Lots of ‘F’ words (temporary tile) Carnivore Zero Carb February 2023

(Linda ) #41

I can actually claim my 14 pound loss now its almost 15 lbs now but I’ll claim the 14…and while I’m claiming stuff I can also claim my 2 yrs of carnivore…

I’m suprised by ppl that claim its not sustainable ( like my primary Dr) maybe with out my spices occassionally and my twice a year keto desert treat servings i allow then, of course also my coffee maybe it wouldn’t be sustainable for me… I don’t know… I might not be 100 percent perfect but it’s perfect for me. I don’t miss the carby stuff anymore I doubt I could stomach the sugary food or high carb fruits and veges either if I eat anything other than meat or dairy it has to be keto type food…and then those are only allowed twice per year…

(Megan) #42

The only thing I can think of it my other addiction (playing a mmorpg called Everquest) isn’t scratching the itch it usually scratches. Due to the current expansion on the particular server I’m playing on it’s become extremely boring and frustrating and I’m not wanting to play much - which leaves me with nothing to distract me from “everything that’s wrong in my life”. So maybe that got my psyche turning to my primary addiction (food) to produce some numbing and distracting?

I need to shorten the list of “everything that’s wrong in my life” so it’s not so damn overwhelming. And it’s time to resume the habit of listing everything I am thankful and grateful for - b/c that list is longer.

Woo Hoo Linda! That’s awesome! Congratulations.



Double amazing!

For me, getting rid of the sugar addiction was key. I had succeeded with keto previously, but I started taking some medications that made me hungrier. Increased hunger, combined with white knuckling my way through wanting non-keto food because I was still addicted, and my social environment not being supportive meant that eventually I caved.

This time, I have completely kicked that sugar addiction - and it feels totally different. I am not white knuckling; I am not at all interested in non-carnivore food. My social environment is also very different, but even if I was put in a difficult situation, now that I don’t secretly want the food, it’s much easier to refuse.

My take is that willpower will carry you so far - as does seeing results and feeling better etc - but this way of eating is done in a very hostile environment. So if people can’t get over that desire for non-keto / non-carnivore foods (not in the short term, but after about a year) and they’re still white knuckling, I think they’re at risk of falling off the wagon because the environment is working against you - and that’s what makes people think it’s unsustainable.

(Linda ) #44

Yeah I think for me the big difference for me right now is ketosis without it I’m not sure my full/ off switch switch works properly but with ketosis I feel full after eating small portions…I agree if I had to white knuckle hunger like on pmsf then it just made it unsustainable …but with ketosis that doesn’t happen at all…

I agree will power only takes you so far and I’m good with out non carnivore food but if I was to eat a trigger food then I’d probably eat it til none remained even if not in one sitting I’d just keep going back lol…
It’s why I don’t keep certain things in my house and make single servings if I step off carnivore at all…


Yeah, absolutely.

One thing I’ve found interesting recently is thinking back through foods I used to enjoy. I suspected the common theme would be sugar - which is true to an extent, maybe 80% of them. But the real common theme? The 100%? It’s fat.

I think, growing up in a world where nutritional guidelines were low fat - and many times, I embarked on low fat diets - it’s the fat that I have been craving.

One of my favourite things when I wasn’t following any eating plan was (non-keto/carnivore food) fried bread, which is bread fried in lard. Now I just eat the lard/bacon fat/tallow/dripping/whatever, I don’t miss it at all. So it isn’t the texture I craved, like I thought it might be - it’s definitely the fat. I also liked bacon sandwiches - with the bacon fat from the pan soaked into the bread, and I would’ve sworn it was the combination of bacon, bread, fat, sauce etc that was appealing to me. But again, it’s not the combination - I’m now more than happy with the bacon and the bacon fat on its own.

Still, that’s only me - might be different for others. I just found it quite illuminating when I realised.

(Megan) #46

I’ve been thinking about getting a playmate for Lulu, just waiting for one that stirs up a lot of interest in me to pop up on trademe. Today this girl was listed. I went to have a look at her and yup, she’s laying on the floor next to me as I type this. I tried to make the photos of her into gif files, or similar, to post here but I am a total pc newb. So here’s the url to the advert posted on the trademe website.

Dogs for sale | Trade Me Marketplace

Her humans are Chinese, spoke pretty much zero English. Thankfully they were able to ring a friend of theirs who did some translating back and forth while I tried to get as much info about her as I could. She’s even prettier than the photos taken.

