What's a cheap proxy measure for Testosterone?

(Boston_guy) #1

I’m working on bumping up my T, as it’s in the basement: (49M, T = 276 ng/dL, free T=4.7 ng/dL). Trying to figure out a proxy measurement that’s cheap fast and easy. Here are some examples of tests I like:

  • Waistline - free, 15 seconds
  • Body composition - muscle/fat. I use a Skulpt device.
  • HRV: Oura ring tracks.

Short of an $80 lab visit, can anyone suggest a test that would get at this? Weight loss and better body comp should = higher T, but that has not been the case so far.

All suggestions welcome :slight_smile:



(VLC.MD) #2

Do the test early in the morning.
When testosterone levels are higher.

Stop ordering tests that you don’t need ?

It just leads to confusion.


Honestly dude, there isn’t one. It’s true loosing some weight, exercise and weight training can bump it up a little but that’s only by an ignorable amount. Gotta shoot that stuff in! None of the pills work. I’m 37 and years of being overweight wrecked me. Without forcing it in I’ll drop into the low 200’s in a couple weeks. I keep myself around 500 or so and feel awesome. I’m now 100lbs from my heaviest and I still can’t maintain good levels without injecting. Plus is, it’s dirt cheap with insurance and makes you feel like a million bucks. What part of Boston you from? I’m from JP!

(VLC.MD) #4

Weight loss improves testosterone and erectile function.

(66c8264b7e284fcee72a) #5

I don’t know if these are too general, but energy, mood, libido are pretty good indicators (those are not the only things that healthy testosterone levels are good for, but they’re very decent reflections).

Maybe what VLC was getting at in your first reply: the absolutely cheapest and easiest might be morning erections. I’m sure there’s a more delicate way to put this but - in my personal and experience with the men in my life and their testosterone levels - they should happen every single morning, last for more than a few seconds, and be very firm.

(Boston_guy) #6

66c8264b7e284fcee72a - yes, I’ll often have an erection all night when sleeping. Wish there were something more quantitive though…

(Boston_guy) #7

Really want to fix it naturally, injections are a last resort… Will see what doc makes of the labs. I should increase Boron dose from 3-10 mg, and definitely know resistance training makes me feel “strong like bull”.

Many experts (Charles Poloquin, Christopher Walker of anabolicmen) claim some low GI carbs are necessary for T. May experiment with some black beans again, see where the data leads.

Waltham here!

(So much bacon . . . so little time . . .) #8

Are you getting enough vitamin D? They are beginning to suspect that the RDA is too low for most people. I take 5000 IU a day. They started me on it last year when I was in the hospital for two broken arms, and apparently low vitamin D interferes not only with calcium absorption but also a whole host of other bodily activities. So I’ve kept taking it, even though the arms are long healed. I mention it because low vitamin D also depresses testosterone levels.

(Mike) #9

I have no idea what will boost it other than replacement therapy. I take near the max dose of Androgel every day and have a lower AM level at my bi-annual test than the OPs 276. Just started Keto myself 3 weeks (and 16 Lbs from 250 to start) ago so I am hoping that I can lower my dose as my weight drops.

(Boston_guy) #10

Yes, D is 71. Also replete in magnesium, selenium, zinc. Adding more data to original post.


Just leaving this here: http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/07/27/increase-testosterone-levels.aspx

(VLC.MD) #12

The max D in Canada is 250. FYI. quite a bit higher than in :us: - pretty sure it’s the same units as well.

(Boston_guy) #13

That sounds crazy high! Below 32 25-Hdroxy(ng/ml) is insufficient per Ivor Cummin’s slides (https://www.slideshare.net/ivorcummins/d-is-for-debacle-the-crucial-story-of-vitamin-d-and-25ohd-hormone). He says Maasai are at 42 - https://youtu.be/v3pK0dccQ38?t=941

(VLC.MD) #14

Uh oh. My units are nmol/L ! range 75-250.

1 ng/ml = 2.5 nmol.L

so our ranges are the same.
actually … your low end is higher (100 vs my 75).

so in my range … your value is 71.3 x 2.5 = 178.25 - you must supplement.

How much a day ? 5000 IU ?

(Chris) #15

According to Dr Wong:

50% of guys who are getting older, andropause (male menopause) their pituitary gland in the brain tells the testicles to stop working - they stop making luteinizing hormone. The other 50% of guys who go through andropause and their testosterone drops, is because their testicles just stop working.

You won’t know which side of the fence you fall on until you try to put in the stuff to make testosterone and if you do make testosterone by yourself all is well and good and if you don’t make testosterone by yourself your only recourse is to put the testosterone in directly which works really well if you also use products to stop the testosterone from converting into estrogen or DHT

(Boston_guy) #16

good guess - 4000 :slight_smile:

(VLC.MD) #17

I would have guessed 4000, but figured you’d go the lazy man way of 1 pill of 5000 IU, vs 4 x 1000. (like I would)

I find the American “Low T” advertising annoying. Everyone thinks they have “Symptoms of Low T” and want testing. The testing is deeply flawed / unpredictable / inconsistent. I find Testosterone’s relief of low T symptoms close to placebo level.

Anyone considering supplementing should understand the FDA has BLACK BOX warnings for testosterone. Google: testosterone black box warning


I’m not sure how safe or unsafe Testosterone is. No one does really. I do know the FDA is slow and hesitant to give out black box warnings. If it made me feel better I’d take it. I wonder if it would help keep lean muscle mass while losing alot of weight keto’ing / dieting. It probably reduces insulin resistance by making more muscle. Try to take the lowest possible dose ? I dont find it helps ED or libido really.

If I was put on it, I’d start weightlifting to get the full effect :slight_smile:

(VLC.MD) #18


Surprised Dr. OrderLots didn’t request Free T4 and Free T3.

(VLC.MD) #19


Looks like the lab did Magnesium, not RBC Magnesium ?

(Boston_guy) #20

Actually he did - that’s my bad transcribing to make sense of all the data. Will update the screenshot in first post.