Thanks for reading this. I’m a 65 yo male, 6’2" and 230#, low T, have mild (stable) Parkinson’s. Weight is mostly in a ‘tire’ around my middle.
2 weeks on keto now - to lose weight and because it’s supposed to help Parkinson’s tremors. I quit sugar and processed foods cold-turkey as well as starting keto cold-turkey. I tend to be an “If you’re gonna do it, then DO IT!” guy.
Uber-groggy, weak, shaky for 3 days and fine ever since.
Lost 4# first week (I assume all water weight judging by bathroom time). 234 lbs dropped to 230 lbs.
Received my KetoBM (low cost) keto-meter and measured 0.7 mmol/mL at the end of the 1st week. Then measured 0.9 at the end of the 2nd week.
Weight at end of second week was 230# again … no weight loss.
Are these numbers typical? Seems a slow start on the ketones and I expected at least ‘some’ weight loss during the second week. Should I be eating keto AND watching daily calories? What ketones measurement is considered “solidly in ketosis” and what measurement should I look for as the longer-term daily average?
Congrats on making the move. I’m new to keto as well so I can’t answer your questions about the ketone levels in your blood but it’s going on a month since I did a 36-hour fast to get into ketosis.
Pants are looser, weight is going down, and both fasting and daily average blood glucose has dropped a good amount.
I’ve been using urine strips to check my ketones and they seemed to be fading so I’m 22 hours into a 24-hour fast. If my blood glucose is still in the seventies at bedtime I’ll not break the fast and wait until I get up in the morning.
Just checked with another urine strip and it’s back to showing trace amount of ketones.
Good luck and hopefully someone with more experience in keto will chime in on your questions.
The more I look into it (keto), the more it appears that there is a pretty strong genetic factor involved. I guess the simplest answer is that it works, but you (anyone) may need to take extra steps to get into and to stay in ketosis… intermittent fasting, more time on the calendar for changes to take effect, etc. It’s funny because I “did keto” (ahem) several years ago and didn’t have a lot of luck. I realize now that what I was doing was more of a carnivora diet, not so much a keto diet. My diet fat content was way too low. THIS time, I’m tracking each and every little thing that goes in my mouth and aim for 75% fat calories in every snack or meal. I’m definitely in ketosis now … measured 1.8 mmol yesterday. I’d like that to be around 2.0±0.2 mmol and I’d like to see continuing weight loss week over week. I decided to weigh in just once a week (trying not to obsess) and to weigh in right outta bed on Monday mornings. I figure a Monday weigh-in motivates me to stick with it and to be good all weekend …
It’s interesting, too, that back when I tried it the first time, there was a lot of hoo-haw about the dangers of being on keto for too long and there was a lot less discussion on fat calorie percentages to aim for, e.g. you can eat too high of a fat calorie percentage and you can eat too low. Nowadays, it seems there is a lot more support for long-term, even permanent, keto and when it comes to the fat percentage, it’s now 70%-75% and going over 75% is not recommended if weight loss is your goal. You don’t want to provide so many fats in your diet that you get all you need and then have no reason for your body to consume stored fat. Same thing with calories overall … not a big deal, it seems, but eating too many calories can shut down weight loss too. Of course, all of this comes from research that I’ve been doing since my first post above, and none of it comes from personal experience yet … just trying to get educated and aim for success the best way I can.
You’re off to a wonderful start. Congratulations on your diligence and stamina in charting a course and sticking with it. Here are a few tips (from a late-60s guy who has cut out the carbs for 5+ years now) …
Watching your carbs is the key. Everything else is interesting but not really relevant nor determinative.
Measure ketones? Sure, go ahead. But accept the fact that they will be what they will be.
Measure your weight on the bathroom scale? Sure, go ahead (at your peril). Your weight will “right itself” when it’s good and ready. Avoiding the carbs is how it will get ready
Keto long-term? Well, of course.
But doesn’t it stop working if you start eating carbs again, so why bother?
Well, when alcoholics start drinking again all the benefits are reversed, so why bother quitting?
But alcoholics don’t need to drink alcohol. Everyone needs to eat!
