Omg. The math!?!?!?!

(Kathy Miller) #1

Ugh. I’m so confused. And in information overload.

Background: 50 year old woman who has gained 75 pounds over that past 25 years. You know the story—kid after kid after kid, the weight never goes away, love me some carbs, don’t love to exercise, blah blah blah. I generally avoid blood work like the plague because my cholesterol is high, and I tried statins—they worked—but left me with muscle pain. So I stopped. Against medical advice. Finally got blood work done and my doctor called and told me that I’m a heart attack ready to happen. (Fun news to hear). Family history of heart attacks and heart disease. My number is 247 total cholesterol—which is high, but not horrific—but 33 hdl and ldl 168. My triglycerides are 280. My chol/hdlc ratio is 7.5–which is giving my dr and my dietician mother fits. From what I’ve read, to get those down, I have to lose weight. I know people who have made the change to Keto and they lost weight. So that’s what I started on Friday. Ater my dr told me that I’m going to drop dead. (My glucose is 93–in the green but pushing the 99 cut off).

Since Friday, I’ve lost 7 pounds. 198 starting weight, now 191. I have asked for a ketone blood test reader for mother’s day, so I have no idea if I’m in Ketosis, but I’ve dropped all sugar, grains, starchy vegetables, and fruit from my diet. It’s basically meat and veggies and cheese. (In direct contradiction to everything my mother has said to do.)

The more I read, the more confused I am about counting the carbs and protein, about macros, about how many I am supposed to have, about refeeding, about intermittent fasting—which I am prone to do bc I’m not a breakfast person and don’t really eat until 10 or so anyway. And about the glucose connection.

I’m trying to exercise 5 days a week. From nothing to that is huge. And I’m really not hungry. I’m obsessing about the scale—and if it doesn’t go down everyday, I feel like I’m not doing it right.

I don’t know how to figure all the numbers. I also still have 4 kids at home with the other two coming home for the summer from college. So, I’m cooking for 8 people—one of whom has a dairy allergy. Where can I go to figure this out??? How do I make this long term change work when I’m not just cooking for me. The past few night have been difficult…most of the time I have had a different dinner which makes makes the two teenage girls look at me like “why do I have to eat this when you’re not bc you want to lose weight.” (We have one who thinks just eating fruit and carbs will keep weight off—she’s my stepdaughter…she’s listening to her mother :roll_eyes: … Anyway, if you e made it this far, thank you. I’m basically looking for help that will explain how I do the numbers in a way that won’t make my eyes glaze over. (I hated chemistry and math—it’s a thing :wink: )

Thanks so much for any help you can give.

(charlie3) #2

I use a food tracker called cronometer. It is cloud based, will run on phone, tablet, or we browser and keep everything updated. It’s free unless you want to store recipes. I happily paid the $35 a year subscription. It has a database of most food items, processed and generic and you can put in custom foods and it can be configured specifically for keto, for instance, if you want to use net carbs, as I do, instead of total carbs. You can set targets for all nutrients and crono’s reporting will keep track of that. It took me weeks to tweak my food choices to finally get to 20 grams net carbs eating food I like.

(Adam Kirby) #3

This is the article for you.

(Jay AM) #4

One step at a time. First off, don’t worry about fasting. We don’t recommend it before you are fat adapted. Don’t worry about refeeding, lower the exercise for now. Would you let someone tell you every day that you’re fat and not doing it right? Hopefully not. So don’t let your scale do it. If you already don’t eat breakfast, that’s fine. You’re trying to learn more intuitive eating with keto. Below is my quick beginner manual.

We have a few sayings here, “keep calm, keto on” and “trust the process.” Keto isn’t a quick weight loss diet. It’s a health gaining way of eating with fat loss as a side effect. If the scale is an unhealthy obsession, put it away for a couple of months or give it to a neighbor you don’t like.

There are two phases to ketosis and a ketogenic lifestyle.

