Not reached ketosis


(Veronica) #21

I find cocoa and water much too bitter, I did try that once. I absolutely love Lindt 90 % dark chocolate which just tastes so rich and 1 square is enough, but I have decided I don’t need it every day and I did a bit of tracking of my carbohydrates so on days I have raspberries say, I won’t have the chocolate and vice versa, then the full carbohydrate amount will come to about the same.

I tracked an example of a days eating (lowering amount of berries and nuts) and it came to 19 total carbs so this is what I’ll eat today and I’ll keep making alterations to remain just at or under 20 total carbs.

Now I just need to up my exercise regime a little. Sounds like you’re pretty fit, or fitter than me, walking as well as lifting weights. I just walk daily (45min) except on the weekends and I don’t lift. I haven’t seen the inside of a gym in years.

(Megan) #22

Hi there, welcome to the forum. I don’t know anything about lipedema sorry but do a google search on Siobhan Huggins. She speaks at low carb conferences and is interviewed by folks in the low carb and carnivore community on their podcasts.


If you eat around 20ish grams of carbs a day, within 48hrs you’ll be in ketosis. Once your liver starts running out of glycogen, you start entering ketosis. It’s not an on/off black and white thing like people want it to be. The stored glycogen in your muscles don’t keep you out of ketosis, that will burn off separately as you use them.

So if your carbs have been right, you’ve been in ketosis a while now. Your pain (randomly) being greatly reduced is a very good sign of that given that ketones themselves are very anti-inflammatory.

While you’re still adapting, take some time to get some recipe ideas, Youtube is good for that. Eating random combinations of cheese, nuts, seeds, and stuff is fine at first, but can you really live like that? You’re going to want to have actual meal ideas and not live on a diet of randomly picked things that don’t equal real life meals.

(Robin) #24

“In ketosis’ is a phrase I never worried about. I just kept my carbs under 20g…. (All of them, including the fiber, and I always round up just to be safe.)

I’m actually not scientifically educated well enough to really understand what In Ketosis means… although I have read the definition here many times.
But it’s like my car, I don’t understand how it works, but it does. I just give it the right fuel and go.

So if you are on plan, you are a-okay. You’ll feel great soon.
You got this.

(Veronica) #25

If you know it’s working and are feeling good and getting the results you want, then that’s really what matters whether you count total carbs or net carbs, you know how your body feels. I decided to start counting the total carbs because it just seemed a lot easier as I’m still so new to all this. Later on as my body gets used to the change and I’m fat adapted I’ll probably proceed to just counting the net carbs. I only started the ketogenic diet two weeks ago to combat my lipoedema so have a lot to learn and this forum is certainly the right place to gather knowledge, so happy I found it and loving the positive vibes :slight_smile:


Understandable. It took me almost 10 years on low-carb and some carni trials to feel things that very differently (I can’t handle bitter at all, I love coffee but need the least bitter one and I drink it super weak. cocoa is less bitter but it has some bitterness, sure)…

19g carbs, that’s great. I couldn’t do that before carnivore, it’s very low but so many people can (even vegans sometimes, it’s crazy :D). On my original keto I had to track each and every day to make sure I don’t go too high. I don’t like tracking but it has its uses and I am used to it (but take breaks for my mental health :)). 80g on low-carb was nice, I could stay there without tracking very easily, just ignoring the most carby items. Going lower required more effort but it was worth it. Carnivore is easier for me than mere keto and tracking isn’t needed for staying low with my carbs.

I don’t consider myself exactly fit, I just… Do something little? I am a lazy one with no stamina nowadays (I get winded super easy :frowning: ), I just need walking and want muscles. My tiny exercise is below the bare minimum I need and expect from myself. Walking is life, it’s normal, we need to move around and go out… And I always was a healthy one who apparently got energy from sunshine and loved Nature. I think I need cardio but that’s tough.
I wouldn’t go to a gym, I am way too asocial for that and live far from villages and towns anyway. I have my weights and barbell and dumbbells and made my press bench. It’s good but I can forget about my workout easier (even between reps, the break is too long and there is the kitchen…). But until I don’t stop having workout days every week, it’s not so bad. Restarting is very difficult, I rather never will stop instead.

