Help Carnivore Diet long term side effects

(Vivin Mathew) #1

I’ve been on the carnivore diet for 6 months. I transitioned cause i had immense unbearable pain in the knee at the point that i couldn’t walk. But ever since carnivore u could walk. I remember i could eat small amounts of berries nuts without a problem. But i went many months without nuts and berries. And now if i just have a couple of berries. I have a violent diarrhoea and extreme unbearable pain on the knee is back. And it takes two weeks on the carnivore again for the pain to go away. I feel like I’m trapped in this diet. I do not know what to do. Please help me. I do not want to be a prisoner. I can tolerate diarrhoea. But i can’t tolerate the knee pain. Please someone advise me .

(Linda ) #2

If you can’t eat it yet listen to what your body is saying…it might be that your body needs more time to heal…berries are just breaking down to sugar so you don’t really need them…

I was having trouble with cream giving me stomach cramps bloating and diahrea I assumed I’d suddenly become lactaid intolerant but Dr cywes said he doubted that he said more likely its just that the villi in your digestive system has got blunt and it takes time for it to heal from all the damage the sugar has done from sad diet … I can have cream now so long as its …boiled…
Even on keto I started having issues with eating different vegies which pushed me to carnivore…if I can’t eat something I leave it out try again later…

(Edith) #3

I did a carnivore trial for seven months. Before my trial I could not tolerate any dairy. Now I seem to be able to handle small amounts without a reaction. Healing takes time. You may need more.

I still won’t eat a real serving of dairy. I’m too afraid, but it’s nice to know if a little slips in I won’t be in pain.

(Vivin Mathew) #4

But what i don’t understand is that. I was in this diet for 6 months now. I was able to tolerate little of other food for about 4 months without a problem. But around the fifth month it feels like my body completely changed. Granted that the carnivore diet made my pain go away but why were i able to tolerate it in the first few months but not now

(Vivin Mathew) #5

Yes. But for me i was able to tolerate these did earlier and even during the first four months of the carnivore. But now I’m able to do none. Have my body become screwed up; should i try to slowly transition back out should i stick to carnivore for longer.

(Edith) #6

Well…. Maybe you couldn’t handle them to begin with. You had unbearable knee pain. It went away on carnivore. Came back after eating some plant food. Went away again upon removing those foods. It seems plant foods maybe have been contributing to that pain if that pain goes away when you stop eating them.

I read once years ago that when the gut starts to heal, the new cells are hyper sensitive and over react. This seemed to be true in our family when we removed gluten years ago. My daughter especially, was feeling better almost instantly upon the cessation of eating gluten. After the first month, she ate something with gluten and her body reacted almost violently. Way worse than before she’d stopped it. Unfortunately, she still can’t eat gluten. Removing it from her diet did not allow her to eventually be able to eat it again.

Only time will tell for you, but for now, those healing gut cells may be hypersensitive and that’s why the diarrhea.

(Vivin Mathew) #7

Thank you for your response. Virginia. your reply gives my relief, that im not the only one. The carnivore diet is like a double-edged sword. On one hand, i feel better than ever before and i am finally able to walk again. But on the other hand, if i try to add even something very mildly like a raspberry(which i never in my life had a problem with), then the pain comes back with a VENGEANCE and extremely violent diarhoea. I am a bit afraid for the future, as i feel like i have become a prisoner to this diet.

It wouldnt be a problem where i live (France), to do the carnivore diet. But i am indian, and in india, beef is not easy to come by. And im afraid for my survival during that period.

Your point on gut healing and becoming hypersensitive gives me an answer which makes sense. I am not really interested in having gluten again. But i would like to add few things like fruits, or mild veggies. Do you suspect that my body is locked into this diet and can never have something other than meat mmy entire life?

(Edith) #8

Gosh, that’s a good question. Everyone is so individual.

Many people try carnivore as an elimination diet: eat only meat, feel better, and then very carefully add foods back in to see how they feel. You may need to try something like that. Get to the point where you feel good and then try adding something. See how you feel. If you feel fine for a week, try adding something else. If you don’t, remove that food, recover, and then try something different.

Unfortunately, some people find they can’t go off carnivore. You may have heard mention of Mikhaila Peterson who healed her severe rheumatoid arthritis eating only meat, beef actually. She can’t seem to reintroduce vegetable food of any kind.

