It seems that the ketogenic diet is making me ill

(Polly) #16

I get it. You don’t want to hear that message, so we’ll have to agree to disagree on the point. However, you cannot say STATINS ARE GOOD FOR YOU, you can only say “I believe statins are good for me” (adopting your use of capital letters rather than shouting it, you understand!)

The mechanism by which statins may do good is unclear. There is a probability that they reduce inflammation and that is a good thing. However, reducing cardiovascular disease by lowering cholesterol is simply not possible because cholesterol does not cause CVD. I belong to the school of thought which says that there are better ways to reduce inflammation than popping a pill, any pill and particularly not a statin. You must do what suits you or what you believe works best for you and we must all do the same. The important bit is that we take possession of our own health and do what we can to improve outcomes rather than relying on anyone else.

(David Epstein) #17

Why can’t I say statins are good for you? I have evidence. Obviously you haven’t watched the video link
ABOUT DR. BREWER Dr. Brewer started as an Emergency Doctor. After seeing too many preventable heart attacks, he went to Johns Hopkins to learn Preventive Medicine. While there, he went on the run the post-graduate training program (residency) in Preventive Medicine. From there, he made a career of practicing and managing preventive medicine and primary care clinics. His later role in this area was Chief Medical Officer for Premise, which has close to 1,000 primary care/prevention clinics. He was also the Chief Medical Officer for MDLIVE, the second largest telemedicine company. More recently, he founded PrevMed, a heart attack, and stroke prevention clinic. At PrevMed, we focus on heart attack, stroke, and cognitive decline. We serve patients who have already experienced an event as well as those who have not developed a diagnosis or event. Dr. Brewer provides services via telemedicine or in person if you’re in the Lexington, KY area. We find a lot of undiagnosed Pre-Diabetes or Insulin Resistance. Treating unrecognized risk factors like Pre-Diabetes allows reduction of risk and prevention of disease. If you are interested in becoming a patient, please visit our website: https://prevmedheartrisk.com/ You can’t reverse arterial plaque; right? No, that’s not right. Please help us fight heart disease & stroke! Help us translate this video. http://www.youtube.com/timedtext_vide… ABOUT THIS VIDEO: I’ve focused on lifestyle, especially diet, most of my career. I started as an ER doc, but realized quickly that lifestyle, especially diet, is a major cause of most disease, disability & death. But in my late 50s, I ran into a problem. I found plaque in my arteries on a CIMT (Carotid Intima Media Thickness test) equivalent to a 73 yo man. My BMI has remained less than 25 my entire life, and mostly less than 23. So obesity was not the problem. Like many patients, I’d put off medications, including statins. After finding the plaque in my arteries, I decided to try the right statin, and Niacin. And I made a few more tweaks in my lifestyle. It worked. I reversed 20 years’ worth of plaque in my arteries. ( If you’re thinking this was a CIMT technical variation, I thought of that. I had several serial CIMTs over that two year period. They stayed on the same trend line; so this appeared to be true plaque regression.) So I did this video to “give the medication devil his due”. I continued to age into prediabetes, or Insulin Resistance (IR). (It could have been due to the statin. But that’s not likely; the statin was only 5mg of Crestor.) Over half of adults already have IR. Even minimal increases in blood sugar and insulin levels causes plaque and CV Inflammation. The major goal of this channel is to warn others to check for plaque and CV inflammation, usually due to prediabetes, or IR. Most of my patients come to me with it, and therefore with plaque. Unfortunately, the standard practice to screen for diabetes is test using FBG (Fasting Blood Glucose) and Hemaglobin A1c. These often miss mild prediabetes. But mild prediabetes does most of the damage, creating plaque and CV inflammation prior to the patient knowing there is any danger. Most people think they don’t have a problem. This vid from John on my channel can help you understand how prevalent this silent killer is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lshFa… Upon discovering my blood sugar problem, I returned my focus to lifestyle & diet. I went from a plant-based/pescatarian to low carb. I have tended to keep my carbs below 100gm/day. (I don’t worry about - in fact, I push- fiber carbs, like broccoli, cauliflower, and Brussels sprouts.) The science is clear that you can reverse plaque. This is especially true for plaque less than 3 years old. We have several videos covering the science in this area. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysifM… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkWIy… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqbac… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoZ4g… My arterial age steadily decreased over a 2 year period to those of a 52 year old. I’m feeling good. And I can show you how to decrease your arterial age.