Yes, we all need to eat. But if you eat inflammatory, artery-damaging, fat-building, brain-damaging (viz. various auto-immune diseases) heavily marketed crap - like sugar and most every other form of carbohydrate - you are not eating health-promoting food. Instead, you are eating stuff that will slowly drag you back into disease and discomfort.
Again, trust your body to figure out what level of ketones need to circulate in your bloodstream. After all, it’s your body that is producing them.
Let your body decide how much it will weigh. After all, that number is simply an indication of how strongly the Earth is tugging on you. It doesn’t say anything about what’s going on inside of you. That’s what matters most.
Best wishes on your pathway to turning around your health outlook. Kudos on your strong start. Keep us posted.
Welcome to the start of an awesome health journey!
You are doing great! Cold turkey is hard, but be sure to eat plenty of fats (a healthy mix of plant and animal sources) for satiety, and add electrolytes to your water.
I would advise to remain very low carb (20g or less per day) in the first few weeks to a month, if you’re looking to raise ketones higher. For “nutritonal ketosis,” often utilized for weight management, .5 and above blood ketones are considered solid, so you are there!
I would recommend testing your blood ketones and glucose at least once a week to make sure you’re on your goals. I have never counted calories on keto, but you do want most of your calories to come from fats.
Very good reasoning and stuff I’ve been wondering about. It’s taking me a little to come up with meals or recipes, but that’s OK. Thanks for verifying some of my questions…
That’s what I’m trying to do, but no electrolytes yet … and no blood sugar testing here, just my $29 ketones tester (which seems to work fine). I’m doing well on the cold turkey approach, probably because had a little toast in the morning is all when it comes to carbs … otherwise, I favored meat over fruits/veggies/starches anyway, but try to include a couple of servings of fruits/veggies every day anyway … except for right now, but after some measure of success, I’ll start merging in veggies … fruits can wait (too sweet)…
Yes indeed. Deciding the “what to eat?” part of carb-restriction is the biggest challenge (at first) when trying to alter your way of eating.
You can get really creative and get yourself involved with new recipes. Or you can keep things incredibly simple and basic (e.g., eggs, fish, beef, pork, cheese…). Regardless, eat, eat, eat. Do not deny yourself healthy selections when you are hungry. That’s the key to (a) feeding your body what it needs and (b) not feeling deprived like you would on most every other “diet.”
Yeah … I accidentally end up too low on total calories if I don’t watch it … like, I’m 6’2" 230# … 1200-1300 calories is too low! Base Metabolic Rate (BMR), just an estimate - I know, comes to around 2000 calories, which for an average day of activity probably means eating around 2300+ per day…
Got a 16 oz Rib steak salted and dry brining for tomorrow when I’ll reverse sear it, and that should be a good way of getting more calories! We bought a half beef a year ago and I still have tons of steaks left … gotta quit saving them for guests and start treating myself like a guest!
Stay with it. Weight loss is not linear.
Keep researching and use your own findings as a guide, we’re all slightly different right?
But Keto / Low Carb / Carnivore does work for everyone that that follows it, just might need some personal adjustment re things like salt.
I’m two and a half years living like this and I’m still. even today, amazed at the change, improvement, benefit etc.
Good advice. I’m an engineer and tend to over-analyze things … but given the feedback above, I think I’ll follow the diet as carefully as I can, let my weight settle in wherever it settles in, and keep up/increase physical activity along the way. I do already see improvement in my Parkinson’s symptoms (less trembling) and that’s good. My neurologist doesn’t seem to know these things … a product of Big Pharma, I guess, but in my neck of the woods … I have no other option when it comes to neurologists.
Wow, congrats to make this big step! When I went keto, I already was on a low-carb since several years and burned down to bridges back to high-carb in the very beginning I couldn’t do keto close to my high-carb days, I have tried (but I hadn’t your motivation, that’s true. but my body screamed at me so I suppose I needed my low-carb years even physically. they were great for me back then, by the way but later I needed keto and even getting near to carnivore).
So, it’s a very, very big step, for now I would just be getting comfortable with keto! Being careful with calories on top of that may be a too big burden but I can say (after many years ofr tracking on and off) that tracking isn’t a way to live (and it didn’t help me with fat-loss either but it may be just me. I did learn a lot from it, at least here and there).
AND… You are merely a newbie ketoer. Fat adaptation is an important milestone, it’s possible that you get more results afterwards.