I said I’d take her on a trial basis b/c she was acting quite jumpy/nervous at times, which is a bit of a red flag. I was leaning towards it being a no and was going to leave without her, but at one point she stood in front of me, very close, and looked into my eyes for a good few seconds, which turned the no into a maybe. So, over the next few days I’m going to be making a determination about how much of her nervousness is temperament, and how much is environment/nurture. I could tell they really had no clue about raising a dog, and both their speech and energy was quite staccato, tense and high pitched when they talked to her. I, however, do have a pretty good idea what I’m doing re dogs, and my energy is calm and authoritative. I’m a big Cesar Millan fan - boundaries and limitations as well as lots of love.

Lulu and her (new name not chosen yet) are getting on super well and I’m half expecting Lulu and my friend’s dog Milly will play an active role in her rehabilitation and re learning the ropes of her new life. Any training she’s had (which I got the impression is minimal, when I was watching them together) will have been in Chinese, so in some ways I’ll be starting from scratch. But breed wise she’s hit the jackpot as far as intelligence and trainability goes, so I’m not expecting any issues.

I need to get her into a groomer asap b/c her undercoat needs stripping (definite German Shepherd double coat) and a bunch of matts removed. But apart from that she looks like she’s been well looked after.

I have no idea what she’s going to think of being put into a crate tonight, but I guess I’m about to find out as it’s nearly 1am.

(Michael) #47

I played EverQuest when it was released in 1999? It tracked time played, and I spent one third of my life playing one year. I had to cut down then quit before I lost everything. Most addictive game I have played and while I have fond memories of playing for 5 years, I was also glad I quit to give my life meaning again Surprised to hear it is still being played over 20 years later.


She’s gorgeous - I hope it works out for you both.

(Linda ) #49

Yeah I totally agree sugar and fat together is danger but funny thing when I moved to America sugar was even in bread and It killed my addiction lol no longer enjoyed it…now I think of things like chaffels as a vessel to transport food like burgers or pork rinds for nachos so no longer has to be carby food…

(Michael) #50

Getting used to OMAD high fat. I am not hungry until close to eating time, and I am eating more calories than before to maintain my weight. Yesterday I ate 3600 calories which seems to be my maintenance amount with lower protein as my weight is stable at 60 kg. Here was my first plate yesterday

(Linda ) #51

So pleased your getting a new buddy hope this one is the one but I think having more tools in your tool bag like sharing love with a new pet can def help in fighting our demons.

(Megan) #52

Thanks @Septimius! She definitely is gorgeous to look at.

My thoughts exactly Linda. I’m really needing a something at the moment and she may well provide that. Lulu is amazing and/but soooooo chill and low maintenance. I love her to pieces and look after her very well, but she doesn’t “drag me outside of myself” much. For e.g. I could not take her out for a run for a whole week and she’d remain completely chill and low maintenance. In fact, she just did about 5 weeks on house arrest while on heat, with some slow fairly short walks up and down the street and showed zero signs of boredom or any other evidence of not getting much exercise.

A border collie/german shepherd however needs a lot of mental and physical exercise or they can exhibit all sorts of problem behaviours, as well as just not being happy. I can’t walk far and I can’t walk fast, but I have an awesome large off lead park 5 minutes down the road with smooth paved footpaths running through it, making it very walker friendly (my mobility aid). As soon as I have a good recall with her I can let her off there to run around with Lulu. I usually go at about 5pm and meet up with anywhere from 6-15 other humans and their dogs.

LOL!! That’s Everquest!! So many people lost jobs and relationships and all sorts when it first came out. I played solidly for the 1st 5 years too, then quit. 8 years later I got to wondering about the game and logged in - and whammo, instantly re-hooked. I don’t play anywhere near as much as I did those 1st 5 years, and for 6 or so years after I started playing again, but it’s still a big part of my life.


I got the notice about writing too much in this thread but I haven’t written today yet. So I will. (A bit too much, it seems, sorry. I have so much on my mind and emotions too.)

@Azi: Congrats! 15lbs is quite nice :slight_smile: Of course, it matters how much if left, I lost more but my belly still sported its 2 big rolls so I wasn’t exactly pleased. But I was a bit :slight_smile: And I felt better than before (on high-carb) and I didn’t need much effort, those were the golden days :smiley: My early low-carb months, I loved them. My body loved them. Now it wants me to be super low with my plant carbs so low-carb just isn’t good enough anymore. It was a nice fallback from keto though.

