I’m on day two of caffeine and sugar withdrawals and I’m finding I am quite irritable. Everything is making me mad. Like right now, I want to go to bed but need to brush my teeth and wash my face but my stepson decided to take a shower at 9:00 at night and his showers take an hour. He has all day because he only works Thursday to Saturday part time. Now I have to wait until he gets out to get ready for bed. And my neighbor is playing music extremely loud from his garage and all I hear is the bass. It’s a week night and he decides to have a party in his garage. 
. I just need to go to bed and start over tomorrow 
JanZC --- No Plants! Smaller Pants!
KellynP
(Kellyn )
#161
Ellacosew
#162
I admire your bravery at taking coffee on cold turkey.
I had to ramp down to a cup a day. Then a half cup plus hot water…1/3 cup…to what just looked like water that someone stirred with a brown crayon…
Fangs
#163
you are right FB, it is a real journey and we change during it for real, it ain’t just talking the talk of an eating plan, we hit real hard changes in our body and mind just like you said.
yes, a ‘pro’ like Vic does know what little he can allow back if wanted. But he got thru all the ‘extras’ that are required to be very strict while we change so much, after that it can easily become very different small choices we do want to make. Nothing wrong with that but some, like me have to stay put, I won’t be adding back some things, it doesn’t suit me at all, but others, if you do well on a little bit of this or that back, and can function great and feel wonderful, yes there are options open to anyone.
It is true, body can be heard again in its full truths of what it needs. We eliminate for a long time, add 1 small thing back and wait for any and all reactions we might get from it, if none and ya love it, eat it a bit, if you do get a reaction, boom, you know that is not what your body wants…but only thru time on plan and more body healing does adding back work for anyone. That is down the line 
Keep the ZC Faith…put in the efforts and big rewards come to those who wait
NO…you need to carnivore up…be a predator…go bang on that bathroom door and say get the H out of there now…and go over to the garage and do like FB! Shoot the crap out of their electrical systems and shut it off and shut them down…JOKE!!! bet ya wanna do all that tho!! Yes irritable…omg KP when I drop salt next month, and yes I am right there as my next challenge to me, I will be in the ‘misery boat’ with you for sure, but by then, you will be fine telling me to hold on by the skin of my teeth! LOL
--------good carnivore morning
food yesterday was
10 oz NY strip steak
8 link sausages
12 oz Tbone steak
huh, thought I ate more but I guess I didn’t. The link sausages, my old love from before, I kinda dropped them cause the taste was more ‘herby’ ‘seasoned’ then I like anymore, but I bought a pack and tried them again…eh. I think these will become dropped from my life. They aren’t worth the effort to fry them up and take my time, I just don’t enjoy them enough to warrant the bother of them.
I am psyching me up for no salt Fed for my little challenge. I am shaking less salt now on food to try to wean down a bit.
I was chatting over on my strict carnivore/zc forum and Elizabeth is a moderator over on them and she posted…remember she took a 30 day no salt challenge and had it rough but did ok thru it…she posted she has now lost 15 lbs.! Freaking amazing. She is longer term too and she wasn’t shifting many lbs (like me now) and she dumped that added salt to her meals and boom…her body is responding like a friggin’ trooper and believe me she is inspiring me to give it a go! (Thanks E!)
and thing is I only want about 15-20 lbs gone to be at my goal number area…but of course I know there is ‘no number’, I have to let zc just take me there ya know, but if E got results like that, darn right I am trying no salt point blank, because it ain’t water retain and more…that salt intake is messing up something even more and I am gonna drop it and just see for me, about me, over it all.
ok, that is Feb chat for later HAHA
enjoy your ZC day ya’ll
Karen18
(Karen)
#164
Blimey some days it just take an age to get through all the new posts but im there.
I am on leave for 2 weeks now … lockdown doesn’t affect me as i still have to go to work. Not sure if you are aware that UK is on third lovkdown! Gyms and CrossFit Boxes closed so working out at hone. Fortunately my CrossFit Box is still motivating us all with daily workouts and we have been put into teams with a leading coach on whatsapp. Keeps us all connected and designed to keep us all moving. I don’t need to be motivated as I still run my 100 flights of stairs every day and if I feel in the mood I tag on the daily workout as I did this morning. The workouts are designd to be quick 10- 15 mins long to encourage those that may struggle to get motivated. They are all like family so it keeps the spirits up. Also still walking with my daughter when she isnt at work as she is also a key worker. We went for a 4 miler on monday and will be walking again tomorrow.
I had lambs liver with streay bacon yesterday and it was yuk, I didn’t enjoy it one bit so won’t do it that way again. I have another packet of lambs liver in the freezer. I picked up two packets reduced from Asda, also bought chicken legs/thighs reduced that I cooked up and finished this morning fried off in butter and melted cheddar and have boiled up the bones and skin and have just had a cup which was tasty.
Well the freezer and fridge are full to bursting so should keep me going over the next couple of weeks, plenty beef joints , sirloin and ribeye steaks, bacon, chicken, turkey, sausages, burgers, fish and eggs you name it its in there. Mmmmm i think maybe a steak for later.
