Plan a cheat day or just let it happen?

[brownfat]

In 4+ years since going keto I’ve never “cheated” because my dietary rules are ones I can live with every day. I don’t have a calorie or strict carb limit but rather I don’t eat foods that aren’t good for me such as nothing made with vegetable oils, pulses, grains, refined starches or added sugars. When I feel like indulging myself there are plenty of options that fit within my self set limitations. I have no need or desire to “cheat” myself. Eating keto, many forms of fasting and exercise are tools for achieving my body composition goals. My goals are realistic so I have sufficient flexibility to sustain my choices and I have no interest in meeting someone else’s rules of purity.

[primal.peanut]

Happy anniversary! Restaurant food can definitely be tricky but it sounds like you went in with a plan and managed it well. Don’t let perfect be the enemy of good!

[Athena61]

Awww…thanks Neil! Yeah, I’m moving passed it, but it did leave me wanting to snack this afternoon. I made DH some keto chocolate chip cookies today and I had 1/2 to sample, but I wanted more.

[Janie]

That’s what I find annoying and why I limit my higher carb meals to a minimum. Doesn’t trigger cravings for me, but hunger. And one of the best benefits of keto for me is lack of hunger. Love it!

[Athena61]

This is so true. The end result from that meal was it stimulated hunger. Hoping tomorrow is back to normal.

Next week is going to be another situation for me as we will be visiting family out of town. It’s been really easy for me to get into keto because of being isolated during the pandemic. I do my own cooking, very few times eating restaurant/takeout foods. But I can’t always control the situation so I need to find ways to cope so I can KCKO.

[FrankoBear]

I started a few threads about falling off horses and wagons. I think the topics are related.

Falling off keto and finding a way back to it might actually be the most common manifestation in the community

Wagon falling is probably rife in any community of people who take an interest in nutrition. But the psychology of shape shame, and admitting a lesson learnt from a mistake, oppresses us into silence. The addictions, cravings, guilt, self criticism and social pressures are all wonky hurdles the wagon fallen must face and on stumble as they/we try to get back on it. [image] Horse falling has also been alluded to in brave posts in these forums. And for those who ride the highest horses, the fal…

Then I read Todd’s post (above) and realised we have been given some of the deepest wisdom, that I at least have read on this forum.

The Todd Allen approach synthesises years of information inputs on the physiological and psychological aspects of mindfully improving one’s physical and mental health.

Plan a cheat day or just let it happen?

In 4+ years since going keto I’ve never “cheated” because my dietary rules are ones I can live with every day. I don’t have a calorie or strict carb limit but rather I don’t eat foods that aren’t good for me such as nothing made with vegetable oils, pulses, grains, refined starches or added sugars. When I feel like indulging myself there are plenty of options that fit within my self set limitations. I have no need or desire to “cheat” myself. Eating keto, many forms of fasting and exercise …

Many thanks to the primary author (@Pbash) for rekindling the ‘eating carbs’ = ‘cheating’ instinct many newbies feel. It’s a normal response to their newly planned and motivated change for self improvement. It can instigate FOSS - Fear Of Self Sabotage… best to head it off at the pasta before getting caught in an avalanche (eating). Fear ambushes from many guises. I would contend that fear with its cousin anxiety are controlled by nutritional ketosis. But that is another topic. The cheating revisit has brought us to many wise, updated and considered inputs from a number of experienced practitioners.

There are a lot of threads on ‘cheating’ the WOE. And who doesn’t want to cheat woe. Except our WOE is an acronym for way of eating. The number of posts and threads about cheating indicate a contender for the top consideration in the pursuit of health through food. The WOC = Way Of Cheating , may be as frequent an approach to LCHF. I understand it as the sometimes detrimental instinctive human approach to seeking efficiencies, comfort, and convenience in life. Or avoiding hardship, the way we say it is hormesis.

https://www.ketogenicforums.com/search?q=Cheat

Oldies credentials. Am I an oldie? Started pursuing nutritional ketosis on December 24, 2014 after I watched my dad die over the duration of a year, following 5 years of decline, from the final stages of Alzheimer’s. I didn’t want to die like that if I could help it. I was obese, had symptoms of diabetes and a head full of highly conflicted human nutrition science. Sometimes I imagine where my health and self would be now, if I had continued SAD eating interspersed with low fat, calorie counting, starvation dieting that I had been repeating since I was 10 years old, when I was teased for being fat. Low Carb Healthy Fats (LCHF) eating saved me a lot of health issues woe. That is my first point in the psychology of ‘cheating’. If I was to think of food as a reward for a special event or for ‘being good’ (like my Labrador puppy), I flip that momentary thinking to reflecting on life experienced history. That helps me with impulse control.