(Jack Bennett) #18

We can say that statins have some benefit for secondary prevention in male patients, assuming that those patients either don’t experience or can handle the side effects (myalgia, etc).

With the 5-year NNT >100 for primary prevention, it doesn’t seem worth the downside risk for me personally (or others in my family whom I have advised), but it’s a personal decision that each patient must make for him or herself.

The statistical trickery used in pitching the statins is also worth viewing with a critical eye - quoting relative numbers when promoting benefits and absolute numbers when mentioning risks and side effects, for example.

(Edith) #19

Just a thought: Is it possible that after your time on keto you actually didn’t need the statins any more, and therefore the combo of keto and statins may have caused the trouble?

#20

I haven’t watched the video, but just from the transcript you provided, he adjusted his lifestyle and added niacin as well as statins.
Is this your evidence that statins are good for you?

If you weren’t feeling good on Keto and feel better having stopped, I think you should do what works for you and I hope that you continue to improve! But blanket statements like “statins are good for you” can be very misleading to folks who come onto the forum for information.

(Bunny) #21

Statins & CoQ10: (aches and pains after taking statins everyday; esp. in the morning? CoQ10 deficiency?) The statins, not the ketogenic diet?

“…It might be worth trying the statin and seeing if it does lower small LDL (if you do make sure you supplement with CoQ10 which is an essential co-factor that we make using the same pathway as Cholesterol). …”

(Barbara Schibly) #22

I have two patients who have completely reversed their RA. One by eliminating gluten (meaning ALL grains not just wheat - no “gluten-free” garbage, no oats, no corn, no rice etc.- and no processed foods since gluten is added to the majority of them. The other patient had to reduce other high lectin foods as well - nightshade veges, seeds, etc. By “completely reversed” I mean not only are they now asymptomatic but their lab values are completely normal. (One of them was actually considering medically retiring because her RA was so bad.) So that’s one suggestion.

(David Epstein) #23

One of the main reasons I have been on KETO is to stop my RA. I have had no grain for over a year, no pulses, no processed foods no gluten (meaning ALL grains not just wheat - no “gluten-free” garbage, no oats, no corn, no rice etc. All I eat is beef, pig, chicken, fish, broccoli, cabbage, cauliflower, lettuce, radishes, celery, eggs, double cream, hard cheese, camenbert. I have a very simple diet. I drink a lot of coffee with coconut oil. I have retired as I ache a lot. Yet I have seen no change. I do have an auto-immune problem called cytopenia, this is being looked into by a specialist hematologist, who I will be seeing this coming Friday. I do hope they can sort it out. They reckon this immune problem of mine could be the cause of my RA. My eyes are also affected I get uveitis now and then. So I’ve become rather disappointed being on KETO regarding my inflammation.

(David Epstein) #24

I took CoQ10 for two months, it played havoc on my hypertension meds. One minute my BP went very low and then went back to my normal BP then went back to low again. So I was getting dizzy spells and feeling light headed. As stuff like CoQ10 is not recognized by the NHS I couldn’t go to the doctors about it as it has taken many months just to get my hypertension meds right.

(David Epstein) #25

One of the main reasons I have been on KETO is to stop my RA. I have had no grain for over a year, no pulses, no processed foods no gluten (meaning ALL grains not just wheat - no “gluten-free” garbage, no oats, no corn, no rice etc. All I eat is beef, pig, chicken, fish, broccoli, cabbage, cauliflower, lettuce, radishes, celery, eggs, double cream, hard cheese, camenbert. I have a very simple diet. I drink a lot of coffee with coconut oil. I have retired as I ache a lot. Yet I have seen no change. I do have an auto-immune problem called cytopenia, this is being looked into by a specialist hematologist, who I will be seeing this coming Friday. I do hope they can sort it out. They reckon this immune problem of mine could be the cause of my RA. My eyes are also affected I get uveitis now and then. So I’ve become rather disappointed being on KETO regarding my inflammation.