Carnivoor
(Vic)
#165
Lunch,
Turkey wrapped in bacon with cheese and mustard. Chipolata sausage on the side.
For dessert iberico ham
Shinita
#166
I couldn’t do that. If I have coffee in the kitchen, I will drink from the morning until at least late evening but I easily drink coffee at 2am too, I just desire water at that time as I am thirstier.
Brown water, my coffee is like that I really can’t call it black as it’s not darker than my black tea 
I probably arrived there gradually but I needed the weakness for drinking it “black”… It took YEARS just to stop sweeten it and it wasn’t nearly as important than the milk substitute (I stopped drinking milk 10-something years ago but even before I drank it very rarely and in small amounts. except when I was a kid. I drank a ton of milk then, 1 liter for breakfast in summer happened sometimes. milk isn’t very satiating for me due to its macros so it was easy to drink it as water. now it’s annoyingly sweet and I feel the sugar, I strongly prefer cream). It took very long to be able to drink black coffee. And it’s not so great, I just am able to drink it. But it makes little sense as I drink most liquids for the taste (water is for thirst though I need a good taste too and some tea is for warmth and variety only). Coffee is more complicated now that I am addicted except on the days when I don’t drink it or how should I call it… But it started with the flavor. I love coffee flavor, many of my favorite sweets have coffee and even my chocolate (that I don’t like anymore) has coffee to make it way tastier.
But black coffee alone isn’t that good. Cream makes it really nice. Another item I should be wary with.
4th coffeeless day for me and I start to miss it…? I am fine without it but I wonder about having one sometimes as it’s nice… But no, not yet. It’s not as good as I remember anyway. Not without cream and I won’t open the last bag yet.
I drink tea for warmness. Gunpowder is nice, aromatic - and too sweet for me at this point. Sigh.
Well, Earl Gray isn’t too sweet yet and I have a ton of it from the time when I wanted to spend enough money to get free shipping and it was in 2020 and it is a vegan friendly webshop even in its logo (with not the best coconut oil prices. Alvaro uses that a lot so it’s the joker when the sum isn’t big enough)… I still will order from there as there are some specific items I want from there. Mostly spices and a very spicy tea but there are household items too, sponges and big boxes to store stuff but I have enough boxes at this point. Alvaro helps a tiny bit as he always will eat lots of plants but it’s tricky. So I have Earl Gray for years even if we drink a lot (Alvaro is a much bigger tea drinker than coffee drinker. he has 3-4 coffees a year while likes some tea almost any time).
By the way, I wouldn’t need all those boxes and jars and storage place without plants… Only a little for all my spices, I don’t even use sodium bicarbonate and vinegar for baking for myself except if I make some egg yolk cake for some reason. Cakes using much whole eggs make it totally unnecessary. And I still make 100% egg sponge cakes They are the perfect bread for me (I ate them with pâté for lunch today. I finally learned the alt key code of that fancy letter, â! 131. the other is 130, maybe that helps to remember even if I just switch to Hungarian keyboard settings to write that one. but I remember it’s 130… and it’s right before ä, I learned that ages ago. German words, Jägermeister, I needed it… I never talked about pâté before, just since I am here :D). A bit dessert-y with that fluffiness but I don’t mind. I can eat about anything without “bread” but it’s still nice sometimes and sponge cake is way more enjoyable than a boiled egg. And requires more work but it’s still little and I like baking. I don’t do overly complicated things but whipping 3 eggs isn’t a big deal.
I am still a HUGE liver lover But I won’t put fowl fat into it in the future… But I had to use up that for something and it is chicken liver pâté… But no. Almost everything is better with lard. But Alvaro eats the pâté too and coconut oil makes it not spreadable (and that’s a tasteless thing too. not so important if liver is present but still).
I wondered what I can wrap into the bacon I happen to have now… I have turkey drumsticks I will do that then, thanks for the idea. Sometimes I am not imaginative enough, even in the kitchen.
I have a very eggy day again, my meat is just some tiny leftovers and I adore eggs right now. Tomorrow I eat more meat again, we make duck soup and roasted duck limbs.
islandlight
(Laurie)
#167
@KellynP I had a similar issue with young housemates. They were hogging the shared kitchen all day. During Covid times, this meant that the other housemate and I could never use the kitchen. We both talked to them many times, and they even agreed to a kitchen schedule, but nothing changed. Finally I went to the landlady and she laid down the law, and it worked. I hope you can find a solution!
@Fangs I love hearing that we don’t need so much salt. I hate the taste of added salt, and I hate forcing it down on the advice of some ketoers.
Redrobins
(Heather)
#168
I gave up salt about a month ago, after seeing the inspiration of Elizabeth at the ZC forum as well 
. Not much movement on the scale (couple of pounds, maybe), but my inflammation is definitely less and I feel really good. I have also noticed that I can now taste the flavoring in the meat I am eating more. I was still “cheating” a bit by using small amounts of salted butter, but I’ve moved on to ghee.
Good luck, Fangs!
