Thank you for your service!
And a fantastic introduction.
I did not realize that the Corp put hogs on a keto diet. I would probably describe that not s “Eat Less, Move More”, but “Eat More, move evermore”. In Afghanistan, the grunts were being fed 8-10K calories daily in mid 2000s
TL; DR.
So where can I get this Vietnam War Diet, now? And how is it better than keto?
Totally just kidding. Amazing read. I’m an Army nurse who’s worked with lots of Vietnam vets; but that was probably the most coherent story I’ve ever heard (read) and one of the most interesting. Thanks for sharing!
I promise you, that was the actual diet – intended keto or not. Absolutely nothing that even looked like a starchy food or if it contained sugar. No potatoes, carrots, rice, mashed potatoes, sweets, etc. Maybe some fruit but fruit was not a big part of our meals. Milk and water only. Lots of meats and greens and that was about it. SOME beans or peas might have been allowed. Now this was the 1960s before high fructose corn syrup caught on and the government began recommending high carb eating. So it is natural that the Marine Corps would look back to the old dietary ways of our grandparents … cut back on the sweets, whites and snacks.
To prove the point, the recruits that they wanted to bulk up were put on a “skinnies” diet and damn near force fed carbs and sweets. These guys seemed to be almost as miserable as us and certainly had more stomach upset, visibly so. I guess the Corps diet wasn’t perfect for them. But they did bulk up.
Footnote: The Corps wasn’t totally heartless in their diet approach. On Nov. 10, while I was in boot camp, the Marine Corps celebrated its birthday. A glorious day of dispensation and feast. Even the “hogs” were allowed one slice of birthday cake and one cup of sweet Kool-Aid! Damn, it tasted good.
Skinnyjeans13,
It’s a shame I did not know then what dietary processes were at play. Had I only had the wisdom then (an ancient wish) that I have now, I probably would not have regained so much weight over the course of my life. I could have remained in ketosis indefinitely.
As for the cortisol/adrenaline flow – I doubt it ever ebbed. It is what kept us going.
During the midst of my first real battle, a particularly long, running battle (midnight till 5:30 a.m.) I experienced something unusual to me, but common to most everyone in that predicament – a profound and uncontrollable shaking. As a young stud, I could only at first question my nerve and courage. Was I coward? I dreaded. I didn’t want to move. But I was shivering on a 90-degree night. Tracers were zipping overhead and blood was seeping slowly from a minor shrapnel wound in my side. Every muscle was almost in spasm, even my very organs seem to quiver. I could hardly speak. My throat tightened. I suddenly had an intense need to pee. It was pitch black, save for the flashes of explosives and gunfire. There was no where to run or hide in Vietnam. Then it came time to act. And I seemed to have unbound energy. For the next five hours, I maneuvered, returned fire, threw hand grenades, shouted obscenities, hung it out and peed a lot, and during the occasional lull, began to shiver anew.
I had just experienced my first ever, intense – and unequaled since – adrenaline dump. I could have bottled Cortisa-Cola, I bet.
I’d like to change my username too. I found this, but it doesn’t really tell you how:
If anyone knows how, please let me know! Thank you.
What an amazing story! None of us back in the day really knew what “healthy eating” was. I used to carbo load the night before my road races (running). Now, I couldn’t run to save my life, although that is improving a bit.
Two of my older cousins served in the Navy in Vietnam, one aboard a hospital ship. Their home port was Long Beach, so we used to visit them when they were in port (I grew up in SoCal). I did an internship at the LB VA hospital, where a lot of Vietnam vets were housed. Major PTSD, spinal cord injuries, bilateral amputees, drug addiction, etc. Quite grim, as they were all quite young but most of them were never leaving. Very sad,
GentleBen,
That was a fantastic read. I’m 62, so both too young and Canadian so I did not serve in Vietnam, but know many who did. I greatly respect your service and am ashamed of the way you and your brothers were treated on your return.
When my country went to war in the sandbox, I was too old to serve. This is something I can’t change, but regret.
I have served as a firefighter for almost 30 years now. It doesn’t compare to combat, but is not without it’s riaks or mental costs. I have experienced many difficult calls on fires, scuba recoveries, rope rescue, etc., and while they take their toll on my sleep, I would not compare them to combat experience. Respect brother.
Kirk
Thanks Kirk.
We all have our stressors in addition to diet irregularities. Mine was PTSD memories wrecking my sleep habits along with the late, odd hours of newspaper work. Plus add a huge topping of horrendous deadline pressure each and every night.
I dont really blame Vietnam for all my life’s woes, just the catalyst that got the ball rolling.
The war really did a number on our value system and world view. The 19-year-old mind is a malleable lump of clay for life’s experience to shape.
Just think about it. When most graduate high school they begin shaping their independent lives by going to college, learning a skill or trade, entering the work force or raising a family. Those experiences are hard-wired into our devoloping brains.
In our case, we were trained to obey and to kill and then sent off to a foreign land to endure whatever awaited.
It is no wonder that old men fight wars with young men’s bodies. They/we didn’t know better. The minimum draft age should be 35/40. Older guys would find a better way to take the hill without a frontal assault.
