Dr. Phinney's take on fasting


#41

I think richard supplied a very good calculator and information to help figure that out. Shown in his post above. It guides someone into approximate daily fat needs to sustain a fast. Erdoke provided names of two more fasting expert luminaries. Information points to some minimal muscle breakdown at first, and then muscle sparing kicks in as survival mechanism. So, eating plenty of fat to sustain oneself during a fast should be doable in a short fast cycle, like 3 days. And of course, the way to find out is trying it. As in n=1.


(Meeping up the Science!) #42

If you are lean you will absolutely start losing lean muscle mass after an extended period of time. I would try it, but also be very cautious.


(Crow T. Robot) #43

Not really. It’s mostly mental. Bodybuilders like Brad Pilon have been fasting for 24 hours at a time for years for the muscle gains and fat control and they are very lean. If you can do 24 hours, you can do 72. That’s actually not a long fast.

I’m not saying it’s not something that needs to be worked up to. I started with 24 hour fasts (dinner to dinner). The first few times it seemed hard, but do-able. Now I can do 7-10 days and it doesn’t seem any harder. It’s really getting started that is hardest. Still, if you are lean and not IR, what is your motivation for fasting?


#44

what sort of level of body fat did you have at the time?


(Erin Macfarland ) #45

Mostly the autophagy aspect, I typically just fast between 14 and 18 or so hours every night. But all the hype around it makes you feel like you’re a loser if you can’t do at least 3 days! I am currently trying to rebalance my hormones which have been affected by my low body fat. I have no cycle, so extended fasting is probably not in my near future…


(Dave) #46

I am about 9% body fat and I have just starting doing 36hr fasts (only done 2)… I will let you know my results in time… Yes this is a common method of getting lean amongst bodybuilders… I am sure the most ripped caveman used to do this a fair bit?


#47

I wonder if the problem arises from them focusing on such different groups of people? Their experience and research is so different so how can either make assumptions and recommendations for all? I think you are spot on re self experimentation.


#48

You see, that makes me wonder if you need more fat to protein?


#49

But are they all overweight with more useable body fat?

THis makes sense from a logical perspective.


(Erin Macfarland ) #50

9 % is fine, if kind of low, for a man. I’m at 12% which very low for a woman. Despite eating copious amounts on keto my body thinks it’s starving. So add a long fast to that and it will only make things worse for me!


(Erin Macfarland ) #51

I always eat very fatty cuts and some times add a little fat too. I’ll eat all the fat before the lean. I’m shocked sometimes at how much I can eat and still feel hungry after.


(Erin Macfarland ) #52

DJTaylor Women’s body’s are much more sensitive to variations in body fat levels. And just curious are you some kind of buff Australian farmer?? hehehe…


#53

What I am wondering is if the ratio is off. The only reason I say this is because when I overeat on protein (which I have a tendency to do) I get more hungry whereas if I eat more fat to protein less so.

I wonder also what would happen if you had 2 meals per day instead of one?


(Dave) #54

Ha ha yeah my hat is a bit crazy… No I am a graphic designer… Just sit at a computer during the day and am I a keen on my fitness


#55

Seriously? Who’s calling you a loser for not doing a 3-day fast. I couldn’t care less if you did or not…no skin off my back. Sounds like it’s not something you need, and your body is telling you that. So, why not leave the issue alone? There are many many many members on this forum with deranged metabolism, inflammation, diabetes, obesity, etc…that seek this therapy. I look through your posts and you repeat that you are lean and underweight (too low body fat) and couldn’t find other reasons (I.e. Metabolic disease) to justify the fasting. So, why are you seeking approval from us for not getting through a 3 day fast? You’ve got my approval, if you want it (but, seriously, you don’t need it…just do what’s right for you). Not every therapy on this forum is a therapy for everyone, and certainly not all are right for you. My two cents.

Please don’t feel like a loser. Clearly you are not. Be ok with you.


(Erin Macfarland ) #56

I was really just making light of it, I know people here have many different issues they struggle with, it’s just such a big part of the keto world, kind of like eating meat. If you do keto and are vegetarian people think it doesn’t fit somehow. Fasting is just such a natural extension of keto, but it’s almost like a competitive sport some how. I know my body’s needs are different than other peoples, I was just drawn in by how in fact this lady could fast so long if she is indeed very lean.


(Erin Macfarland ) #57

Well it suits you!


(Erin Macfarland ) #58

I eat at least two meals per day :wink: Yesterday I think I ate a dozen :joy:


(Meeping up the Science!) #59

My dear, it is only a small part of the keto world. People have been doing keto for decades, and people have been fasting for millenia, and only recently has it been trendy. Do not sweat it at all.

I cannot fast long and I am far from lean. All of our bodies are different. If you are already lean, likely you don’t need to worry about autophagy as much if you take care of yourself. Celebrate your body for that. :slight_smile:


#60

80 lbs overweight is not lean

Fasting is a therapy that helped many people reverse life-threatening diseases, painful inflammation and solving life-long overweight issues. People suffering from these afflictions don’t necessarily make light of it. They seek help and knowledge. This forum is one example where they come to seek information on fasting and learn about experiences from others.

Ok, so you are not the #1 extended faster in the world. Who cares. Nobody cares. So, if a 350 lbs person, who is capable of water fasting for months, and is considered the best…great for them. So what. I already forgot…what were we talking about…?