(Barbara Schibly) #26

I would suggest trying a carnivore diet for a few weeks as an elimination diet. Get rid of all the plant food and also dairy. (Or you can start with just getting the dairy out because that is another frequent offender) If you can, I would even consider switching meat sources. lamb for instance if that’s not something you usually eat. I’m not sure if you have access to bison or game meats but those are other possibilities.

(Bunny) #27

I’m sorry to hear it did not workout so well for you.

Could be adrenal fatigue from not eating enough carbohydrates which is causing conditions much like postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome?

The other could be too high a dose of CoQ10 or taking it too often?

References:

[1] High blood pressure: The majority of research shows that taking coenzyme Q-10 by itself or along with other medications for treating high blood pressure seems to help lower blood pressure. However, one small study suggests that taking coenzyme Q-10 by mouth may not lower blood pressure in people that also have a condition called metabolic syndrome. …More

(Katie) #28

I am sorry that you are having a difficult time.

A lot of foods that people eat for the ketogenic diet exacerbate arthritis, such as spinach, dairy, and nuts. A lot of people who have autoimmune issues find relief by doing carnivore (without dairy). I am not a professional, but that is what I would try.

(Edith) #29

You may want to listen to this podcast with Mikaela Peterson. She cured her RA by eating strictly carnivore. She had quite a journey!

(Alex) #30

For what it’s worth - my autoimmune conditions got worse on keto (I was already avoiding gluten, grains and nightshades) and it took me ages to narrow it down to coconut.

Yep, because I’d limited my diet I was eating a lot more coconut than I ever had before and unfortunately it can trigger an autoimmune response.

Having been as fed up as you sound by dealing with everything (totally sympathise with the constant cycle of hope and dissapointment) I would recommend cutting out eggs, dairy and coconut (and any vinegar or spices or coffee or chocolate) and literally just eat meat, offal, animal fats, and some well-cooked green veggies and see how you feel after 3 months. Boring as hell? Yes. Worth the answer to if diet is the cause of your problems? Up to you to decide.

Edit: Just to add - after reversing all my symptoms which took about 6 months, I slowly reintroduced foods and can now tolerate eggs and coconut fine, and dairy, chocolate, vinegar, seeds and nuts in moderation (about 2-3 servings of each a week, basically just not every day). Nightshades, coffee and grains still give me a severe reaction, particularly wheat, corn and paprika. Which is sad as smoked paprika is the best. If I’m ill or stressed I avoid everything on my moderation list until the source of the stress has passed.

(Jane) #31

Well, if eating keto makes you feel ill and not eating keto relieves your symptoms then I see you have 2 options - try a carnivore for a couple of weeks to see if your health improves or stop eating keto.

#32

Just in regards to the hypertension. I seem for some undiscovered (yet) reason be sensitive to salt. I not sure what 4gs would do to me but though N=1testing on me I know increased salt is increased BP. I found increasing water intake seems to help. It also seems impact by caffeine and alcohol consumption.

As researchers and doctors are treating people with cancer, AD and T2D with some form of a ketogenic diet in combination with other treatments. I decided it makes the most sense to follow it. There are tons of variations out there maybe there is one which works better for you life and heath are yours.

(Barbara Schibly) #33

You might try KCL instead of NaCL

(David Epstein) #34

Well thank you for this information…I do do a lot of coconut oil (cooking and in my coffee). I put paprika in alot of my meats and curry’s.
I’m trying out the low carb diet now… Not that happy with it.

I’m gonna have to have a deep think about what you are saying. But many thanks for your advice.

(David Epstein) #35

I’ve upped my B3 and D3 and omegas 6,3,9. for my aching shoulders. However my back problem has disappeared as soon as I went out of keto.