PLEASE USE THE F'IN SEARCH FUNCTION (yes I'm shouting đŸ˜© )

#41

How does seeing another thread on a previously discussed topic waste your time exactly? You only click on the ones that interest you and bypass the others (one would think). You’re not obligated to respond to every thread that pops up. If you do think it’s wasting you’re time, then you’re just creating imaginary new problems for yourself :stuck_out_tongue:

(Mike Glasbrener) #42

I don’t mind helping people when they’re on the forum. I look at it as a way of paying back. I’m not where I want to be and will occasionally ask for help from others. Also there’s ways to tag threads/sections that I just learned about after 9 months on the forum! I am pretty techie also.

That said it seems the search might be under utilized and there may be ways to automate some of this
 But the community support here is like no other keto group I’ve seen. I must say the community here, in general, is more educated and keto and asks less question like “Is this crispy cream keto”? Followed by “Well I couldn’t help myself should I just have 5 more since I’m knock out of ketosis?”

So all in all could it be better? Well yeah. Is it the best forum I know of? Absolutely!

(Rob) #43

If you don’t understand that it is the collective weight of many many people (as expressed by you) ‘not wasting your time to search’ (and not cutting out the oft repeated questions) that leads to the collective ‘burnout’ and wasted time of the many people willing to answer questions then you’re not getting the issue. There are so many good questions and many attaboy threads (accountability, intro, progress, etc.) that are all worthy of people’s time, why not try to reduce the big repeaters just because you can’t be bothered to search.

You do you


#44

I will, and I think you’re overthinking what a forum is and how it’s used. I’m sorry this little public service announcement didn’t work out the way you’d hoped. Nothing’s going to change. Either get used to it or continue to be stressed and rage out over non-issues like people not using the search button before they make any moves on the board. This isn’t a place to walk on eggshells and if it turns into one, there will be a mass exodus. I don’t think any of us want that.

(Rob) #45

I don’t know what you were reading but its worked out fine. Lots of people agreeing and probably doing it and you saying that you cannot be bothered
 I call that a win all around.

Any overall improvement in the use of search is a win and your actions don’t matter one way or another. No-one is walking on eggshells and I have no rage
(you thought my shouting title was rage? :rofl:). I raised this for everyone’s benefit, askers and answerers and that is all. No-one is forced to do anything. When people are pointed to former threads that answer their question, they almost always like it and thank the person who referred them there. They could have gotten that answer hours or days earlier if they had done a few seconds of search. That’s exactly how good forums work
 keep on typing


(Tom Cox Jr) #46

I agree and have found myself to also be like this at times and I think it’s partly sort of like a learning curve but also a comfort zone issue as well as a not being “in the moment” issue. I also think that it’s a very common newbie action (in all forums) and would consider it just a normal part of the learning process. I also find that most people seem to have trouble determining which words or phrases to search for which I think is also a problem with “searching” in almost any format.

#47


and apparently to passive aggressively insult anyone who has a difference of opinion. Insinuating that anyone who doesn’t search before creating a thread is some kind of selfish jerk who’s purposely wasting everyone else’s time. That’s simply not the case.

(Rob) #48

Absolutely, which is why a reminder to have a go at a search is useful as it will get people up the learning curve faster. The most basic search terms do very well


(Rob) #49

Your perception is your reality. You can have the last word on that :grin:

#50

Mmmmm, well this all digressed nicely


(Rob) #51

Didn’t it
 :flushed:

#52

When a person gets all confrontational & preachy with an entire group of people, it tends to happen.

#53

@capnbob

Hey Kettle! This is Pot calling! Instead of creating a new post, couldnt you have added this point to the end of the last thread where you brought this up? Eh? Eh? See what I did there? :wink: :smile:

Im just winding you up
 On behalf of us newbies who are finding our footing on here.

I also see how some of your unavoidable repetitions will come from questions where newbies (or anyone) will know the search terms of their question, but wont necessarily know the search terms that willl get them to the answers.

Hands up, Ive been guilty of doing the “ahhhh im on my first few days of keto, help Im anxious” posts, and the info I got from the responses and the tone of encouragement and sincere kindness are what got me to actually stick it out. And then I have been proud to pay back the kindness that people showed me, by later answering the even newer newbies when they’ve done that too. Its been an absolute pleasure, personally. Surely you can just skip right past these posts if they bug you?

I feel your frustration, and hope you find ways to feel better. Youre probably doing this a lot already, but there’s also the option of teaching by example?

E.g. when you see a repeated post, suggest

  1. search words that will get them to good threads
  2. tags they might not have thought of or be aware of
    And nicest of all 3) a link to a specific post or two that will answer their question and simultaneously demonstrate the awesomeness of checking out old posts

Or
 do nothing about posts you find pesky, and enjoy some bacon instead :sunflower:

#54

Omg you guys’ mutual lovefest just made my morning! :laughing: Thanks. Now quite determined to see if i can casually get the words ‘spiffy’ and ‘pip’ into conversations today :raised_hands:

(Rob) #55

Like a couple of others you’ve (fairly :flushed:) misconstrued the tone of my initial request (which was supposed to be jokey exasperation for people wasting lots of their own time as well as their answerers) as personal frustration rather than as the blindingly obvious basic advice it is. I already tell people to search for the answer while giving them the reference all the time and they are happy and the new thread usually just ends but that isn’t very scaleable. Today the board is small (15,000+ with only thousands of topics). When it gets to 100,000 or 250,000+ members (which it will) this issue would be more overwhelming.

