Eating fat on the run

(Sheri Knauer) #21

Im not a runner but have heard talk of keto runners who take exogenous ketones IF they need something during running and it works great.

Lol to butt butter…

(Tim W) #22

I was listening to the endurance planet podcast today. They suggest NOT eating fats/proteins during a race as it puts a load on the body to digest them. They suggested very simple carbs, mind you this was talking about a 10 hour bike ride but I’ve heard similar suggestions for longer marathons, say 4+ hours in length.

I still suggest using fat stores for longer, steady state activities, but do what you need to do to perform at the level you want to reach!

(LeeAnn Brooks) #23

This suggestion is for typical carb eaters. The predominate “wisdom” is to “carb load” before a long physical endurance sport.

But some elite athletes are switching to Keto and proving the prevailing wisdom wrong. You don’t need carbs if you are fat adapted. The only question for Keto athletes is do we fuel with Keto friendly fair before a workout or fasted.

(Mike Glasbrener) #24

That’s old wisdom and incorrect for fat adapted people. Carb loading will only raise insulin level and make fat stores less accessible. I’m a cyclist and still dialing in on bike nutrition… when I was a carb burner I consumed tons of carbs on the bike and metered them in. Now as fat adapted I’m still dialing things in. Almost no fuel for rides under 3hrs…

(Tim W) #25

You are 100% correct in that the old wisdom of carb loading is being left in the dust.

In the example from the podcast, they coach a ketogenic lifestyle and still advise some easy digesting carbs (the UCAN super starch is popular I guess, I have no idea what it is) in SOME cases, not every workout, and not as a rule.

They support working out fasted but also acknowledge that on a super long event, if you are striving for superior performance (we are talking professional level performance) then adding “good carbs” (not simple sugars or junk) can increase performance.

On the whole, I think that those of us not trying to win money at races can skip the pre-load, can race/exercise fasted, and don’t have to worry about grabbing a protein shake 12 seconds after exercise, if we are fat adapted, that’s all we need.

(Tim W) #26

Good on you!

It only gets better! Nothing like doing multiple hours of exercise without gels/goos/etc. In the winter I like to run with nothing, not even water if it’s cool enough, it’s very freeing isn’t it?

(Alec) #27

I’ve heard that Chris Froome takes this strategy. He is fully fat adapted, his base diet is near keto, but when he is racing and in hard training he strategically and exactly adds specific carbs.

(Alec) #28

Does anybody have any knowledge around whether there are issues when switching from fat fuelling to carb fuelling and then back to fat fuelling during a long run or ride? What I mean is does the body smoothly switch between fuels without any hiccups or slowing down or loss of energy?

(GINA ) #29

Th ere is a whole school of thought around Train Low, Race High.

Mark Sisson writes about going in and out of ketosis smoothly and being efficient with both fuels in Primal Endurance.

(Tim W) #30

If you are fully fat adapted, I don’t think you’ll have an issue. Just like Gina states, Sisson talks about it in the Primal Endurance book and they have a decent podcast too, hosted by Brad Kearns, they discuss consuming key carbs to support workouts and recovery.

From my experience, I’ve “over consume” carbs (BEER!) and then “ran them off” the next day, entering ketosis within a day. We are talking 2 hour plus runs though, not something I recommend doing to often… :smile:

Once again, I’d get good and fat adapted first, then play with this (using carbs to support exercise etc.) as it’s an advanced protocol and may not be appropriate until you’ve hit your weight loss goals.

(AllenW) #31

In training for the Big Horn 100 over the past 6 months, I’ve tried everything under the sun to see what works best. Still haven’t figured it all out but I do know that no matter what you do, being fat adapted BEFORE the race will help no matter what you do race day. That being said, we still want to maximize what our bodies are capable of. I have no fantasies of winning but I would like to get through it without suffering like I have in the past 15 of these I’ve completed.

What I’ve experienced so far, is that my best training runs are done with a nice big meal the night before with lots of potassium (avacado, kale, etc). Then on the morning of the run, absolutely nothing but water as necessary for the first 12 - 14 miles. If you are starving, then by all means eat. If you can wait, do so. Once you get sufficiently hungry and it doesn’t go away after 5 min, then I eat a whole avacado.

I’ve also found it important to take 1/8 tsp of pink salt for every gallon of water I ingest.

I also have homemade pemmican that I use later in the run. Nuts seem to be difficult to digest.

I know phinney says we can only utilize x% fat and I’m not sure how fast the body can produce glucose from fat. So the amount of carb we need after we have been running a really long time is still a personal thing and I haven’t figured it out yet. I’m going to rely on my intuitive evaluation of my body and make decisions along the way. I know it is important to never eat too much of anything at one time. Especially carbs.

I’ve had good luck with avacado, sweet potato, bacon, butter, cheese, egg yolks (the white is too hard to eat late in a race), and some berries. The amounts and timings of all of these I haven’t figured out but like I said, I’ve had a worse run every time I tried to eat before running. But I am extremely insulin resistant so I produce it with just about anything I eat. My blood sugar stays below 90, usually between 75 and 85. Ketones range from 1 to 3.5. Usually only higher than 3 about 30 min after a long run.