It has been almost 6 years of LCHF and nutritional ketosis. One thing that has recently changed regarding the circular debates (and occasional arguments) about carbohydrate types and volume in a diet, is technology. These days cheat meals can be considered experiments in individual responses to a variety of food resources. If one wears a continuous glucose monitor (CGM), a much better birthday present than a cheat meal (but you can do both), one can see their individual response to food tests, plus can see the ramifications, such as the return of cravings, or the number of days it takes to stop thinking about birthday cake subsequent to the test and related to the results of the test (intensity and duration ) of blood glucose variation from a steady baseline.

So, with these technological changes, and shuffling a few letters around, these days the Way Of Cheating has become a Way Of Teaching.

TLDR KCKO

[Shortstuff]

Neither. If I fancy a treat I’ll have one, but it’s rare and never seen as a cheat as when it happens it’s a deliberate choice I have made.

[KetoRocks]

If you plan something its a goal…cheating is when you violate your rule…which if you planned it isn’t cheating…is it?
Maybe self sabotaging and expressing incongruence and conflict…but “cheating”?
Not if you are honest with yourself about what you are doing.
You are already planning it by writing about it aren’t you?

I think of cheating as what the not very bright kids did at school to pass exams.

[PaulL]

I wouldn’t read too much into the term “cheating.” It’s a common part of the way people look at dieting for “weight” (actually fat) loss. The attitude appears to be one of “I know what I have to do, but what can I get away with?” whereas the most helpful way to approach the ketogenic way of eating is to think of it along the lines of “how can I change my food choices to promote the greatest health possible?” The fact that a healthy diet will encourage the body to shed excess stored fat gets lost in the social pressure to lose “weight.”

The additional fact that sugar and carbohydrate have an addictive effect on many people also leads to the desire to find ways of retaining carbohydrate in the diet, much as newly-sober alcoholics look for ways to retain some amount of alcohol in their lives. A bit of wisdom from A.A. that is relevant here is that total abstinence is actually psychologically and physiologically easier to manage than trying to indulge in moderation. But not what some people want to hear, to be sure!

[Fangs]

When I started keto I dropped cold-turkey all my previous carb-loaded fav foods, including beer. I felt no deprivation nor cravings for any of it. Didn’t miss it. Still don’t 3 1/2 years later. So I really do not understand so-called ‘cheat meals’ or ‘cheat days’, etc. Before anyone accuses me of being a food Nazi or an insensitive lout, note that I said I don’t understand not that I don’t accept we’re all different and have to deal with different issues.

I get this. Be very happy and I know you are that you didn’t fall into the dieting insanity many of us had to deal with and hated.

I was polar opposite. I was like you with no med troubles, did great thru life but started putting on some lbs around age 43 after my kid was born and then ‘I looked into diets’ and what a rollercoaster ride after that

I understand the cheating part cause ya wake up and say I will stick to my eating plan and then ya go off and justify eating XYZ crap and then ya feel like a failure cause you didn’t hold your own word to yourself. You can’t do that how can you hold anything you say as a truth and it does put ya in failure feeling land.

I fought carbs like the devil was on my tail.

Your 3.5 yrs later and you are doing well and good and didn’t have that battle. I am now at year 3.5 of zero carb and I can say I won’t ‘cheat’ or eat off plan. I have no desire. Carbs give me nothing. My plan has done what I need it to do for me and that is all any of us can get from our plans. That sense of calm and comfort and knowing we can go long term without a darn daily battle of craving/dieting BS

In general to the OP, I am on a lifestyle plan long term. I took that crap word ‘diet’ out of my life. Yes a diet is a menu but to me that stupid word meant failure so many times.

Everyone has to know them personally and if you know you, act on what works for you.

I would never eat off plan now cause I would be a train wreck and of course being zc I have other convictions for my plan that I follow but in the end each of us must know ourselves, travel our path and make a long term eating plan that truly works for us and never against us…that will be way different for each of us of course!

We only cheat ourselves each time we make a statement and fail to act on it. So if you plan in high carb junky meals then own it. If you want whatever food then choose it. But if you are one who can’t do this then ya best own that part of it too, who we are to make our plans work for us…good luck finding your path thru it all.

[KetoType2]

No worries. Eat the cake. Then decide if it was worth it.

[KetoGolem]

So if you plan in high carb junky meals then own it. If you want whatever food then choose it. But if you are one who can’t do this then ya best own that part of it too, who we are to make our plans work for us…good luck finding your path thru it all.