4 pounds of water loss, I had that (every time I went into ketosis, for years. of course I gained it back immediately when I ate too much carbs for ketosis). I lost zero fat in my first 2 keto months (not like I have lost any noticeable amount later but I eat too much fat and my body doesn’t shed fat when there is plenty of fat from my food to go around, it makes sense to me). Still, there were benefits. Not on keto compared to low-carb but fat adaptation and going lower with plant carbs… That was significant. I needed great recipes and new habits too and they took time.
Your body probably does a lot of things and as you are fine on keto, it’s probably good for you (I mean, keto should be good for most but the ones who suffer, they probably are better with more carbs, even keto isn’t for everyone, after all)… Even if you don’t lose fat immediately. I would be patient for several weeks at least.
I know nothing about ketones, never could measure mine but I don’t care, my body gives me pretty bad feedback, if I eat right, I feel better immediately or in a few days at most. Very often, how we feel is what is important, not numbers, they are often unreliable. Including weight, many people notice loosening pants even while the scale stays stubborn.
For me, mere ketosis wasn’t enough. Fat adaptation helped but too much (non-animal) carbs still messed with me, my appetite so it was harder to get satiated and easier to eat without need and not the greatest items for me. But for now, you should just get comfortable with ketosis, try things if you don’t like the current style, experiment if you like… The first keto style isn’t necessarily the one we stick to later. I needed to drop most plants at some points and it was a game changer (just like my high to low-carb switch ages ago). But it’s me, some people realize they need to add some carbs to feel really right. Or skip dairy or sweeteners. We are all different and no one can tell you what works best for you.
It is very easy for me since I added meat (and skipped most plants. best idea ever but I had to be ready for that). Vegetarian keto, well that was interesting… Not really hard after virtually vegetarian low-carb years but I am glad I never go back to it. Meat is something that is easy to eat in bigger amounts and there are so many other lean enough carnivore options if I get bored of some mere fried lean meat. If one adds some vegs and oily seeds, it gets even easier (or not. too much carbs mess with me. but a tiny bit of zucchini in my scrambled eggs or some eggs in purgatory? or meat with sauerkraut? may be a great idea now and then). But I make recipes since decades, I did have confused times but that was on vegetarian paleo… No meat, no dairy, that is tough for someone like me, no wonder I quickly quit (though I did because I ate very much carbs - mostly from paleo vegs I have skills - and it didn’t work for me)…
I have learned it’s important to have pretty good supplies. Enough variety (I need it, not everyone does), enough meat (NO wishful thinking or even realistic idea about what is enough. no, it’s better have plenty of meat or at least quick options in the freezer). So when hunger and boredom hits (I mean, I am hungry but bored of what I have planned and have), I don’t feel forced to grab something bad in desperation. I can grab something else but still great food.
Wow. I accidentally overeat fat all the time so I can’t relate but really, eating fat is ridiculously easy. A few bites and bam, extra 1000 kcal. But if you need to be careful, be that. Undereating is very bad. Fat enough meat, maybe a little this and that (I prefer eggs and dairy) and it won’t be so very low, most probably! I don’t know if you need to focus on protein but that’s quite important too as you most probably are aware.
Wonderful I remember times when I drastically changed my diet and didn’t care about lack of fat-loss as I still got some nice benefits! But it was only 2 weeks, you can expect much more!
Thanks for all the info, everyone. Good to know my experience is on track and normal. What I’m doing for meal management right now is to put together low-carb meals, log each, then for each one (if necessary) I’ll add a touch of whole cream or walnuts (supposed to be good for brain/neuro health) to get the fat percentage to a reasonable amount … 72% to 76% (goal is 74% for me). Seems to work and minimizes my effort … and has kept the carbs to 20% or lower (23g / day for me). Weigh-in on Monday … but I feel great. If I feel a desire for carbs, I just have a keto snack to take the edge off any hunger and then the carb craving goes away. Takes discipline…
Seems like you’re moving in a good direction! Don’t worry about the ketone numbers, they literally don’t matter, only that they’re there. But fix the low T, that’s the easiest thing to do, and a very literal uphill battle with that being low, among the laundry list of negatives of health and how you feel with your T levels in the tank.