Are you eating any other meats besides beef? You don’t only have to eat beef on carnivore. Chicken, eggs, lamb, pork, seafood… they are all okay on carnivore. Some variety may keep you from feeling trapped.

Also, do you eat any dairy products. I find dairy gives me joint pain.

(Vivin Mathew) #9

Yes the reason i went on carnivore is for my arthritis(knees) and wrists. Wrists have not yet completely healed. But the symptoms and pain from knees greatly reduced on tis diet. As a plus. digestion, my psoriasis also improved( which i didnt really care for that much as the knee pain). And to an extent my bak pain reduced.

It feels like ive fallen and locked into this diet. i know of Mikhaila Peterson and jordan. Them shawn baker and dr. berry gave me hope for this diet and for my health.i cant re introduce even brocolli.

i do eat all kinds of meat. but 95% is beef. and eggs(3-4 everyday). I could eat chicken, but it seems to have less nutrition than the others. So i dont bother much with it. Otherwise pork, salmon and sardines and shrimps i try to have them as well.

I cannot eat dairy. I am allergic to both lactose and the casein protein. And i have severe joint flare ups for the knees the following day. but i try to experiment with goat cheese or goat milk products from time to time and it flares up less.

I am not sure if this diet is a blessing or a curse yet. On one hand i am free of pain. But on the other. when i am travelling or in another place without beef then im screwed.

(Bob M) #10

Have you tried something that is A2 protein only, such as goat cheese? If so, what that bed too? (And it is for some.)

While I’m not carnivore, I’m close. Yesterday, for instance, I ate carnivore. Today, I’ll have olives with my lunch/breakfast.

What I have found is that over time, I can tolerate certain foods, at least infrequently. Salads, for instance. I can have one, maybe two, per week now. I just went on vacation and had a lot of them (substituted them for fries with burgers, or for potatoes). That was too many. I got hard defecation, some IBS, a bit of feeling as if I had to go to the bathroom when I couldn’t/constipation. But if I keep these rare, I can handle them.

It took a while to get there, though.

There are still plenty of plants (including gluten) that affect me negatively. But what I’ve found is that, over time, I can have more of these now. Though, honestly, I still don’t have them that often.

(Vivin Mathew) #11

I have tried goat cheese about 2 times in low quantities. And both times it didnt appear to trigger a reaction. But probably the quantity was low. A2 protein i still havent done more testing. Roquefort and feta from goat seems ok in small quantities. But ill do my next test upon recovery. Just to verify.

I was part carnivore before and ten went full on. and now i cant take any other diet except carnivore. maybe with time it would change and i can start implementing it little by little.

It depends on the quantities, i could tolerate more before. but now, even half a lemon, gives me an explosion.

i can really live without veggies its not really a problem. at the moment. an i like the carnivore diet. But just the thought that i cant shift anymore without an explosion and crippiling my knees is a scary thought that i have now become a prisoner to it.

(Laurie) #12

What @VirginiaEdie says makes sense. An analogy would be smoking … A person can smoke cigarettes for years and seemingly have no ill effects. Then if they quit smoking, just one puff can make them feel sick. The years of regular smoking made them sick too, but the body learned to adjust somehow. @Fieryfire , maybe it’s the same for you and eating berries?

As for not being able to easily find beef in India – yes, for many of us (in various countries), it’s difficult to acquire the kind of meat, etc., that we need. The local stores don’t sell it, or we can’t afford it, and so on. Or we manage to buy some, and our families eat it, leaving us with no food we can eat.

There are other challenges as well. For example, I am reluctant to eat with other people because there is social pressure to eat certain things. Or the things I can eat are not on the menu.

So yes, it can be a bit of a trap, but we do what we need to do. Remember that many non-ketoers also have food restrictions, e.g., for religious or health reasons, and learn to live with them. Just one of life’s inconveniences. Good luck!

(Bob M) #13

It can be tough in the US, too. I went on vacation to Rhode Island, near the ocean. Easy to find fish. Went to buy steaks for dinner (we rented a house that had a gas grill). $20/pound for steaks. Yikes! (We bought salmon and swordfish instead.)

And many restaurants were fish-centric. Steak was not on the menu.

While I like fish, I rarely order it out, because you’ll be really lucky to get 6 or 8 ounces of fish. Meanwhile, most steaks are 14-16 ounces and actually list how much they weigh (whereas fish does not).