Ellacosew
#170
Yesterday I ate 1 pound of 80/20 ground beef. The kind that comes in a one pound tube is very convenient to flatten a bit into a sort of brick and cook on the cast iron pan. Eaten from a bowl with the fat poured back on.
I ate the same thing day before. I will probably eat the same thing today. Now it is taking longer to get hungry - eating my meal around 2 pm rather than 6 am.
Food is no longer very entertaining so I have been filling up on other things. Exercise. I had lots yesterday and am pleasantly sore today. 20 minutes of Pilates, an hour of walking, lots of weights throughout the day (only 10 lb weights. I had been doing countless squats throughout the day. They are much more challenging now weighted) a 15 minute floor legs/butt routine.
If I am at the place where food has become a bodily function - uncomplicated and unglamorous - I am also at the place where all the mental energy and time released needs a locus.
Karen18
(Karen)
#171
@Shinita i have a big drawer filled with tea. I dont like milk so i drink all teas black. I love earl grey, lady grey, any grey lol and have a penchant for spicy chai which i am guessing is like your spicy tea. I have some vanilla chai which is nice when i fancy something just a tad bit sweeter. I like to collect tins that i transfer the loose tea into. I am always checking out the charity shoos for tins but sometimes they over price them which i find quite ridiculous.
KellynP
(Kellyn )
#172
Oh My Gosh! I so wanted to do this! LOL. I will definitely be there for you when you drop salt. 
Thanks, Laurie. I think I will talk to him about taking his showers earlier in the day. As for the neighbor, not much I can do. I just put in some earplugs last night and that helped tremendously.
It’s day 3 for me today. Yesterday I ate until I was full which helped a lot as people at my office keep bringing in sugary foods. Even this morning I walked in and someone brought Krispy Kreme doughnuts. I had 3 eggs in butter and four sausage links for breakfast so I was able to avoid them. I brought 2 steaks again for lunch. We are having lunch catered so knowing I have steak to eat will help me avoid being tempted by a catered lunch.
I feel bad about being so cranky with my family yesterday. I will make sure to apologize and warn them that is might happen again until my withdrawals wear off.
KellynP
(Kellyn )
#174
I’m sure I will, at least this week anyway. I am usually pretty laid back and take things as they come, but in the last few days I let things get to me and have not been able to control my emotions. I am looking forward to my mood leveling when I am adapted to zc again.
Karen18
(Karen)
#175
I hate to say this but you saying you are usually laid back and let things go is maybe the reason why you are kind of being taken advantage of. People think they can do what they like without consideration because they think you don’t mind and will let them get away with it!
When you have tines when you feel like this then they definitely need to be told.
Think about your sanity, it is worth it xxx
Shinita
#176
Milk in tea is something no one does here (except for Assam, maybe, that tea may need some “softening”). We have lemon (even that horrible fake lemon juice I so, so hate… or those tablets) and sugar in tea, oh my poor childhood… And it’s super sweet even for a normal person, at least the ones not drank at home but getting in the nursery school or something… At least it was the case for very long, maybe it’s a bit better now? But why would be, sugar is cheap and people love extreme sweetness, it seems…
But when I switched to proper tea instead of filtered ones (oh but we have instant tea nowadays as well…), I immediately dropped the lemon and sugar. So I drink plain tea since… 20 years? Even not tasty, filtered ones but I put some chai tea into them. Sometimes I am gifted bad tea and well, it’s still okay for a slightly flavored warm liquid, I want a warm drink way more often than an enjoyable flavor.
I have lots of pretty tins from my old times when I visited tea shops often I have many now, many very small and I don’t use them. I have only a few kinds of tea now and I keep them in big boxes or jars.
I am having a spicy egg milk (there is some leftover egg after I make the sponge cakes, it doesn’t come out easily, just with water. I used to drink coffee with it…) and soon I will have dinner! This is my plan and as it’s meat and not much, it probably will happen. I am super bad at making a plate/tray and a photo and not eating that, I leave this, add that…
Sausage spiced meat patties/flattened balls/frikadellers, sponge cake waffles used as bread with pâté, it seemed so miserably small (I ate most frikadellers and pâté for lunch) that I got a little turkey out of the freezer too. And a tiny cheese, I won’t have more for some days. It’s unusual but no problem, it’s nice to have little cheese after the often overcheesed last months… But I still have dairy, I ate sour cream for lunch.
Carnivoor
(Vic)
#177
@kellyn
Just bring him a 6pak of beer, tell him you like his music and ask him to shut it off after 8pm.
Thats what I would try.
If that doesnt work, I would beat him up and make him eat his speakers.
islandlight
(Laurie)
#179
Guys sure have interesting ways of dealing with each other. Usually involving a 6-pack or a bottle. I’m not sure most women could pull this off successfully.
VirginiaEdie
(Edith)
#180
I think my 2mad experiment is a failure. By the time I eat dinner, I’m REALLY hungry, and then I eat too much. Afterwards, I feel overfull for the rest of the evening. It’s not pleasant.
Today I’ve had two smaller meals for breakfast and lunch and the stomach is much happier.