Trying out carnivore once again

(Patrick) #41

No interest in gyms. Thinking of buying an electric scooter so I can travel to a mountain I used to bike to and climb 2 times a day 6 days a week and do that every day…it’s a really good mountain that’s 1500 meters going up and it’s pretty steep climb too. My old bike is too slow now and my e-bike is 80 pounds, no thanks hauling that up there. The scooter I am looking at is only 30 pounds. I don’t care about biking to and from, only that steep climb up.

#42

So you agree that Keto “stopped working” for you and switched to carnivore, hoping you would get better results? It would seem that you did get the results you were looking for. Question: What results were better with the carnivore protocol than the keto protocol? Also, what happens when or if carnivore stops giving you the results you expect?

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #43

I suppose it depends on the results. For many people, “results” means continuing to lose weight, I guess.

For me, keto was about staving off diabetes, which I achieved. But I do feel better without the oxalates in my diet. For one thing, my skin itches a lot less. Also, I used to get an eczema-like dermatitis on the backs of my hands every fall, that would last till spring. It was a lot better on keto, but on carnivore this year, there’s been no sign of it at all.

I consider carnivore “better” than keto, but that’s simply because I lost my desire for vegetables over time, and I just enjoy the feeling of not eating plant food.

(Mike Cayen) #44

Hey Peter,

I’ve scanned through a bunch of your replies and updates, congrats on staying the course. I will say one thing I noticed. Lots of “lower fat is better for me” comments and that you are still feeling depression after a lot of time in this way of eating. Lower fats, because we are only eating one thing means more protein. Nothing wrong with lots of protein, but if the fat gets too low, bad things happen…
2 lbs of meat with low to no fat is a ■■■■ ton of protein, getting you much of the way to your daily protein target, but you will feel miserable if you keep doing it because your body will rebel.

I will tell you from a ton of “trying things out” as well, as all the research available in Keto papers, as well as just a litany of youtube doctors and success stories… ANY of the let’s call it “brain” driven issues people feel or experience tend to get better the higher fat levels you eat. Basically, PERIOD… Everything from attempts to fix people with depression, anxiety, Alzheimer’s, dementia, MS, disease where the myelin sheath is causing some type of disease/symptoms due to lack of fats protecting it, and a host of other things. Eating lower fat rarely works in carnivore, and again, low is relative, but 1/1 is starting to get low. Lean meat with low to no fat, is “the standard American diet”, but without veggies and starches" and that is POISON in those ratios. The human body can’t run on lean meat and nothing else.

We’ve replaced carbs with a new energy source, fat. You are carrying extra weight currently but you can’t get fat eating “saturated” fat. If you give your body an excess of fat daily, for awhile, you’re body finally relaxes and determines that you won’t starve, that you can live on fat, and it will start burning it’s own fat reserves. You should really increase your fat each weak, purposefully eating 80/20, then get 75/25 ground for you, then the following weak, cook that in tallow, etc. Go until you can actually cause diarrhea and at that point, back off a bit and hang there for a good while.

You CAN get fat eating polyunsaturated processed garbage fat because the body has no clue what to do with and “shelves” it for use a later time. As this occurs, not only do you visibly get fatter on the outside, but your insides get packed with fat around the organs and even worse, you lose muscle mass as some cells atrophy due to being inflamed continuously due to fat actually being stored IN the muscles. A cross section of a leg muscle in humans would look like a nice ribeye with great marbling in these people.

It’s tasty in cows, but it’s REALLLY bad for them, as well as for us, and we simply can’t tell it’s going on until we pay for it down the road with some type of sickness. I would ask if you have quite a bit of dairy (be it milk, cream, cheese, etc), or having deep fried wings exposing you to a lot of seed oils still perhaps? Don’t know your entire dietary plan, but the dairy alone, with all of it’s “quasi hormones” can cause the body to act pretty damn funny and not participate in your losing the weight you want, or help with your depression.

Lastly, unless you are a “raging boner porn star like human”, I would get a full testosterone panel worked up and see if it might be really on the low side, which can have all kinds of downstream effects from lack of ability to lose weight, anxiety, depression, etc.

As the depression lifts, this gets much easier to stick to :slight_smile: I wish you the very best!

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #45

Hey, Mike, welcome to the forums!

People seem to think that protein is an energy source, but the body doesn’t like to metabolise protein. It’s energy sources are glucose and fatty acids. Eating a lot glucose (which is what all carbohydrates are made out of) brings with it a whole set of problems that eating fat does not. Also, given the relative caloric values of fat and carbohydrate, it takes only 133.33 g of fat to yield the same number of calories as 300 g of protein. There is also such a thing as “rabbit starvation,” which occurs from eating meat that is too lean.

Preach it, brother! So much of the mental illness and motor-neuron disease we see these days is the result of poor brain function from metabolic damage, primarily insulin-resistance.

A lot of wisdom in this post. Thanks for joining, and I hope we see more of you.