I only grazed over the benefits of Keto and Parkinsons, seems it’s mostly the anti-inflammatory end of it that’s helping it, which is great. But if it turns out it’s the ketones themselves, like with things like Epilepsy, then also consider exogenous ketones as well for an extra boost.
Weight at end of second week was 230# again … no weight loss.
We can still over eat for our metabolic rate as well as gain on keto, no shortage of keto’rs bulk when on keto, if you’re not losing, start tracking your intake. With fat being a little over twice as calorically dense as carbs and proteins, it’s not hard to do. Also remember the low T has a negative metabolic effect.
I thought I read that hormone treatments, in general, were a cancer risk so I have not looked into treatments for low-T. What I read on the Parkinson’s was that the ketones were what helped, and that you could even take a ketone salts supplement and it shuts off the tremors … but damages the liver if you did that long term. The suggestion instead, is to live on a keto diet. Who knows? Studies come and go and often contradict or weren’t well designed and the results can’t be conclusive. Worth a try though … if it helps, then good. If not, then oh well, eh?
There was a vegan doctor who promoted veganism until he started treating a lot of his older vegan patients for Parkinson’s. He concluded the vegan diet is too low in omega 3s. I try to include either wild salmon or sardines in my weekly diet. I also usually have wild shrimp in garlic butter. Grass fed animals will also have a higher percentage of omega 3s to omega 6s than grain fed animals. Avoid grain fed pork, which is extremely high in omega 6 (but grain fed chicken is not too far behind). Ketones may help a little bit, because they produce less oxidative products from the mitochondria than burning sugar.
You can do things to promote higher ketones. I use a salad dressing with MCT oil, balsamic vinegar and herbs. I also have goat yogurt every morning which may give me about a half ounce of MCTs. I find it gives me good energy. Those MCT fats will go straight to ketones. Chemical exposure seems to be another factor in Parkinson’s. Do not drink contaminated well water.
You mentioned low T. If you do TRT, it will cut your natural production, and at some point you may lose the ability to make your own. Also, TRT tends to promote BPH, and normally requires some measures to stop conversion into estrogen. I have found doctors tend to ignore conversion into DHT, which can also cause BPH. Instead, over the last 5 years I have boosted my T about 10%(when with aging it would probably decrease about 6-10%) by supplementing with natural aromatase inhibitors, DIM and indole-3-carbinol. I supplement with beta-sitosterol and lycopene to stop conversion into DHT. I attribute these 4 supplements to indirectly “raising” my T by decreasing its conversion into unwanted estrogen and DHT - less BPH concerns too.
You put taterhead in your handle - I started not far from you, but a little smaller at 6 ft 218 lbs. One of the first things I ever did to lose weight was to simply stop eating potato chips. I had gotten into a heavy chip habit, and after two hernia surgeries, decided I needed to change. So, I began adding creatine to my morning yogurt and quit potato chips. The rest of my daily routine stayed the same - same walking, etc. I lost 18 pounds that year. After I ended up having surgery for a tumor, I decided to pay more attention to my health, and after a year adopted keto to concentrate on my weight after getting my BP under control by supplementing with vitamin K2, and vitamin D in the winter.
I will be on my fifth year of keto this winter. I do a low grade keto, and include some soluble fiber with every meal. I typically do 3 days of intermittent fasting with food after my evening workout. The other 4 days my breakfast will include some organic berries with my goat yogurt. I typically also have some butter seasoned cruciferous vegetables or asparagus with my dinner. Even with all this my blood ketones lab measured at 1 last December. I believe the soluble fiber promotes lower BP by getting converted into short chain fatty acids by the microbiome which promote gut health, but perhaps surprisingly, arterial health. The endothelial cells “relax” when they burn SCFAs, and BP tends to drop. They can pick up the SCFAs straight out of the blood stream because they don’t get packed into LDL particles.
You are on the right track here. I have never counted a day’s calories in my life. I actually try not to cut calories in ketosis because I do not want to lose muscle, which long-term low calorie dieting will cause. In fact I have lost weight even with adding a chocolate coconut oil fat bomb during keto, which I did add up the calories for as someone prompted it, and for that alone I came up with about a thousand calories. Otherwise, I try not to purposefully add fat to my diet… I don’t do these crazy things you may see get promoted like eating sticks of butter. My fat bomb has a purpose of adding cacao and GABA powder to my routine, which otherwise are kind of “undesirable” tasting.
