The only thing that doesn't make sense to me

(Banting & Yudkin & Atkins & Eadeses & Cordain & Taubes & Volek & Naiman & Bikman ) #41

Net carbs are what most people count.
Net carbs = total carbs - fiber.
This is for the US and systems that use USDA labeling. I believe England and the EU present net carbs as the carb count.

An example. My carb count for the day, according to MFP is 33. I had 16 grams of fiber. That’s 17 grams of net carbs, which you can think of as non-fiber carbs. That’s what you count.

(Chris) #42

Makes sense! That brings me down to 43g carbs. I still having a tough time. Any resources online for meals or books you would recommend?
Thanks a millie


My ketones are always between .5 (rare) and 1.0 (often) for months on end and I’m still not consistently feeling the energy and appetite control. When I take exogenous ketones, my hunger goes away and my energy increases almost immediately. THat’s why I ask about ketones in general. Mine shoot up artificially and all the benefits regarding energy and appetite immediately surface.
I know exogenous is not the way to go and I avoided it for a long time, but in trying I see they DO help. At least for me


That doesn’t mean I want to spend $50 a pop on them or even continue to use them if they were FREE (which they are, when my body produces them) because they’re highly processed, too sweet and just kinda…weird

(Banting & Yudkin & Atkins & Eadeses & Cordain & Taubes & Volek & Naiman & Bikman ) #45

Everyone around here seems to like either
A: The Art and Science of Ketogenic Living
B: The Obesity Code

I have both on my kindle and no real desire to read either, but assume either one would work if you’re starting from scratch.

I think has a lot of free guides on how to live a ketogenic lifestyle on their site in the free area, if you’re not inclined to read a book.

I think my disinclination to read A or B is because all diet books are the same. A promise, a slag, some science to explain the program, and then, at the end, the program. Atkins was the only different one. Program up front, then the slag and some science.

(Chris) #46

LOL sounds good! :fist:

(Wendy) #47

Have you tried fasting? That seems to be a pretty consistent way to make sure your in ketosis. Are you consistently staying below 20 grams of carbs? I don’t measure ketones but I see the results of being in ketosis. I think if I was not I’d reevaluate my diet and see if there was something amiss. If my carbs were low enough then I’d maybe cut down on my protein and see what happened.


I fast when I’m not hungry but I’m not forcing any other sort of fast upon my body. Personally, I have spent a lot of years not listening to my body and re-learning how was shockingly difficult, so I intend to stick with that.
I’m in ketosis. I test ketones and they’re almost always .8 - 1.4 but I still have hunger unless I take exogenous ketones. My carbs are usually around 10-12 per day from veggies, so I"m totally covered there. KCKO, I guess

(Nathan Hall) #49

I haven’t gotten to read ‘The Art and Science of Ketogenic Living’, but I can assure you, ‘The Obesity Code’ is no “diet book”. :blush: There’s no “21 days to a leaner, healthier you” sales pitch / program. It primarily explains why the over simplified calorie model doesn’t work and how hormones, particularly insulin, play such a large roll in obesity. Anyone who has hung around here, or watched a few hours of Dr. Fung on YouTube, probably knows a majority of the key points in the book. One of my favorite things about Dr. Fung is that he’s not clutching this information tightly trying to sell a book. (Although I’m sure he’d like to see it do well, as would I.) He’s put this information out freely. The book consolidates this information into one stellar resource that is definitely worth a read. :grin:

(Banting & Yudkin & Atkins & Eadeses & Cordain & Taubes & Volek & Naiman & Bikman ) #50

And yet, I own it and may never read it. Go figure.

(linda) #51

These are good questions to ask and it makes sense to be confused because there are many experts out there!! - some credentialed - some use their own weight loss experience as their educational model - some have products to sell - some are specialists in specific treatment protocols (i.e. diabetes) and since this program is continuing to grow in popularity we rely on each other for insights and help. Consensus may be a challenge…That said:
I continue to learn about my body’s response to KETO and find feedback useful so I test my ketones and glucose levels periodically. I match that information with diet, mood, energy etc.
and it is helpful to me - no chasing - just information.


I totally agree! I test my glucose because it is really good feedback about what my body is doing in response to food. I take exogenous ketones because I tried them, found I feel wa way better with them, and never test ketones afterward because I already know they elevated my levels. I just feel better at the higher levels and my body doesn’t reach them (yet!) because my insulin resistance is not yet healed, so I have higher glucose readings than I would like
Works for me!

(linda) #53


(GINA ) #54

I agree about the diet books but would add that any low carb diet book has to add a section on why it’s NOT Atkins. They usually do that by misrepresenting Atkins, then saying how this “not a diet, but a lifestyle” is different than the misrepresentation.

(Alec) #55

Don’t eat the veg. Eat more fat.


Ketone levels have zero to do with fat loss nor does ketosis in general.

Using fat for fuel, “burning fat” is not the same thing as losing bodydat.

(Michael) #57

The only way to check if your are burning fat is to measure Breath Acetone.
Ketones in the blood are fuel available for use. Breath Acetone is a measure of current Ketone metabolism.
All things being equal if you eat according to your macros for weight loss you will lose weight while in Ketosis.
However, if you have a compromised metabolism all bets are off until you can up-regulate your metabolism by continuing to eat low carb with healthy fats, green veggies and adequate protein.
Also, at the end of the day “Calories In, Calories Out” does matter.

(Raj Seth) #58

And it matters for fat burning a lot more once your insulin is down. Then calories IN can include the calories that went in a long time ago (body fat), that are being used as energy source by your body. Hopefully, your body then signals it has enough plate fat before you exceed your daily energy needs. I don’t fully understand how that ends up working out, but n=many on this forum alone indicates that it seems to work out.
Of course, IF & EF help get there quicker. Try that too if you want to turbocharge the fat loss

(Brian) #59

I used maybe a half dozen pee sticks when I first started eating keto, mostly out of curiosity. Have never checked anything since. Keto breath was pretty strong in the beginning, too, which was a pretty good indicator. The keto breath has faded except maybe when I have an extra hard bit of exercise of one kind or another, then I get a little bit of it again.

Honestly, it’s just not something I care all that much about. I’m looking at things like my energy levels (improving), mental clarity (slowly improving), body shape (slowly getting comments about “getting skinny”), and scale numbers (slowly inching downward without much of a push at all, just eating “normally” most of the time). With all of that, like LaCheffre, it’s just not worth my time to care whether my ketone levels are on the lower side of things or the higher side of things. I suspect they move around anyway, kinda like cholesterol numbers…

(Chris) #60

This really confused me and now I’m stressing. This seems to contradict everything else I have read.