Nutritional ketosis is phase one. Your body begins to produce and uptake some ketones while dumping the rest. It will still search for glucose to use as fuel. In this phase it’s not an efficient process. It has to work actively to get rid of stored glycogen, clean up excess blood sugar, and turn on the ability to use ketones.

Fat adaptation is phase two. Your body is efficiently producing ketones from intake and stored body fat and is also using them efficiently for energy. It takes around 6-8 weeks of strict keto to achieve for many but not all.

The basic “rules” I go by and many others can agree with especially for beginners are:

*20g net carbs max (you might tolerate more but, starting out, 20g net carbs or less will get you into ketosis.)

*Moderate protein (Moderate means eating different meats and eggs. Preferably meats with their own fat or meats you will add fat to. We aren’t trying to eat protein to be full, we want to add enough fat to our meals to be full with. If you are searching for a number, 1g-1.5g per kg of lean bodyweight is a good goal based on the 2 Dudes recommendations.)

*Fat to satiety (add fat to every meal and, if you are hungry, eat more fat. Don’t be afraid of fat. It is energy.)

*Do not restrict calories

*Do not exercise excessively in an effort to lose weight

*Drink plenty of water

*Get plenty of sodium and other electrolytes (Try home made ketoade)

NEW KETO GIRL- first week blues!
(Adam Kirby) #5

My problem with this “guideline” of low carb is it’s meaningless to most people because they don’t know their LBM, and requires an OCD approach towards your food. If you’re eating protein as part of whole foods like meat, fish, and eggs, you’re probably getting an acceptable amount of it. No need to go more in depth when you’re starting out.

(Allan L) #6

@J_A-M has given some very good advice, I ditto everything said! Nothing to add. :wink:

(Jay AM) #7

One thing I see in a lot of newbies is crazy amounts of protein and low everything else. Or, avoiding protein. I leave that in there but, you’re right that it can be a little complicated. I think I assume people would ask me about it. I’ll find a way to word it more newbie friendly because, moderate really means squat.

(Adam Kirby) #8

Based on her reported diet of meat, cheese, and vegetables, I’m guessing that her protein’s fine. Once she gets more established with the diet she can choose a protein-phobia or protein-philia camp. :grin: (hopefully not, tho, this protein war is kinda tiring)

(Jay AM) #9

It’s not about phobias. To start with, protein isn’t as satisfying as fat. Where a lot of people say, “I have to count or I’d overeat a million eggs and sausages.” If they would intake fat to satiety instead of protein, they probably wouldn’t have to count. Of course, they are adamant they could overeat anything. Considering fat will make you nauseated and even physically ill if you try, I’m doubtful but no one’s taken on the challenge that is convinced they could overeat. So, when I share recommendations, I try to make it well understood that we are aiming for fat to satiety. Satiety isn’t something a lot of people are as experienced with, usually to prior dieting and other stuff. That’s why I find protein important. We have n=1 evidence here of lowering protein and raising fat breaking stalls. Keto was never meant to be a protein free for all but, it also isn’t meant to severely restrict it (the opposite problem people can have which has lots of fun side effects on its own.) It’s in the recommendations the way it is because I want people to get a good start in the world of not having to obsess over counting. That’s why I call the protein recommendation a goal and not a limit. They make an attempt to get their protein and then add their fat to it to satiety, hopefully setting up a good base of not counting and intuitive eating. I leave it for those who need a goal to reach to feel good about their progress. Meanwhile telling them to get rid of the scale and eat lots of fat. Which is jarring enough on its own. After they are keto for a while and hit fat adaptation, they invariably decide what they want to tweak and change.

(Jo) #10

I agree with @Akirby83. What the OP needs right now is a simplification, not more math.

I am in her ball park re age and height, I may have a bit more LBM but not by much. I track everything that goes into my mouth with Cronometer, and my experience has been that about 4-6 oz of meat, 2-3 eggs, and 3 oz of cheese and/or other dairy will give about 60-80 grams of protein a day.

This is a suggestion that people can actually measure and hold on to. Then later once they have established a routine they can tweak their macros.