The weather is chilly but sunny! We had a nice little walk in the wildlife park forest. Yep, it was windy lately… More than I though. We saw MANY broken trees, even a very very big and until now alive one… Wow. It even had some protection, it wasn’t on the hilltop and there were other trees around… But it wasn’t enough. I looked at the very impressive tree with all the tears and breaks in its body and wondered how super strong the wind had to be to do THAT… :astonished:

Didn’t bring the camera but now we saw a tree branch covered with thick ice in the river, blooming snowdrops and hellebores! Just the first ones, there will be way, way, way more a bit later.

Maybe the walk had a role in it too but I got super hungry. I felt a small lunch will be fine, it’s normal after a very overeating day (I ate about 1000 kcal over my needs yesterday).
Well I had a lunch that seemed small… I tracked, 94g fat and 137g protein and NO WAY I won’t have another proper sized meal, it’s very early and I am not even satiated with this cute lunch…

So my Hungry Times continue. Oh well.

I had 2 soft-boiled eggs, the leftover stew (Alvaro was a cinnamon roll even more than usual and made sure my share had more hearts than liver :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:) with egg crumbles (like scrambled eggs but I make sure it is a bunch of little pieces), a few little bites of fried pork, a duck neck, my usual eggy fluff (no, I won’t make it again until I get gelatine, it’s so much better and feels more that way) and now I have a coffee with a tiny cream, I will try to quit coffee tomorrow, getting stricter isn’t what I can do on weekends… Oh and 4 sponge cakes, 2 was a bit cheesy. And a little of the organ not-sausage, I really don’t know how to call that.
It was a very, very fine meal and now I start to feel satiated too. Nice. I just have no idea what I should eat for dinner when my protein is already too high… It’s not like I have tricks. If I get hungry, I need a lot of fatty protein, no way around that. Sometimes it’s a smaller lot but still, it must be substantial. But I try to avoid eating despite my lunch ended at 13:30 so I very probably will fail. Training is still important. And one can never know 100%…

I just don’t know what to cook tomorrow. I had soup, fowl, organ and pork alike lately, lots of eggs and some cheese too so I don’t want them.
So it will be “this and that” I suppose where nothing has a really big role though I need to keep my 2 base food, pork and eggs. I still have leftover pork shoulder roast (frozen but if I fry it a bit, maybe it will be nicer. not like it’s a problem if I don’t desire it much… it’s still okay for hungry me and if it’s not irresistible, I won’t inhale it in no time, at least). And I have plenty of processed meat items and they help. I still didn’t get bored of cheese though that’s an expensive, not satiating item that I already should stop eating already. Except I very much like to use a little in my sponge cakes. Not enough for them to become really cheesy but it still makes them nicer.

Sustainability is very, very individual. I never could stick to keto for weeks after fat adaptation, not like I saw the point in it, keto was exactly like low-carb just more restrictive, it gave me zero extra benefits as far as I could tell. I just needed fat adaptation but it didn’t disappear off keto.
Carnivore is different, it’s quite wonderful and now I can’t go back to low-carb and feel just right anymore anyway. But I still go off. This time until June is where I try not to. Even now, I can’t do 100% carnivore but I am very, very close and it’s enough.
My circumstances are different than someone who doesn’t live with a high-carber, baking and cooking various foods… But I have my beloved fruit garden too. Vegetables are no problem though I still keep a very small amount that is needed for some of our meat or egg dishes. Normally I like some juicy pickled or raw veg for my richest, fattiest meat dishes but I skip that now, it’s not like it’s needed, it’s just nice.
High-carb items, yep, I love many of them. They aren’t needed so it’s no problem to ignore any of them for a longer time but I definitely enjoy some when I am in the mood. Not always, I learned that something being super delicious doesn’t mean I really enjoy it so it has a chance to be worth it… And I think I never crave them. They are just enjoyable sometimes.
If I crave something, that’s more like a texture. Especially crunchiness. I think I can only really crave 2 food items, eggs and meat. Usually happens to meat as I typically eat eggs galore (I haven’t even any idea how NOT to eat many eggs when I like them… I will try as they add up super easily while I don’t feel I ate much. I blame my egg drinking the most and will try to avoid it) but sometimes my meat consumption seems to be too low to my body’s liking…

