Dr Berg or Dr Berry?

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(Empress of the Unexpected) #181

This doesn’t exactly answer the question, but it is interesting.

https://perfectketo.com/exogenous-ketones-for-weight-loss/

Perhaps I should look into exogenous ketones? Nine months on keto and a tenant brought to my attention the fact that I was writing 12-2-18 on all the rent receipts today!!!


(Running from stupidity) #182

Feb 12, 2018? KEEP UP!


(Empress of the Unexpected) #183

Oh you people! Saul goes to the pharmacy to pick up my beta blockers and gives my date of birth as November third, 19__. I’m like no, its March 11, 19__! I remember when the US considered switching. Still can’t believe we didn’t.


(Empress of the Unexpected) #184

Ok, a straggler just came to the door - I acknowledged on his receipt that it was January 2, 2019. I’ve come to my senses.


(Jane) #185

LOL on the date!

I’m still not convinced and my opinion is that taking exogenous ketones is just a waste of money and you will end up peeing them down the drain. Just because you have extra ketone bodies floating around doesn’t mean your body is using them. And it also seems to me that it would slow down fat loss since your body doesn’t need to access fat stores if you are drinking extra ketones.

I could see a benefit for someone with very low body fat so they don’t have any extra to burn and supplementing with ketones could provide more energy.


#186

That’s the point for Dom D’Agostino I believe.


(Empress of the Unexpected) #187

I’m hoping someone more knowledgeable than me comes along. I would never buy such a product, but I have accustomed my body to coconut oil.


(Empress of the Unexpected) #188

Yes, the article says it helps with keto flu.


(Jane) #189

Makes sense.


#190

Plus he’s working with usually very fit & healthy people - Navy Seals & NASA & the like. The idea is that they’ll have an alternative fuel source in extreme environments where being totally reliant on glucose metabolism can get you into trouble.


(Jane) #191

I saw that but not sure I agree. People get the keto flu with deep purple pee stix because their body is wasting them instead of using them and you aren’t giving it carbs. Or I am misunderstanding what causes keto flu.


(Running from stupidity) #192

:metal::metal::metal::metal::metal:


(Empress of the Unexpected) #193

I actually never went through “carb withdrawal.” I had a day of some weakness, but I had bronchitis when I started keto. Wish I could go back in time and measure. I started keto April 19, 2018, but did not join the forums until May. Just did the Banting diet. Never, ever, ever, got dark purple. Frustrating, only trace. Now with blood meter 1.4 every afternoon.


(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #194

It’s not that the body necessarily prefers glucose, but that too much glucose in the bloodstream is deadly dangerous, so the pancreas secretes insulin to force the glucose out of the bloodstream and into the muscle cells to be burnt and into the fat cells to be stored as fat.

If the muscle is forced to take more glucose than it can use right away, it stores it as glycogen, but glycogen cannot leave the muscle, so if more and more glucose keeps coming in, eventually the muscle becomes insulin-resistant. Likewise, a fat cell that contains too many triglycerides also becomes insulin-resistant, because the fatty acids cannot leave the fat cell until the insulin level drops below a certain level.

This is why a well-formulated ketogenic diet can be so helpful: the low insulin level it promotes allows the muscles to burn some of their stored glycogen instead of stuffing them with yet more glucose, and it allows the fat cells to release fatty acids into the bloodstream for the liver to turn into ketone bodies and for the muscles to burn in place of glucose.


(Jane) #195

I don’t know if I got carb withdrawals or not, either! I didn’t know what keto was when I started so wasn’t expecting it or looking for it.


(Jane) #196

So what happens if you consume 300 g carbs and take exogenous ketones?


(Empress of the Unexpected) #197

I had no clue. Cut out 8 glasses of milk a day, and bread and pasta. I am so thankful for the forums.


(Empress of the Unexpected) #198

I personally can’t tell you that Janie. In another thread I added up all my carb cheats on an average day - they only came to 150. I’m not a big eater. I was kind of shocked it wasn’t higher. Still waiting for the experts to stop by.


(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #199

Well, unless you have an extraordinarily high carb tolerance, you are going to be using glucose instead of ketones in your muscles, as well as storing fat in your adipose tissue. Your brain could probably use some of the exogenous β-hydroxybutyrate, but the high insulin level resulting from that much carbohydrate might prevent that. It will certainly prevent your liver from making endogenous ketone bodies from fatty acids. My guess is that most of the exogenous acetone and acetoacetate will get excreted in the breath and urine, respectively.


(Empress of the Unexpected) #200

so this is suspect?