Everyone uses google search for most of their internet information gathering completely effectively yet when they show up in a forum, especially one as friendly as this one, some people’s google brain seems to fall out of their ears :exploding_head:. There isn’t an excuse that people don’t know the search terms - e.g. if you put in “I can’t lose weight” you will get a ton of good results even if you don’t know the word “stalling”. Some will read a few of these threads, some will ignore them and press on asking. Someone asks if there is a women’s forum, what if I have PCOS or Thyroid problems
 the search term is in the title - anyone has enough google-fu to be dangerous in this forum with a search :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: and if they don’t, fine. I don’t begrudge anyone (nor does my opinion matter) asking whatever they want, however, I don’t know another big internet forum that doesn’t have a sticky saying ‘Use the Search first’ - it’s internet 101. No-one is forced to do it
 just reminded that it makes sense first.

What some people also are missing is that this isn’t a debate to be won or lost as much as they may want to argue the toss. There is no binary outcome here. People who see the logic will use search more and those that disagree, won’t - there’s no right or wrong, just personal choice and action. I am just suggesting to people that they should do here what they do everywhere else.

PS As I said in the OP, I did search for this topic first :grin:

#56

@Capnbob I got your jokey approach, and I’ve had moments of exasperation when I come to the forum for intermediate and advanced inquiry and exchange. I think there is a worthy organizational/forum point to be made about the math of things eventually - because this is not a crisis hotline, etc. Being that computer programmers and software developers are behind the scenes here, I expect structures will continue to evolve.

As someone with organizational dev training and a healthy respect for the Discourse software - along with a ton of experience moderating forums - I do think it’d be cool if newbies were structured to be in a read-only state for longer periods of time. Like
 60-90 days, being that any and all newbie Qs are readable answers if they search. Otherwise, there is a likelihood that with greater numbers of newbies the forum could take on a constant crisis mode.

If I recall correctly, when I joined last summer, the automated process strongly encouraged me to intro myself with a post in that Newbies section. I totally ignored it though - as I find intros in large forums to be pretty existentially meaningless. So, that’s what’s happening for many newbies - they’re just trying to be good and write a post like the bot tells them to.

And the kind of post they write will naturally tend towards themselves. I don’t remember if the onboarding bot guides newbies through the search bar capacities or not, maybe it just doesn’t emphasize it as much as it could. Discourse has done a wonderful job overall for its new member onboarding, and Carl & Richard have done a great service in organizing the move from FB to here and making the forum accessible to newbies - it’s EPIC.

Over time I’m sure some hacks like multiple streams, or a newbie-posts only stream, or a much longer probationary read-only phase (which would naturally eliminate all those who show up just to have one burning question answered as if Google search does not exist
 rather than to participate in a longer term community development, etc) will happen. For now, my m.o. is to unapologetically ignore what I have no energy or little interest for and to be grateful for all the worthy forum features that are already in effect. If there are a ton of newbie Qs and I’m wanting to study keto, I’ll either try to search a topic I’ve been recently learning about or create a post based on my recent research for the common good

#57

Nobody would stick around for 90 days if they couldn’t make posts and interact with the community. Why join a community if you can’t be a part of it until 3 months later? That makes no sense at all.

#58

Different strokes for different folks - I’m a perpetual student myself - and there are human cultures where protocols that encourage self-effacement & self-management are integral to healthy human communities (as in 90% of human history’s aboriginal sensibilities - as well as in some modern non-Anglo cultures). Of course, increasingly rare in the digital world. It depends on how one thinks about a forum. I’ve been a reader of forums way more than a writer (because I’m a writer in general, lol). But have fun with your judgement call there.

(Garry (Canada)) #59

I find the search function option here, fantastic in comparison with many other forums I’ve frequented. It clearly is advantageous to use for both old and new members alike.
I believe that many Newbies post “previously asked/answered” questions because they want answers directly to “their” issue or concern
they don’t care what might have helped Tom, Dick, & Harry. It’s somewhat of a selfish survival reaction due to their fear, concern, etc. doing something against the grain. We need to remember that were talking about and with serious/non-normal health practice here
 It’s not online deals or daily news headlines were discussing.

The world has opened it’s doors to the new Keto movement. Let look at the questions from newbies as a benefit, rather than a detriment. Today’s newbie is tomorrow’s legacy member

KCKO.

Happy Valentine’s Day!

(Mike Glasbrener) #60

Indeed and well said! I look at the newbie section as kind of a training ground where people first land that are vulnerable and need guidance to get moving. The first few weeks to month or two amazing changes are happening to their body, likely for the first time. For people to reach out for personalized reassurance and guidance is wholly expected. Hopefully, like me and many others, the newbie section will be guided by them as well.

After all while this forum has much scientific data to support LCHF it’s not a scientific academic forum. It’s intent is to spread the word and help overturn the entrenched interests that are killing hundreds of millions of people with bad medical advice.

KCKO😀