(Edith) #14

Just remember: when you are traveling, it is temporary. If you have to eat chicken for a few weeks, you are not going to have massive vitamin deficits. :blush:

(Linda ) #15

You cook try cooking your fruit see if that makes a difference sometimes allergy is bought on by the fresh in season fruit…as I said but even on keto the vegetables I was able to totolerate for years started causing me pain , bloating …like spinach, asparagus , which made moving over to carnivore easier…

If you can handle chicken I’d use that in place of beef while on vacation you can add fats to it if you need…a side of bacon or sausage…
Losing the pain in my knees and lower back for me is worth it even if I have to stay just meat… but I think part of the problem is when we change our Microbiome and go to meat we lose others so maybe a probiotic might help if your trying to go ketovore?

(Vic) #16

All plants are toxic to a degree, plants are living organisms that dont want to be eaten, producing toxins is how they defend themselfs. They cant run away or bite like animals.

While most plants on earth would kill us if we eat them, some of them we can handle and use as food. Nontheless they are still toxic.

Humans can build a resistans to toxins if we introduce them in very small quantities, thus teaching ourselfs to deal with it. Its called Hormesis.

So one can go back to eating plants by slowly introducing them and build hormesis to the toxins.

@Fieryfire Its sounds to me that you are actually out of your plant prison, away from the toxins that make you imobile.
Its time to realise that carnivore makes you free, healthier and your immune system now works how it suppose to work. Plants are not for you, you can’t handle the toxins, so the benifits of plant foods are not for you.

No worry, animal foods have all we need.

The plants are in the prison now for you, keep them there and stay out. No need to listen to us, listen to your body. :wink:

I lived without pain for nearly 4 years now. Small amount of plants I can handle but why eat them If they harm me? I’m free now.

Jm2c

(Vivin Mathew) #17

I do not smoke. And its been ages since i really drank. But certainly eating one or two berries are not supposed to kill you. Which is what is worrying me.

Eggs should be alot easier to find than beef. Is it possible to sustain carnivore diet with about 12 eggs a day and maybe traces of chicken? Is it only possible with rumnimants?

Yes my biggest fear is now i have become a social outcast with this diet. I cant have meals with other people anymore. When i visit my relatives in the future ill have to refuse the food and literally no one will ever understand this diet. My wife and everyone i know are waiting for me to breakdown from the carnivore and call it abnormal. The truth is, i want to be more ketovore or omnivore, but its impossible for me to cause then i would not be able to walk anymore if eat anything else.

There are blessings to the diet. But there are obvious traps as well. The biggest trap being, all other foods prevent me from walking. It is tragic,

Vegetarians and vegans are more common and socially excepted everywhere. Omnivores the most. But definitely not carnivores.

(Vivin Mathew) #18

Yes. Totally understand. The cost can be aggravating. Even if i do not buy sodas, candies, chocolates, or literally anything else anymore. Beef alone can be expensive.

(Vic) #19

Shure, no problem. But do eat nose to tail, chicken liver, skinn, hearts, cartilage, eat all of it. Egg white cooked, egg yellows raw.

I feel you there. This is hard to deal with. Not impossible thou.
I have an arsenal of tricks and excuses that work for me but wouldnt workn in your culture.
I have found India to be a dificult place to be a carnivore, I can imagine this to be even way harder for you. Hope you find ways to do this without family conflicts.

(Vivin Mathew) #20

Thank you for those words. Indeed plants have anti-nutrients which are the cause of all this. cabbage alone has like 42 anti-nutrients i believe. But the vast majority of people who eat them, do not have an explosive level diarrhea followed by crippling legs. This is my only problem. Since i wish to e able to tolerate small quantities to not be a weirdo outcast when i visit families, friends and relatives during the 100 indian festivals out there… I used to have these foods without problem before. But now, it nearly kills me(not to sound over dramatic) but feels like it.

Thats why i call the carnivore as both a GIFT and a CURSE. Being Indian, its hard to move by with being carnivore in India. Im not sure if i can sustain without rumninants in India. Would you know if 12 eggs, chicken and fish a day would be enough to sustain this diet for about 3 months on this diet.

I have no problem with eating the diet forever. I am ok with the taste, and i dont really envy other foods so much. Its just to have been locked by the diet. And the issue that i cant transition or even have some good quality organic food for a single meal without the crippling pain and diarrhea that bothers me too much