Are we supposed to be avoiding them altogether, or is it just that other oils are favourable. I’ve bought myself a lovely big bag of peanuts to snack on today and they are 97% peanuts, the other ingredients are sunflower oil and salt. Does this sound ok?
Personally I would avoid and I know others do too, but you’re in the early stages and still learning and finding what works for you - if they seem to fit with you then don’t worry.
I was avoiding seed / vegetable oils long before keto as they triggered bad reflux.
I’d prefer sunflower or a few of the other seed oils to grain & canola. I usually try to svoid legume (peanut & soy) oils, too, but sometimes you just can’t avoid things 100% of the time. As @Shortstuff said, if it works for you … just watch the amount of any nuts; the caloric intake can add up really fast, to the detriment of nutrition.
I thought I would redirect this thread rather than
start a new one. Is it better to have no fat or seed oil?
I was at Chik-Fil-a and ordered a club sandwich no bun. I got avocado lime ranch dressing and before pouring it on, I noticed the first ingredient was soybean oil. 34 g fat, 2 g carbs, 1 G protein. I poured it on should I have just eaten the sandwich? Or maybe ordered extra bacon on it?
There are theories that seed oils are really, really bad for us. This guy has a lot of blog postings about them:
There is also a theory of obesity that the polyunsaturated fats (PUFAs) in seed oils cause fat cells to be insulin sensitive, whereas saturate fat causes them to be insulin resistant, meaning you overeat if you eat PUFAs.
PUFAs are also highly susceptible to becoming rancid and generating byproducts when heated that are supposedly cancerous.
I personally try to avoid eating seed oils. However, if I go to Five Guys (a burger place in the Northeast of the US), they have peanuts, and I will eat them. I also sometimes will have fried chicken wings. And if I go out to eat, I have to eat meats that are likely seared in seed oils. Unless you want to be a hermit and cook everything yourself, you’ll be getting some seed oils.
The seed oils are rancid and foul when first pressed. They need to be deodorized, stabilized, winterized, and bleached in order to be made palatable. They are, by and large, extremely high in ω-6 fatty acids, which, while essential to our diet, are inflammatory when ingested in any quantity. They are mostly polyunsaturated fatty acids, which are vulnerable to oxidation when heated, and which also replace the cholesterol and saturated fat in our cell walls, with unknown consequences. Nina Teicholz has a lecture on this; I will try to find the link and post it. She also wrote about this in The Big Fat Surprise. Dr. Phinney says that when people find “too much fat” difficult to deal with on keto, it is usually because they fat they are using is a seed oil.
The most healthful fats to use are those that are mostly saturated and monounsaturated fat: butter/ghee, tallow, lard, bacon grease, and the fruit oils (avocado, coconut, and olive). These are the fats the human race has traditionally used throughout its history.
Yes I know all this. Read Nina’s book and found her seed oil section most interesting. My question is if on the road should I eat say a chicken salad without dressing, which would not be very satiating or add a bunch of salad dressing with seed oil which would give me satiating fat but also bad PUFAs?
Should I order a burger with mayo for the fat or no mayo to avoid the seed oil?
Does the badness of the PUFA outweigh the goodness of fat in terms of lower insulin response and satiety signaling? Maybe I should just have a jar of ghee or coconut oil in my car at all times?
FWIW I’d avoid the PUFA dressing. If the meal has enough protein it should be satiating.
As long as you’re not eating the seed oils all the time, it’s probably okay. I personally choose not to worry about it, since we don’t go out to eat all that often. But I am careful about what I purchase for home use.
I only have anecdotes. I knew seed oils weren’t good, so I limited them, but didn’t worry about it much. I have had gut issues since I can remember (IBS-C), and attributed it to wheat. Getting rid of wheat made it better, but not all the way. I would still have issues, they were just made worse with wheat/gluten.
Then, I listened to the LowCarb MD podcast where they interviewed Tucker Goodrich. His story about fixing his IBS (though his was D and not C), and having a regular bowel movement for the first time in 16 years made me think. I completely got rid of the seed oils, and before I knew it, I was feeling good. Then I made some Ranch dressing with regular mayo, and holy hell… AWFULNESS.
So, I try to avoid them completely. Do I think they’re probably okay in very limited amounts? Sure. They are hard to avoid. Various condiments… Nuts… All sorts of things have some sort of seed oil. Boo.
Going out is the hardest time, although they are also in many condiments. When I go out, I try to avoid fried foods at least, but even then, if it’s eat wings or go hungry, I’ll eat wings. And often everything will be cooked in seed oils. You can’t get around it, unless you never go out.
I personally have started eating more red meat, less chicken and avocado (not a big deal, as I don’t like it much other than in guacamole) and the like. But I can’t avoid these totally.
Eh… If your splitting hairs, it might make a small difference with something or the other, OR, it might not. But it’s definitely still Keto.
What matters is keeping your carbs below 20 a day. And not going crazy with your total cals. Granted, the great thing with Keto (for most people anyway) is that it’s a lot easier to control your intake, as fats and proteins make you feel more satiated. So if you just eat when your actually hungry, and not out of boredom, or for comfort, you will probably do great