(Veronica) #27

I definitely should be doing more lifting as I have muscle weakness, and ought to try and do something to improve that. I don’t know if it’s because there’s some lipoedema also in my arms which makes them feel heavy, or if it’s just general muscle fatigue, but I’ve got a pair of ridiculous light (0.5kg) weights, and I do a few sets with them and my arms really feel that afterwards. So apart from my morning walks I would say, although I’m slim, that I’m in pretty bad shape.

(Jane) #28

I ma curious as to why you think you aren’t in ketosis? What are you basing it on?

(Veronica) #29

The honest answer to whether I’m in ketosis is I just don’t know. I was expecting to feel more energy when I hit ketosis, but my energy is pretty low. My appetite is reduced, and my pain is also reduced, so those are signs something’s working. But I’ve just been feeling a total lack of energy and am waiting for that to improve. I do take salt for electrolytes and I drink plenty of water. And another positive thing is I seem to be sleeping better. But throughout the day I just feel … drowsy. It does improve with exercise. When did you reach ketosis and how did you know you were there?


I barely even feel 0.5kg… I mean, it’s like a feather, almost. BUT it depends on the exercise, once I actually could tire me out with only that (I needed to use a bottle as my smallest dumbbells are 2kg and I can’t use them for anything during my lifting as they are so very light), it just took many reps (and I wasn’t used to it anyway) and I prefer doing normal lifting, 12 reps at most and then I raise the weight.
But we all start somewhere, I used ridiculously tiny weights in the beginning, I used my 3.25kg dumbbells a lot, I think I started with them for my chest exercise, it’s pathetic :smiley: I still have little weights and my muscles didn’t show any improvement visually yet (I started years ago but it’s me and I had long breaks) but my weights still got somewhat heavier and it’s a nice feeling.

No wonder if you feel your muscles in the beginning even with small weights, you get used to it quickly. It’s always best to start carefully, I have learned that.

(Jane) #31

I think you are confusing ketosis with fat adaptation. You will be in ketosis within 48 hrs with < 20 g carbs. Fat adaptation takes weeks and is different for everyone and more difficult to quantify.

For me, it was about 6 weeks. One day I looked at the clock and it was almost 3 pm and I had forgotten to eat lunch (and wasn’t eating breakfast). I have forgotten a lot of things in my life, but forgetting to eat was NEVER one of them! LOL. Until keto.

(Megan) #32

Some people don’t experience increased energy, just as some don’t experience increased mental clarity or some of the other things listed as possible benefits of eating ketogenically. It seems very individual. Decrease in pain, reduced appetite and sleeping better is great!

(Veronica) #33

Hi, yes I have read about Siobhan Huggins and her success, and seen her before and after pics, her transformation was impressive. And also very impressive that she following her transformation and experience with the ketogenic diet decided to help fellow lippy ladies, and dedicate her time to do that, a very impressive young lady.

I have read about several lippy ladies’ individual journeys and varying degrees of success following a ketogenic diet, but what made me want to try it for myself was that in all those ladies there was a reduction in pain. And I can honestly say it’s been the same experience for me. Now I just have to keep building my diet so I don’t end up eating the same everyday lol. So far my staples have been, eggs, beef, bacon, cheese and cream. I do a few veggies for variety, and a small handful of nuts and seeds of some variety, and of course I couldn’t be without my morning coffees with cream, but I feel over time I need to add more items I can eat whilst still remaining in ketosis, as I have greatly benefitted already from its anti-inflammatory effect.

(Veronica) #34

Yes, the pain reduction and better sleep have been wonderful :slight_smile: I am beginning to understand a bit more about ketosis and fat adaptation and I think I was confusing those two. I understand it’s very individual and I think I’ll just stop waiting for all those other benefits such as more energy, mental clarity, etc, and just enjoy what I have now, which is better mobility because of the reduced pain. It’s surely a promising start! I did think, perhaps, once the body becomes properly fat-adapted perhaps there is an increase in energy then? But understand that may not be the case for everyone, age and various health conditions, medications, etc probably also play into it. But I have no complaints, it’s early days and so far feel I am benefitting from the ketogenic diet well.


