Vacation, Carbs and Sleep

(Jim) #1

Dear Members,

I Just came back from my vacation in Spain were I still did a keto style of eating with loads of fish and veggies :smile:. What I found out is how fat adapted I became and how fast I can kick back into ketosis after eating 80+ gram carbs. Now before I went on vacation I used the sleep supplements of Dr berg that helped tremandusly with my sleep. But when I went to spain it just gave me restless nights and slept very poorly on it. Granted, I had to eat a bit later then I am usually like (4 hours no food before bed gives me the best sleep). Also I’ve seen some sleep experts talk about not using melatonin and tryptophan and just let nature do it’s work.

Now 1 day I just indulged in some chips when we were playing cards with the family. I went to bed after that and slept for 10 hours straight and woke up intensly refreshed. Like nothing before, even after doing keto for 4-5 months. So I want to start experiment with it and have some questions about it.

  1. I want do a keto style of carb backloading. So Eat 30-40 grams at 17:30 and then 20 grams over the rest of the day (I train almost everyday). Is this allright to do so? Sometimes I see people on youtube that say it’s really bad to keep kicking yourself out of ketosis.
  2. How are the adrenals and coritsol if I keep getting back into ketosis and out? There is just so much mixed information to find that I find this a bit confusing.

I really like keto and love the feeling of being fat adapted. But I need to priorities my sleep now and want to know if this will be a healthy way of experimenting.

Much Love!

Jim

#2

Nothing wrong with it at all, but as somebody that does CKD/TKD and has tried every single combination and variant there is I’d think you’d need more than that for the performance (I think) you’re going after. 30-40g is a pretty ignoreable amount that you’ll incinerate almost immediately while training.

That’s because they’re morons.

That’s how you’d be in nature, that’s how every normal low carb eater that doesn’t live in ketosis 24/7 works… not a concern. That’s called metabolic flexibility. Eat fat, BURN IT, Eat some carbs BURN THEM, it should be something everybody tries to achieve.

I’m focusing on the fact you say you train and not that you work out, to me that’s a very specific description of what you’re doing and probably line up more or less with what I do. Take a look at this guy, Keto bodybuilder, 53 I think, friggen ripped! He’s a little lean right now, just did an NPC show and if he hit 1 more category he could have walked off with a pro card. He’s got a ton of videos, a podcast, great for the keto side that realizes carbs can be an important tool when you don’t abuse them.

(Butter Withaspoon) #3

If you’re still metabolically healthy you should be fine to go in and out of ketosis, and to eat more carbs. 100g per day is still low relative to the rest of the population. It sounds like you have good fat adaptation and metabolic flexibility, and are active. So enjoy it!

Most members here are fighting bigger health problems so the general advice is that 20g a day is a safe maximum for everyone to get into ketosis. Of course there is much individual variation.

Oh and welcome!

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #4

Any low-carb diet that keeps your insulin low enough for your liver to make ketones is a ketogenic diet. The 20 g limit we advise is primarily aimed at ensuring that the vast majority of people who try this way of eating get into ketosis. A few people will be so metabolically damaged that they will need to eat even less, but a lot of people find that their carb tolerance is higher than 20 g/day and they can remain in ketosis while eating somewhat more.

It’s very individual. I can tolerate more than 20 g/day of carbohydrate as far as ketosis is concerned, but there is a point where, even though I am still ketotic, my arthritis starts to act up again, and my joints feel creaky all over. I don’t like that feeling, so I stay below that amount of carbohydrate. Also, my mother’s side of the family is riddled with Type II diabetes and cardiovascular trouble, so I am interested in keeping my insulin low for as much of the day as possible.

#5

I would try and decide for myself as I doubt anyone could tell you what is ideal for you, we are just too different and complicated.

Some people need to be stricter than just being in ketosis (me included, ketosis isn’t enough, extreme low-carb is LOADS better), other are fine being in and out ketosis (I did it for years as I had no idea how to go lower… it wasn’t bad at all, it was better than staying in ketosis with too much carbs, not where small miracles happen… but it’s not ideal for me. I can have an occasional off day but my old 40 or 80g won’t my default anymore). Some even needs more carbs for training or just function right…

50-60g isn’t even very high and you train, it’s possible you will be in ketosis. But maybe not for a while. It’s not necessarily a problem, I really would try and decide for myself! As I did it in my own case. Of course, it’s not all about carbs or even macros, food choices are important.

(Marianne) #6

How long have/had you been doing keto before Spain? Speaking for myself, it took me I’d say four months to become what I would call fat adapted. During that time, I ate three meals a day, then two, then usually one. I felt I was fat adapted when I could go a whole day without eating until dinner and do sustained, heavy activity, without feeling weak or tired. Although I could go a whole day before then eating just one meal and feeling satiated, there was a marked difference in my energy level when I became fat adapted.

Maybe before you consider carb loading, try increasing the size(s) of meat at your meal(s) and see how you feel and sleep.

Best.

(Marianne) #7

Yes! That is what I love about this program - try different things and decide what works for you.

(Jim) #8

3-4 months. Did a 48 hour fast with almost no problems physicaly. For me meat is very heavy on my stomach So now I am trying to eat around 2 meals a day. With sometimes some macadamian nuts as a snack. I fast from 16-18 hours a day, but I do alternate day fasting because I’ve lost so much weight and I love bodybuilding. That’s also why I want to introduce it a bit more.

But indeed like what everybody is saying, you gotta find your own way. The thing with me is, I feel alot of stress when I am doing keto (Did 2 DNA test that said I have a high sensitivity for fat, personaly I don’t really believe in these kind of tests because Genes always change). So I am trying to find a middle ground of feeling good on keto, but have some time off it to give my body some rest. But agian I feel alot of inflammation in body When I am doing keto. But I just can;t got back to normal carb eating because my brain just doesn’t work and I really hate the feeling of hunger. So yeah, trying to find some middle ground here.

(Jim) #9

Thanks for the great information! Will check it out for sure.