Fire in a Bottle - The ROS Theory of Obesity and The Proton Theory


(Ivan ) #181

You are right, he added starch to prove his hypothesis. There actually isn’t a reason to add it, other than the fact, that you don’t want to do keto. I have not added starch nor do I currently plan to ( I may test it out in the future and report). I prefer either the low carb or low fat approach (both with saturated fat). The middle ground is sketchy for me.
I mean, most junk food contains a combination of fats and carbs that override our satiety signal.

How many foods in nature contain a mixture of fats and carbs? Mothers milk and that’s basically it. The baby needs to eat/drink as many calories as possible to grow. It’s basically force feeding with a ratio of carbs and fats that overrides the brains satiety signals. Look at the label of every junk food item, just a shitty ratio of fats and carbs.

On top of that there is another thing that worries me if you add carbs. We all know the theory behind ros, but the question is, do all the cells become insulin resistant or just the adipose cells? Do muscle cells become insulin resistant? Because if they do that could lead to higher blood glucose levels and increased glycation, which is far from a good thing.

(PJ) #182

Yeah, he was allegedly only adding starch to demonstrate that the result could not be attributed to lowcarb. Unfortunately that seemed to inspire tons of lowcarb people to figure out how they could eat a diet that’s not low carb at all, because if you eat the right kind of fat, it might increase satiety and such.

Foods in nature that are carbs+fat and make you fat: acorns for squirrels, designed to fatten them up. Hence the website et al of “Don’t Eat for Winter.”

(PJ) #183

What does shea butter taste like? What kind of foods would it go with? Tallow is not great but it works fine in anything savory. Coconut I love no matter what, but is better than tallow for anything light or sweet. Cocoa butter’s great but very specific in flavor and I only like it with things sweet or chocolate.

(PJ) #184

I don’t even know where I got this but I have a big zillion-tab google doc for every topic of my life, and in the food/nutrient workbook I just found this sheet I exported to share, on fats


I was drinking coffee with cocoa butter during September and it was very satiating and resulted in many OMAD days.

This month I’m trying a coffee break, so am cooking keto-carnivore foods in suet and seeing how I go with that.

Trigger warning!

Oh, and forget croissants, I am mesmerised by the choice of fats used by this 93 year nonna in Sicily (to make a dessert)

None of these grannies are using seed oils that I can see having watched 3 of these videos so far. Lots of full cream dairy, olive oil and animal fats.

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #186

Posting these for ref. Thank you @ctviggen here.

(PJ) #187

Thank you so much for posting that!

Now THAT is really interesting. This issue of post-obese (or in my case still morbidly obese, despite great fat loss) people having trouble losing more weight, is such a huge issue. Maybe THE hugest. Because losing weight for some people is no big deal (assuming IF and/or Keto), losing weight for fat people is no big deal “to a degree” – but losing the rest, or not regaining at light speed, is the big question.

I pre-ordered some of the oil for January, I will try it with Berberine I have sitting here and have not yet taken, and see if I see any different results.


I’ve been looking for sterculic oil for years. I wish I could afford it.


The latest instalment. Speaking of stalls i might pay more attention to the fat quality in my LCHF WOE. Going to drop the chicken and pork and focus on beef.

(Peter) #190

Yeah, if we could stop people thinking the H is for "HIGH’ fat and change it to “HEALTHY” fat it would help a lot.

(Bacon by any other name would taste just as great.) #191

Gary and Belinda Fettke make a point of doing this. I don’t see how it matters. The words “high” and “low” in the context of LCHF and HCLF are objective terms. The fact that “high fat” scares people is a separate issue.


Supermarket bacon (and lard) is off the menu due to pig feeding practices messing up the fat ratios. Fancy bacon only from now on.

Mangalitsa pigs

(Anthony) #193

For years I couldn’t figure out why sometimes my bacon renderings were nearly liquid at room temp in the jar. I thought there was something wrong with the bacon I was buying and had even started trying different brands because of it. Now we know.

(Peter) #194

Butt that’s the point, it’s a massive issue. The less we can do to scare people away the better - we’ve already got the whacko carnivores for that.

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #195

Fact of life. You can’t save the world. You can’t even save someone else from himself. Everyone on this forum got here because he or she decided to investigate and implement. We’re not going to convince folks until they decide something has to change. Keto means very low carb and sufficiently high fat to replace the energy that used to come from carbs. That’s going to scare away everyone who buys into conventional nutrition. They’re either going to believe they can’t live without carbs or with so much fat. The best we can do is continue to chip away at the pseudo-science of conventional nutrition.

PS: I don’t think carnivores are whacky. Most came to it from diverse negative reactions to eating plants. Their response makes sense to me.

(bulkbiker) #196

Always the charmer I see…

(Peter) #197

If only I’d said: “all carnivores are whackos.” I didn’t, but don’t let that stop you pretending I did so you cake a strawman point.

Always the partial quoter so you can deliberately take things out of context, I see…

(Bacon by any other name would taste just as great.) closed #198

This kind of incivility is a sure way to get a topic shut down.