Who knows? It never happened to me. But one can do keto in so many different ways, maybe I just didn’t do it right and long term enough…? I am still hopeful :slight_smile: I definitely feel a bit better when I eat close to zero plant carbs so that might be my solution. Of course energy level isn’t just about our diet, I try to do other things right as well and we will see.
I am not exhausted all the time, it’s not that bad normally, I just have a general low-ish energy level (and born laziness, that stays with me until death :)).

(Veronica) #36

Yes I think so too now that I’ve been confusing the two, I must admit I still don’t really understand the science behind the ketogenic diet and why it seems to work so well in reducing inflammation, which was my main goal, that and improved energy and mobility. When your body finally became fat adapted, did you feel an increase in energy at all? As to reduced appetite, I think I already have that, and it’s probably to do with the lowered insulin which in turn, from what I can gather, lowers the hunger hormone. Do you do any exercise at all?

(Veronica) #37

I understand lazy. I always say to my partner my spirit animal is the sloth, lol. I’ve always been like that so that drowsiness and laziness is an intrinsic part of me. When there’s no rush I just take it easy. Life is short enough without wasting time striving for perfection or supreme efficiency. I believe it’s much more important being kind to yourself.

(May the blessing of bacon be always with you) #38

Part of the problem with a high-carbohydrate diet is the damage from the excess of glucose, and another part is damage done by the resulting excess of insulin. Hyperinsulinaemia causes systemic inflammation.

Another possible cause of systemic inflammation is eating too much of the industrial seed oils (soybean, cottonseed, corn, cornflower, safflower, sunflower, and so forth), with their excessive percentage of ω-6 fatty acids, which, while necessary to the diet, are inflammatory when overconsumed.

So returning to a more appropriate diet, with limited carb intake and a greater reliance on mono-unsaturated and saturated fats, does a great deal to reduce inflammation.

It’s more that athletes notice a drop in their performance, until their muscles re-adapt to using fatty acids for fuel, then performance returns to its previous level as the adaptation proceeds. In any case, even those people who do experience a real boost in energy tend to find themselves returning to normal over time.

As for insulin and hunger, elevated insulin interferes with the satiety hormone, leptin. (Think of a bear trying to fatten up on berries in the autumn; the extra energy it’s taking on should not be allowed to reduce appetite.) Once insulin drops, it stops interfering with appetite and things return to normal.

(Veronica) #39

I think my carbohydrate consumption must’ve been quite high before keto, as I was addicted to sugar in the form of dried fruits, nut and fruit bars and I loved my trail mix. I also would eat a whole shop bough pizza all by myself every weekend, and some days I just ate sandwiches, so my diet was totally rubbish. I was slim, however, but had virtually no energy, daily headaches and dizzy spells. I believe my poor diet was allowing for systemic and chronic inflammation even though I believed I was healthy. Now only two weeks into keto, I am hopeful that I can improve and even fix the damage I did to my immune system. My first signs that it is so far working is I no longer have those awful energy dips that had my legs shaky, my energy, although still not great, has been much more stable since I gave up the carbs. And I have a feeling if I start letting those carbs back into my life again the inflammation and all the other problems will return, so that’s plenty motivation right there. I must say I am thrilled to have discovered this forum as I still have so much to learn about this WOE, it’s a real encouragement.


When I was a kid, I was kind of a perfectionist despite being lazy… But I had way more energy back then. I had lots of extracurricular activities and I just did them all and it kept me in action of something?
Passion still makes wonders, I am not too lazy then, it’s a different and very good state of mind.

Yes, many people get it from ketosis only. I had to wait until fat adaptation myself and it wasn’t my appetite, it was the type of hunger. I still enjoy the fact I have lost that strong, sharp, sudden, attention seeking hunger I had before.
I actually needed less food to get satiated and satisfied for a while after fat adaptation but it was temporal and then I needed further changes in my woe to have a chance at fat-loss. It was good, this way I have find a better woe. I always have this, I lower my carbs for fat-loss (not only but it’s the initial driving force) and that may or may not help with that but I get other benefits.

That is a great change even without significantly higher energy, good! Hopefully the latter will arrive later too, maybe after some tweaks?