You make a good point. At 15, I was looking for a way to get into that war, and was running on poor sense and testosterone. i became a firefighter at 30, and while agressive on fire attack, had some wisdom and common sense behind me. I went rhrough the ranks, eventually becoming Chief for a few years before a post-fire heart attack. I always led from the front when leading a crew into a fire, and was always the last out. Age, experience, and wisdom made a lot of difference.
I’m still serving as a driver of the heavy trucks, and thanks to keto, I am at my lowest weight (166) and best fittness level since high school, so I am very seriously working on returning to fire attack status.
What an incredible and frightening feeling that had to be. I’m sure they didn’t train you how to deal with that in boot camp, or warn you what was awaiting you. But you’re right; how else could you have physically made it through something like that? I can’t even begin to imagine.
I do know this: you, every man and woman who served or serve now, and, the firefighters (my late boyfriend was a lifetime firefighter), anyone who gives of themselves so selflessly…you are and always will be my heros.
Wow, interesting read. I am almost 50 and strongly feel that the things that we ate, and how we “dieted” earlier in life can really leave a mark in how we are in older years. Unfortunately I see it in hindsight, not when it was happening. ( If you are young, take heed!!).
My first ever “diet” I was in college, (college was 140lbs) and after a psychology teacher said the fastest way to drop weight is “to push break fast back to lunch time” I started doing that, and promptly lost 20lbs. Sadly I was losing muscle as well as fat, because I wasnt exercising. So that set me up for easy weight gain in the future. Fast forward to age 29, I was 166lbs and did what I will call an irresponsible version of keto - but didnt know it was that. It was via a Dr’s plan, who gave you a laminated sheet of paper and said if it isnt on that sheet, dont eat it, if it is, eat until you are full. Said sheet contained all meats, only swiss cheese, and about 15 veggies ( no peas, carrots, spuds etc). I lost 14lbs in 2 weeks, and stuck to the plan for about 5 weeks total. Got pregnant shortly after that and went into a carb frenzy to stave off morning sickness - literally 10 slices of toast and honey in the morning. I was starving all the time.
FF to after 2 babies…I was fat 206lbs did weight watchers, dropped some, started exercising, got down to 186 - started having pain under my right ribs. Eventually got tested for liver distress - my liver levels were high and I was in stage 1 liver failure. Partly because of the excess weight ( which was almost impossible to lose, even with diet and exercise). Looking back…I suspect the irresponsible keto helped set me up for elevated liver enzymes because I was not drinking enough, no electrolytes and not enough leafy greens to support my liver as it processed the burning fat.
ANyway, long story short ( too late!!) never under estimate how previous diets ( chosen or not) can impact your health and ability to store or lose fat later in life.
I’ve sent the link to this thread to my husband. He was an Army cook in Vietnam and will find your recount interesting.
(Sidebar: Husband had no food-prep experience prior to arriving in country. He later found out some administrator misread his “metal cutting” work history as “meat cutting.”)
Thank you for sharing that. I laughed and I cried. I’m retired Air Force, from ‘81-2001. Although I can’t compare life as an airman to a marine, I certainly have empathy. I can only imagine.
Glad to see you on the forum with us, brother.
[Salute, handshake and a bro hug]
A very interesting read Gentle Ben. My brother joined the Navy in 1969 in order to avoid Vietnam. My cousin (Richard Garcia) was killed in Vietnam. He was gunner on top of a tank when the tank was damaged by a Viet Cong attack. Richard fell to the ground and was run over by the damaged tank. The story is in "Charlie Company: What Vietnam did to us.
I faced the Vietnam draft in 1971 when they were scaling back on the number of people to take. After high school I completed college and a Masters degree and then joined the Army to get free medical care for my daughter. Insurance did not cover her needs. I was Infantry at Schofield Barracks and then, after OCS, a Combat Engineer. As a Combat Engineer I often worked alongside Marines as OPFOR against the Infantry at Fort Ord. They were good soldiers. I know they weren’t “soldiers”, they were Marines! My son spent 23 years in the Marines. I will say that those of us in the Army were also good soldiers!
In my opinion all people who serve in the military deserve respect for risking their lives to serve our country. It’s just too bad that very few wars accomplish anything good for our country, expect of course WWII. Vietnam did not, Iraq has not, Afghanistan has not. Anyone in the government who votes for war should automatically be drafted and then sent to the front lines to see what it is really like.
Hi Laurie,
Brenda came back to me and gut my username changed, so hope this will work for you, too!
Really interesting, well written account. Thank you for sharing.
I hadn’t seen this post, but just shared some pictures of WW2 rations and food eaten, that I took today on a stroll around a museum. Not exactly the same, but it seemed meat and fat were prized.
C-Rations in Vietnam were indeed high in protein and fats and had a lot of calories. Remember this was before the low-fat, high carb craze.
But they seriously lacked in palatability, taste and variety. And they lacked volume and availability. We never starved but were left seriously wanting and famished. We burnt every bit of calories they served up.
Remember the intent of my post was to paint a picture of what a Vietnsm War diet was like in the field and it’s affects on me personally and fellow grunts in general.