Whats your fat/protein ratio

(Ohio ) #21

Excess protein is bad. 100%. My 48 hour fasts seem more successful with resistance starch, low protein. As the last meal.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #22

While it used to be believed that excess protein got turned into glucose by the body, our picture of gluconeogenesis is more nuanced, these days.

Also, a few years ago, certain experts warned against eating protein because it stimulates mTOR, but as Prof. Ben Bikman points out, elevated insulin from a high-carb diet has a far, far greater effect on mTOR. In fact, Prof. Bikman is much further towards the other end of the scale from you, being an advocate of eating more protein, rather than less, on the grounds that our ability to assimilate amino acids begins to diminish as we age. He doesn’t go as far as Ted Naiman, who believes that “there is no such thing as too much protein,” however.

I suspect that protein is neither the villain nor the panacaea that different people make it out to be, and that as we learn more, we will eventually figure out that a goodly amount of protein, neither too much nor too little, is what we should be aiming for.

In the normal course of things, the body does not use protein for its caloric value, but rather uses the constituent amino acids of the proteins we eat as structural material for building and repairing tissue. The body has a minimal ability to store amino acids, however, so one argument against overdoing protein is that the body will simply waste the excess amino acids, if it can’t find a use for them.

(Allie) #23

Maybe doesn’t work for you, but you are not everyone else and cannot even pretend to be able to speak for them.

#24

Each to their own. Excess protein is clearly not bad for many of us. Too much protein is surely bad for everyone, that’s because it’s too much :smiley: There is multiple reasons I don’t want to eat 4-5 g/kg for LBM protein regularly (I feel pretty good with it occasionally)… But some of us prefers high protein over mere adequate (and I am completely unable to eat adequate amount and my goal is actually significantly higher as I accepted I need it high).
While others find lower protein (still adequate for them, not necessarily according to other people’s views but they don’t lose muscle or anything other bad thing with that amount) and higher fat better for them.

Eating only meat is great for various ratios, that’s handy. Even if we eat plenty of non-meat items, at least I totally do. But meat is a very convenient, nice staple I can eat in bigger amounts than my other food.

(Ohio ) #25

James Dinicolantonio describes gluconeogenesis as a non stop system. Necessary for cellular function.

From my armchair studies, to me, it seems like protein and glucose feed a multitude of diseases. Speeds up aging.

Carbs r generally impossible for me to ingest and most around me r carb feens. My perception on protein could be askew, regardless, I stress the importance of extended fasting.

#26

maybe you wanna check this out: PKD?

if you are going extreme higher fat and controlling your protein from restriction, then this could be you but people DO this protocol for a medical reason actually, but you might be interested in the information on it and research it more.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #27

True. And the body is perfectly capable of making the small amount of glucose needed. What is not needed is dietary carbohydrate. There is no known carbohydrate-deficiency disease, whereas certain amino acids and certain fatty acids are essential in the diet.

But even the brain will consume ketones in preference to glucose, if it can get them. It does appear to need a minimum amount of glucose, but far less than the 130 g/day that George Cahill estimated. And fat-adapted skeletal muscles actually appear to prefer fatty acids for most purposes, in preference to ketones and glucose. Though of course, glucose is important for explosive performance, since it can be metabolised more quickly.

I wouldn’t pay too much attention to the scientists who claim this. That is just speculation at this point; we don’t know enough, yet. The body is a system that reacts differently to different inputs, and going overboard by restricting some things can have negative effects on the system overall. As Prof. Bikman remarks, while it is true that consuming protein can activate mTOR, which is believed to shorten longevity, the elevated insulin from eating an excessive amount of carbohydrate activates mTOR much more strongly. Also, certain amino acids are essential to life, making it impossible to avoid eating protein altogether.

Another example Bikman gives is autophagy. A certain amount of fasting helps to promote the beneficial effects of autophagy, but if we fast so much that the body has to begin breaking down muscle tissue in order to get certain amino acids, then that’s not a good thing.

(Ohio ) #28

Right. I take the Vitamin D/sunlight approach to most amino acids. You’ll die without both but a methodical exposure seems like a safe bet.

**I don’t limit exposure to glycine. I’m not sure anyone gets enough of that?

(Sonny ) #29

…is excess Protein :slight_smile:

(Bill) #30

In some people’s opinion?

(Megan) #31

Protein is quite limited on the KetoPet Sanctuary cancer diet for dogs because if cancer cells can’t feed on glucose they feed on glutamate. Same goes for cancer cells in human bodies.

(Ohio ) #32

Yep. The few women I know battling breast cancer echo protein cautions.

(Allie) #33

Maybe a valid concern but how many of them are also high glucose, and what about all the women who are eating high protein without any issues?

(Ohio ) #34

Well the only one close to me, maybe the exception, but she’s been low sugar her whole life. Playing devils advocate, can’t say it isn’t well water. Farmer.

People go low carb, high protein and do great. I’m aware of this.

(Robin) #35

BC survivor here. I can’t go back and second guess my crappy diet when I was diagnosed. I was thin enough, but I know I wasn’t as healthy or strong then. And I believe the number one factor would be my current TOTAL lack of inflammation.

I used to have so much fibroid stuff going on, my mammograms were like looking into a mass of confusion. It was hard to see and impossible to feel the lump.

No more fibroid issues now. My mammograms today look like a different person entirely.

(Megan) #36

Yay!! Our diet is so important and you’re living proof! (pun intended lol)

(Bill) #37

But “low sugar” is only part of the picture as carbohydrates are glucose molecules too…

(Sonny ) #38

Thanks for the link

When you say "people DO this protocol for a medical reason " Are you referring to the typcial CV diet where people just eat meat and consider fat secondary?

(Sonny ) #39

I did not say I won’t eat meat I said I won’t eat excess meat. Big difference. The body cannot absorb more than 30g of protein. What do you think happens to the excess protein? How does it benefit the body to have excess protein when you can replace it with healthy Omega 3 fats?

(Sonny ) #40

Thanks to more omega-3 fats and no processed carbs, Animal Protein has no part to play in an anti-inflammatory diet. If anything excess protein can lead to inflammation as reported in research studies.