I had food boredom in the past where it was simple inevitable to go off even if I didn’t want the carbs. But I could eat them easier than more meat or egg and I was hungry so it couldn’t be helped. At least it seems to be in the past BUT I actually don’t know as I never did carnivore(-ish… or at least close to it) for more than 2 weeks at a time. 2 weeks is a super long time, I am so impressed, I don’t think I did a whole week since last winter… But I have bad memory too regarding these things…

My carni days are fine (except when I am starving and overeat, that’s not nice). I don’t miss anything and love my food. But somehow things always fall apart eventually. it’s the same with OMAD, I have OMAD days and then it just can’t be done longer :frowning:
I am pretty sure I need carnivore OMAD or something very, very close most of the time… But I can’t do it.
Alvaro says I just need self control. It seems he doesn’t know me :smiley: I don’t have that and don’t want to develop it (regarding food), it’s against my core personality.
And I am very, very HUNGRY these days. Of course I don’t force myself to feel I am starving for hours, I don’t agree with that.
I stop when still (not very very much) hungry if I am sure I ate enough, that’s different. But just not eating and being hungry from, like, 5pm to 3am just because I had a too big lunch today… NOPE. Almost anything but that.

But I stop thinking and especially writing about it, it will be fine. Or I just try something. But I trust in normal weekdays if it comes to my ability to start my eating window late.

And I will try to eat according to some plan (oh yeah, fat chances for that. but maybe I can do it partially…?). As I have no proper satiation signs when they should be and I need to stop after I ate a decent amount of food that I know that should be enough (on normal days, at least). I liked when it wasn’t like this. Sigh.

Or I make interesting new experiments… Some food type limitation may be good…? I wanted a higher level of simplicity anyway…

Makes sense… I grow up in a high-fat, high-carb world and I loved both. And protein, of course. I loved all my macros and my numbers surely reflected that… I was aware of this all my life :slight_smile:
It’s so lucky that I am very fine with my carb macro being low (most of the time but that’s enough)… I could never do low-protein or low-fat. But going low-carb was the easiest thing ever, easier than high-carb as I felt better. It’s another thing that sometimes, typically on festivals (with plenty of amazing homemade treats) or when we visited a relative (great homemade treats, again) I had my occasional high-carb meal for years to come, I still could be tempted - but I didn’t miss these on low-carb and most of the time I was fine at home. Not always, sometimes we had tasty homemade treats here, after all :smiley:
Store-bought stuff was way less dangerous. And if I got still tempted, I just read the ingredients list and put back the thing, losing all interest :smiley:
But I have still a long way to go, I saw that in this December. End of January was different as I was upset that I overeat on my chosen woe and got into my “I just don’t care” state. I still only ate what I find tasty so it was lovely, at least… Hungry and emotional (upset), not an easy combo and I have no quilt or regrets. (I don’t think I ever had guilt about food, why people have that? Weird. Regret happened a few times but extremely rarely. My body handles me well enough most of the time.)
And that’s why I try to behave until June. I imagine that such a long time spent very nearly always very close to carnivore (you can’t expect more from me but it’s plenty) will have a big impact on my eating later when I will be in a less easy environment for carnivore. Not like mine would be actually easy… But easier than in summer or in December.

You totally should figure out how to put photos her then :smiley: She already looks fabulous in the photos I just saw… Border Collie x German Shepherd, my two fav breeds!!! It’s amazing :smiley: That fluffy taill, lovely head, fun ears :smiley:
I hope she is perfect for you, merely didn’t get the right environment and human and it won’t even take much to help her to become the proper her! :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:


I so get ya on this one :slight_smile: nothing worse than idle hands, well idle brain!
Also too, with more healing and mental clarity you might pick a day and handle the issues you see fit to handle and get some of that ‘junk’ off ya. I have done that thru my zc years and it feels great!

Super congrats on those lbs being shaved off!
Also a big :100::partying_face::partying_face: for your Carniversary!
Happy you are doing well!

@Karen18, good move on not putting CF competition pressure on yourself when ya feel ya really don’t need it! We also don’t even have to compete against ourselves alot of times :slight_smile: I stopped doing that…I mean improving with something we enjoy and becoming more expert and good at it and gain from it is fine, but I never push too hard on things I ‘kinda wanna enjoy’ and not take it into an abuse level…yes I can easily switch things into abuse mode against myself sometimes LOL

not sure but I buy minced in a tube and patty it out, seems fairly fatty, whcih is why I love it :slight_smile: but can check out labels later when I buy more of it. We have alot of dry sausages available but I am not one to buy. Just not a fan so I stick with the other and use it when wanted.

