

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #16

Most carnivores eating to satiety find that they consume about double that amount of food. You can safely increase your quantity.

#17

With 80-120g or more butter…? Even the protein is high…
I typically eat less with some activity, definitely not slow metabolism and 75kg… (And it’s still too much for me.)
It doesn’t matter how we others eat, of course but the amount of food seems fine according to what I know about the need of a short female human body. May be too much or too little too, it’s in the range where it’s hard to tell. Maybe the meat isn’t enough, some petite woman eats way more meat…
And if it doesn’t get absorbed well (there are various problems so I think of that possibility… OMAD for a small person, maybe the chance of rushing to food is there too…?), that may be a problem.

#18

Way over 4000 kcal? Wouldn’t that be a tad excessive for petite women…? Usually, I mean, I heard some need a ton of food first. But that’s probably meat, not calories…

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #19

Yes, indeed. The idea is to spread it out over three meals a day, and to eat to satisfy hunger. Forget about the amount of calories. But 2 lbs./8.4 kg of meat is what most carnivores end up eating. Some eat more.

Remember that the metabolism increases to deal with the amount of food we give our body.

Also, protein is not usually used as an energy source by the body, except in emergencies. The body prefers to use fat as its energy source. (And yes, it can and certainly does use glucose, but there are indications that fat is actually preferred.)

And lastly, the body is perfectly capable of wasting energy, if we give it too much. It is glucose (carbohydrate) that gets stored and retained; fat gets stored and used, stored and used, stored and used, and it can cycle in and out of adipocytes (fat cells) because insulin is low. It is high insulin that causes us to get fat.

#20

I doubt many of us enjoy overeating but each to their own… I do my absolute best not to do that, I almost feel ashamed I did that for decades.

And I wish to avoid protein toxicity too. So 2lbs of meat is out of question. (But wastefulness and being forced to starve due to eating up my food money too early is there too. I couldn’t even eat that much meat… 1.-1.5 pound is quite lovely for me, a bit high protein but it can’t be helped.)

I am not sure of it (probably sometimes it’s true, sometimes not?) but some of us are like that, indeed. It’s how my body works, I liked that on high-carb :wink: Gaining fat was super hard and super slow and I could and did eat…

Yes, of course. Too much protein causes protein toxicity but normal (not super lean :)) meat brings fat too and that is energy.

Most normal people just gain fat, some of us don’t but I don’t care about this so much. It’s wasteful, wrong, an unnecessary burden. And of course, I don’t lose fat but it’s not the OP’s problem. I don’t want my body to waste energy :frowning: Food is precious, not to waste it.

People can gain fat rapidly when eating too much fat too, no wonder, it’s surplus energy. Most of us don’t need to worry about it but carnivores forcefully eating ton of fats experienced it. I have read some stories on this forum where it wasn’t even forceful. Carnivore simply make people gain fat, not just in short term. It’s not for everyone, apparently, of course not.
And our body would be a very big failure if it couldn’t gain fat from fat… Sometimes we need it, after all…

It’s too much fat that made me fat, actually. I couldn’t eat much enough carbs to overeat but fat, that “helped”. Don’t misunderstand me, carbs were bad, not my precious fat, that just come to mitigate the problems the carbs caused… But fat brought to extra energy that my body just couldn’t use it up anymore. My carb intake wasn’t even nearly enough for my body to function.
I don’t fear getting fattier without carbs, that’s not what my body does, thankfully. But some can do it, apparently. Probably very few though. It seems keto (at least the right style for the one in question) is very good for maintenance for many.
(I don’t think I could get fattier with carbs either, actually. It was super hard even when I could eat sugar galore. I only can eat starch galore now but I don’t want to.)