(Michael) #46

Maybe I am partial, but everyone who cannot sprint due to whatever (I cannot due to a hernia surgery which causes pain when I exert any force on my right leg),can swim without issues and swim sprint (max effort over a short distance). I do swim regularly and try to swim sprints each day as per the concept for brief moments of very high intensity (as you would do either as a hunter sprinting after prey, or as a prey trying to get away!) seems appropriate regardless. If it is not much better, it certainly won’t hurt if you can safely achieve the sprint/max muscle efforts over a short time. Whether that is running, sprinting, or even HIIT, or imho at least, weight lifting - anything that takes some maximum exertion for a short period of time.

#47

I have started Carnivore again after taking an 8 kg sourdough and wine detour from late 2020 until late 2023. I have quit alcohol. I WAS 4 years sober prior to starting up again in 2020. Anyway I have been carnivore for almost 3 weeks and have had bad scoots - diarrhea - for a week and a half. Getting so I can’t leave the house. Curious that the first time I went Carnivore (2018-2020) I never got the runs. but this time is different.

(Patrick) #48

Hey guys, just letting you know I am down to 198 now. So like 21 or 22 pounds or so…also still kinda feeling that depression but I think that’s because I still don’t excercise and always feel unproductive, I do my knee pushups and ■■■■■■ squats everyday still but that’s not enough. But I can eat regular ground beef now without passing out, in fact I don’t even pass out after eating anymore. But I still have liquid diarrhea?? I don’t salt my food either. Trying to better myself and get into a trade of some kind. The guy that used to train me quit and went to a better higher paying job, I am tired of making 30K/year and want 100K/year now so trades are for me. I just wanna work…I don’t travel, I don’t take holidays, I don’t take sick days. I just show up and do my job.

(Patrick) #49

I normally eat around 500 grams of ground beef and 4 bacon or 6 eggs, started noticing I am getting hungrier during the day now so I guess I will have to eat more fat.

The ground beef I eat is butchers choice medium ground beef

per 100 grams

270 cals
22 fat
0 carbs
18 protein

The Bacon is 18 fat per 2 slices and 1 carb and like 10 protein or something.

But I need more fat by the looks of it.

Soon i’ll be taking my electric scooter to the mountain and walk up and down twice starting from probably 3 days/week now that the snow is almost gone.

#50

UPDATE: I think I can explain why I did not get diarrhea the first time I went Carnivore. I went from keto to Carnivore. This tume, I am going from sourdough/wine/ice cream/etc to Carnivore.
In a bid to stop the diarrhea, I ate eggs and cheese and some mulrigrain bread. I constipated myself so I had to take pills to clear out the blockage. I hope the watery stools are gone, but time will tell.

(Robin) #51

Good to hear.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #52

A couple of things to look at are your salt intake and your fat intake. Too much of either can be as problematic as too little.

In any case, your system needs time to adjust. Who knows what is different this time around? It could be anything. A high-carb diet can cause a lot of bloating, and shedding the bloat can cause problems. Fortunately, they subside pretty quickly. Sobriety is a whole different set of challenges, both mental and physical. It’s worth it in the long run, however, even if only for the improvement in your liver health, though sober people usually find many other benefits, as well.

ETA: If you went from keto to carnivore the first time around, the adjustment is usually milder. Going from high-carb, low-fat directly to low-carb, high-fat is a much bigger adjustment. However, your system should sort it out soon. Just try to ride things out.

(Patrick) #53

So I have pretty much hit the 3 month mark (next week), I am down to 193 but seemed to have stopped losing weight on the scale for well over a month now but when I lift up my shirt my stomach while still have a belly it looks somewhat flat looking straight at it or when I turn around and look from the side. Next week I am going to have a cheat meal (pizza) and get back to carnivore another 3 months. That’s my plan. Also gonna be a rough week for me next week as an ex friend of mine kicked me out of her life exactly a year ago after a few decades being friends due to an ex of hers getting jealous and forcing her to kick me out due to being a guy despite never meeting me (refusing). That will be a good day for my cheat meal, not gonna lie. After back to business! I wont be reaching 65 pounds in 5 months like my first time doing keto but that’s fine I gained most of that back anyway.

(KM) #54

Buy yourself a dressmaker’s (soft) tape measure for your birthday! Sometimes a little linear progress is nice, the scale doesn’t always give it. And happy birthday! Mine’s today, I’m celebrating with a nice rib eye - like every day. :rofl:

(Robin) #55

Scales often don’t reflect the changes going on in your body.
I view stalls as a period when my body is finding its new balance.
I try to just carry on and eat right and forget the numbers. Then when I finally get weighed (alike at the doc’s), I have a pleasant surprise.

You don’t have a ton of weight to lose, you’ll get there.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #56

After my main fat loss, I had another 12 months of stable weight, but declining waist line. Obviously, I was adding lean mass that weighed as much as the fat I was continuing to lose. So great progress, even if it wasn’t reflected in the scale number.

As for cheat meals, you may find it hard to return to carnivore. Even if you don’t, you may still regret it. We just had a pizza made with a chicken crust, which was very tasty, and not at all like chicken. It’s fully carnivore, being made with chicken meat, cheese, and eggs. I was surprised that it tasted as good as it did. The Fathead recipe has almond flour in it, which I now avoid, because of the oxalic acid content.