------------------fast post. Kiddo is gonna drag me out to a few stores she wants to hit. She needs drive time behind the wheel so yea, I gotta go on that learner permit. Hubby cooking bacon right now.

so will eat some of that. got me a big 1 lb. T bone steak to hound down which I will do before we hit the road to the stores. I am not getting caught hungry out there right now cause I have been eating lower and I could go ‘bonkers’ so I must feed me at home.

I feel like appetite is growing a bit so that makes me feel a bit good. I don’t mind eating lower days, losing a lb or 2 easily, but it also ‘scares’ me cause if and when that hunger kicks back, and it will, I must be fed or I could ‘cave’ but with alot of yrs under my belt I do very well on not doing that, but hey, I don’t trust me one bit :wink: Nope. Nada. Not at all :drooling_face:


I had a small dinner. 170g protein, 140g fat. Pretty modest from me this far and I am pretty determined to stop here. Alvaro doesn’t like the organ non-sausage much so, more for me! :slight_smile:
It turned out I have plenty of pork for tomorrow (3 not big pieces but still over 1500 kcal… pork shoulder is fatty even if some lard is rendered out) so it still can be a nice properly meaty day :slight_smile:

Finally a not rainy or windy day so Alvaro cooked some carbs over open fire! We managed to burn a lot of stuff, I felt freezing even short term so I hacked some wood :smiley: I love that anyway, we both do. It’s fun. Well poor axe never was perfect and it lost its head at some point but I hammered it back.

Ginger keeps meowing almost all the time, no idea why. She has a house she likes (actually, it’s for our own cats but she uses it all the time), we can’t even avoid feeding her a bit as she is super assertive and takes anything from the others… She is pretty plump, the plumpest among all the cats… And it turned out the alleged owners aren’t owners at all, Ginger just frequented them too.
I don’t want her, super noisy and assertive, all the others hate her, fear her and rather don’t eat or go out if she is there… And 3 cats are already a bit too many for us but we manage.


Of course I got a bit hungry again but after one bite of pork shoulder roast I just ate about 15g chicken fat and it was perfect! :smiley: It was even okay tasting despite it came from the bad soup that I gave to the cats and even the meat was barely edible but at least not horrible. The fat is the best of the whole thing, well not a big wonder I suppose, fat is nice. Some fats are nicer than others though, I seriously hate tallow when it’s not together with meat.

I will give high fattiness another chance! First I just eat the protein I usually need and if still hungry, I eat fat as it makes way more sense to me than starting with fat (for my individual case) but I will do that too (and for days when I don’t want to eat much protein, it’s the way to go).
Oh it will be fun :slight_smile:

But of course I continue with my skipping lunch and if possible, doing OMAD plan as well. I need that as I will have normal days, I need that as it makes comparison way simpler… And because it makes my life simpler and more convenient as well.

In the end, today I ate 6-7 eggs, more than a pound of meat (lots of organs) and some dairy as well as almost always. About 146g fat and 176g protein thanks to the fat in the end and all my self restraint I can muster (it’s not much but without it my protein intake still would be much higher).

I expect a good week because I am just so hopelessly optimistic but I do have plans.

(Karen) #57

Food today

The omelette was a streaky bacon one and very tasty, as was the other food lol. Also eaten too much cheese.

After saying Raymond perked up … he had a blip yesterday and again through the night so we didn’t go to our planned Tea Damce in Lincoln today. Started a new jig saw this afternoon… cats, butterflies and flowers … i will be able to photo this one when i finish it hahaha.

(Linda ) #58

[quote=“Shinita, post:53, topic:117877, full:true”]
@Azi: Congrats! 15lbs is quite nice :slight_smile: Of course, it matters how much if left, I lost more but my belly still sported its 2 big rolls so I wasn’t exactly pleased. But I was a bit :slight_smile: And I felt better than before

Yeah I still have a ways to go to be back at my desired weight which is 61kg or 136lbs. …but after gaining so much weight over the last year I’m thrilled to have taken 15 off it shows me I can get it back off… no I’m not where I want to be but I’m not finished… yep Ive lost way more than that at times but we got to start somewhere and 15lbs is a great start lol…


Indeed :slight_smile: 15 lbs is quite significant!

(Linda ) #60

Megan this video may help you…