I don’t have tons of variety, but my veggies are typically lightly steamed and then grass-fed butter and Herbamayer are added for seasoning. My salmon is typically pan seared with lemon juice, etc. My wild shrimp is typically dipped in garlic butter. My lamb is oven roasted at 300 F in a base of olive oil, organic dijon mustard, salt, pepper, rosemary and thyme. I eat my crab simply steamed out of the shell. Grass-fed beef sometimes - usually more in my low carb phase of the year in chilli or maybe a steak. I like chicken thighs too, but sometimes go for other options such as turkey breast. I don’t go out of my way to get pasture-raised chicken though. It is even more uneconomical than lamb or beef. Keto breakfast will usually be goat yogurt with berries, xylitol and monk fruit sweeteners. Followed by eggs with either uncured bacon, A2 cheese or sun-dried tomatoes.
The extra fat will probably increase ketones for a time, but I figure over time that will just mean less fat getting burnt off the body. I personally concentrate on protein during ketosis, and add to it with protein smoothies, which by the way include an avocado(fairly high in soluble fiber). I would say during the rest of the year I am maintenance level protein only - maybe even too low.
If you include a brisk morning or evening walk, you will probably have more fat loss, but it is not necessary. Carnivore works for a lot of people, but as I have said, I include some carbs, esp sources of soluble fiber. My LDL read a little high last December(175), but a lot of it was VLDL, and that is to be expected when you are transporting fats to be burned, right? So my triglycerides were 198, but everthing else was within “normal” limits. Low BP, etc. You are doing fine. Don’t worry too much about the details. Enjoy your food! I do! I eat til I am satisfied. When I first started keto, I told my wife “this is going to be hard.” That was out of hearing all my life how hard dieting is. The thing is that is because dieting has typically concentrated on low fat, low calorie days full of hunger and even tons of exercise. ie the Biggest Loser… Now, I know they were “losers” because it was not sustainable, and lowered their metabolisms by about 400-500 calories per day - making it all the harder to maintain. Suffering and tons of work wih no long-term win adds up to losers in my book. I’m not trying to be mean. It is just a misled paradigm. I am down exactly 40 pounds from my peak - and that is with some added muscle. I enjoy my food and eat as much as I want - I even added a lunch on my recovery days during keto with a protein smoothie. As a matter of fact when I do that I typically don’t even feel hungry at dinner because that smoothie is about 50 gr of protein. I have simply changed my lifestyle, and gave up the junk food and processed desserts. But, I don’t go hungry. I always have something on hand like my own nut mix, etc. Even don’t get too hungry on my OMAD days anymore. My vastly improved BP(yesterday was 101/64) and health markers indicate I will not go on any prescription medications. My energy level and vitality are good - that’s encouraging now that I am in my 60s, when most Americans are going on BP medicines and statins, metformin, etc. You are headed into a bright future!!
Sugar and “processed foods” are not the only carbohydrates in ppl’s life… usually they all use starches (bread pasta potatoes etc). And nuts or other seeds etc. These will all raise your serum insulin and prevent kidney from eliminating salts and water from your body (which are most ppl’s indication of weight loss; burning fat makes water and CO2 and carbohydrates also hold water in your system). Feeling dizzy shaky groggy hard to make changes from sleep sit and stand due to low BP are what’s been termed Keto FLU. It corrects itself by you adjusting to salt fluid and mineral intake necessary with Normal (lower insulin) kidney function. Hope my analysis helps.
Our own endogenous hormones don’t cause cancer, that’s very well debunked. If you dig deeper into anything negative about ketone’s, it’s always going to be in the context of ketoacidosis, not what we do.
Look into all the negative effects of Low-T, that’s far scarier than the made of thing that having it higher all our younger years is a threat, when it almost universally improves quality of life.
I couldn’t do keto close to my high-carb days, I have tried (but I hadn’t your motivation, that’s true. but my body screamed at me so I suppose I needed my low-carb years even physically. they were great for me back then, by the way but later I needed keto and even getting near to carnivore).
I remember times when I drastically changed my diet and didn’t care about lack of fat-loss as I still got some nice benefits! But it was only 2 weeks, you can expect much more!