(Diane) #11

I think I recall one of the doctors interviewed on the 2 keto dudes podcast saying he tells his patients to eat bacon and eggs for the first two weeks. Simple advice that isn’t confusing. So, there are many ways to simplify the diet.

At first I kept either egg salad, chicken salad, or tuna salad in my fridge (with plenty of mayo, pickles or olives, a little celery, and mustard or hot sauce for flavor). That way I always had a protein with fat for a quick meal. Dinner might be a salad with greens (Romain, spinach and/or spring mix), maybe a little cucumber, some avocado, shredded cheese and a creamy, low carb dressing. Maybe a few sunflower seeds or pumpkin seeds for crunch. Add in some chicken or boiled eggs for protein. I also liked a couple of hamburger patties with a nice blue cheese dressing or bacon and sharp cheddar (both quick and easy). A chicken breast baked with the jalapeño artichoke dip from Costco. Don’t skimp on the dip! I also like the polish dogs from Costco (purchased by the package) served with mayo mixed with Dijon mustard and some low carb coleslaw (really easy to make) or cabbage sautéed in bacon grease. I always kept some hard boiled eggs and cooked bacon around.

When I got hungry and didn’t want/need a lot of protein, I snacked on cheese (most any kind is good, brie can be especially fatty), olives, macadamias, pecans, almonds, cream cheese and avocados. I kept my servings sizes of nuts down to an ounce (two at most) to keep too many carbs from creeping in. I ate pork rinds, really good smeared with some cream cheese (though they have some protein too).

These are some of the ways I tried to simplify my “meal planning” when starting out. If I were you, I would mainly focus on paying attention to how many grams of net carbs were in the serving sizes I was eating and keep a running total for the day. Try not to go over 20. I was never a big protein eater before, so I kept my protein about the same. Whenever I was hungry, I tried to eat fatty foods. For the first couple of weeks, I was hungry ALL THE TIME. If you are, don’t worry about it. Your body is still looking for the carbs you used to use for fuel. After the first couple of weeks, my hunger started decreasing. I stopped getting hungry between meals. Then I started having more time between meals before I got hungry…

It will get much easier, I promise!

I hope this helps!

Edit: typos

(Kathy Miller) #12

Thank you!

I just got the Keto Diet Tracker App and hope that it will help. Now I’m freaking out about the amount of fat that I’m supposed to eat!! I know it’s a journey, but I’ve never been very patient!! :smirk:

So glad for this forum!

(Diane) #13

That’s pretty common. Every diet I’ve ever tried before Keto (excluding Atkins), was calorie and fat restricted. It feels so wrong! I just know I feel so much better about 8 months in. So, the payoff is worth the initial effort and… it does get easier :grin:.

(Kathy Miller) #14

Thank you! This is really helpful. I’m trying not to be afraid of how much fat I am supposed to eat. With high triglycerides, it seems so counter-intuitive that I am really struggling. Trying! But seriously struggling!!

(Kathy Miller) #15

@akirby83 You’re so right! Bc I’m sitting here thinking, “what’s LBM???”:face_with_monocle::rofl:

(Kathy Miller) #16

@J_A-M How do you know if you need electrolytes?

(Jo) #17

LBM = Lean Body Mass. This is what your body would weigh without all the fat. Some scales measure this but there is really no good way to do this at home, and that’s why I think referencing the amount of protein that you eat to your LBM is kind of a futile way of putting it since it is so hard to know exactly what that number is.

(Jo) #18

Main symptom is the so called Keto Flu - feeling crappy, achy, cramps etc. It is a good idea to add extra salt to your diet because you’re losing more of it during Keto. Search for KETOAID on this forum and you’ll find a recipe to make an electrolyte water at home without added chemicals/sugar

(Kathy Miller) #19

@fiddlebanshee Thanks—there’s NO WAY I would know that!!! :woman_shrugging:t2:

(Kathy Miller) #20

I saw the info about ketoade and the part about check with your doctor threw me off. I don’t think I’ve had any Keto flu symptoms, but my seasonal allergies are so bad right now that I don’t think I would know anyway. I’ll keep that in mind, though.