I think this is right on. What works for one person may not work for another. But for almost all of us, things have to be considered for a long time here. It’s not like a week or a month is going to “cure” us and we’ll be young and immortal with no worries again. If we’re making a change for the better, then it has to be something we can live with, something that’s sustainable for a long time.

Maybe there’s a real biological “hard thing” at work, and maybe not. Some people just eat low-carb, lower their insulin, and lose a lot of weight and are happy. Others reverse diabetes and are likewise happy. And then some have a real struggle on their hands.

The struggle or not can also be psychological. It definitely is for me.

[PaulL]

Eat the cake. Then decide if it was worth it.

The problem with that advice is the risk of addiction.

I know quite a few people who can be quite happy drinking a glass of whiskey and then stopping. I also know others who, if they had a glass of whiskey, would be unable to stop until the bottle—or the case—was gone. I have even seen recovering alcoholics drink a glass of non-alcoholic beer and then be off to the races.

I am the type of person whose idea of “having just one” where sugar is concerned is one sheet cake, or one dozen glazed doughnuts (though in my case it was usually three dozen before I could stop). Now, usually only about 20% of the population is vulnerable to any particular addiction, so the chances that your advice might work are actually pretty good, but you risk causing devastation to someone in that particular 20%.

[Fangs]

The struggle or not can also be psychological. It definitely is for me.

yes it has to come down to how you want to live long term and gain some results but we also know ‘thru science’ literally that holding your plan and giving up alot of ‘sugar/chemical foods’ will take your there ya know.

but we have to know us and make it work. There is NO one diet fits all in my mind ever, but there is true science that shows how foods work against us, so we have to find ‘that balance’ truly that suits us, our sweet spot, without going into ‘obsession crazy diet land’ and just change ourselves in real calm fashion…and I tell ya from my past experience with it all, it is darn hard LOL but with time and experimenting and more IF WE focus on real truths that effect us personally we can make that plan that gives us all we require. Time tho is super important and your focus can’t be on losing like 3-4 lbs per week and then the ‘what is wrong with me’ post…long term. Takes time. We didn’t put it all on overnight and we ain’t taking it off that fast but underlying is habit change, real life change, real food choices that suit us and how can we live our lives as we require all ‘in line’ with what we require to gain health?

hard road to travel, darn right it is

focus on what you need, learn real truths about what it takes for you and how you can do this ALL about you and in the long time end, we find truly our best plan ever!

There really is hard phsycial body thing at work for many…but in the end we ALL got mind games on top of physical…some are just not as damaged of a body and can correct faster and some need more healing thru their food choices.

Again where you are at, just KNOW you and accept it and always act on what works for you

[KetoType2]

I am assuming Pbash is capable of making that decision.

[Polly1]

Happy Anniversary!

[Athena61]

Thanks, Polly!

[monsterjuice]

I read that entire thing and based on the things you said my take away was that sugar addiction is up there. One sugar addicted thing and you went on a 3 month binge. Same thing happens to drug addicts. I’m not trying to prove you wrong just my observation from some of the things you said. I’m a sugar addict. And I’m trying to break the cycle for myself. I think if you look at diets, sugar addiction is one of the biggest addictions worldwide. Probably the biggest to be honest.

[ctviggen]

If one wears a continuous glucose monitor (CGM), a much better birthday present than a cheat meal (but you can do both), one can see their individual response to food tests, plus can see the ramifications, such as the return of cravings, or the number of days it takes to stop thinking about birthday cake subsequent to the test and related to the results of the test (intensity and duration ) of blood glucose variation from a steady baseline.

I just wish they’d come down in price. The one I used to wear (Free Style Libre) is up to $140/month. Yikes!

In terms of blood glucose, the damage isn’t much. Here’s my CGM from Thanksgiving, 2017. The 9.7 was the meal (don’t eat bfast), the second bump is dessert. The 8.2 at night is another helping of the meal. Between each two lines is one hour. So, my blood sugar goes up and back down to normal in about 1 hour.

[FrankoBear]

I’m a sugar addict. And I’m trying to break the cycle for myself.

Yep, me too.

But the way I think about sugar addiction is that I am not the sugar addict. My passengers are.

That is to say that the microbiome that communicates to my conscious self somewhere in the complexity of the brain via the gut-brain axis and vagus nerve, are the ones who are asking for the sugar or sweet carbohydrates. If I can manipulate the microbiome, which apparently can change with each meal, and encourage a majority (sounds like the US election) of the population to be fat fuelled and protein loving, then the signal from the sweet carbohydrate lobby is quashed.

So I feed the bugs that I want to work for me as I carry them around inside and on me.