Does this Count as an Extended Fast


(Kim Casem) #1

First post here.

Been experimenting with IF for about 6 months, and some random 24-36 hour fasts, and one 72 hour fast.
(No set schedule; I do better with a flexible approach). Informed by Fung’s website and book, and podcasts.

I had planned on a 72 day fast this time, but felt very good so have extended it. I’m into the 7th day or so.

HOWEVER:
Now that I’m reading posts, I’m realizing I may not be truly fasting at all.

Have put HWC in my coffee every single day, and have eaten olives in olive oil many of these days. I also had pickle juice (made sure not to get pickles w/ sugar tho) several days.

Questions:
Am I getting any autophagy benefits from this (maybe not a) fast? Afraid I’ve ruined it with the HWC after reading on here.
I am def losing weight, and I feel great, so I know I’m at least benefiting that way.
But I hope I’m not screwing up my metabolism or something.

Thank you very much for reading this.


(Kim Casem) #2

Whoops, I meant pickles WITHOUT sugar.
Kim


#3

I wouldn’t worry too much about small amounts of fat during a fast. You may actually need to supplement some fat after the first few days, depending on how many pounds of bodyfat you have available. http://blog.2keto.com/why-fasting-is-easier-for-some-people/

How many olives are you eating? It looks like they have 11g of fat, 3g net carbs and less than 1 g of protein per 100g. HWC also has a tiny amount of protein. It is the protein that affects autophagy the most, so eating any may be less than ideal, but no one has come up with a precise consumption-result measurement as far as I know.


(Kim Casem) #4

Thank you very much for this response @carolT !!!
Thanks also for linking to that good article - I took an initial try at the numbers. I will do more reading about fasting combined with keto.

I’ve been eating about 8-10 olives, and eat a few tablespoons of the oil they were sitting in, too.
I am fasting for autophagy and wt loss, so I suppose I need to get used to coffee w/ no HWC

Thank you again - very helpful!!


#5

I found that it helped me - when I first started fasting - to be pretty generous with fats in my coffee/tea. I figured that once fasting itself was no big deal, I’d be able to transition to water-only (plus electrolytes) without much fuss, which is pretty much what happened.
[I realize that you’ve already been fasting for a bit so not sure if this is relevant to you…]


(jilliangordona) #6

To start, I did this as well. For IF I often would have coffee with a splash of heavy cream, and would still feel the benefits of fasting.

Your body needs what it needs, the link above is very helpful for figuring out your needs based on your body fat.


(Jennifer) #7

I’m fasting for the HGH and autophagy benefits as well. I stick to water/tea/salt only but if I start to feel off, I will up the salt and eat a few olives (3-4) or eat a spoonful of coconut oil. That usually does the trick.


(Kim Casem) #8

@Madeleine This is very relevant, thank you for responding! I have NOT yet transitioned to water-only. I’m not sure why but I feel anxious to try -it’s irrational. How long do you do a water-only fast?


(Kim Casem) #9

@jilliangordona thanks for this response! I checked out the link, and will be doing more reading. So far, that’s kinda how I’ve done the olives/olive oil/pickle juice, following my body’s lead


(Kim Casem) #10

@birddog27 thanks for this response! May I ask how long you do water/tea/salt? I need to read up on the timeframe when autophagy kicks in and HGH increases… curious about ‘minimal effective dose’ of that, too.


#11

It’s my understanding that HGH competes for the same receptors as hunger hormones in the brain, so while you are fasting the HGH will blunt the hunger. Typically, I feel considerably less hungry on about day 3, and that’s coming from already being in ketosis. There’s probably low-level autophagy going on during an overnight fast too, once all food has been digested, absorbed and cleared from the bloodstream. [May also be related to the hunger hormone ghrelin. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4049314/]


(Jennifer) #12

I started Keto 2/3/17 and started fasting a week later. I have gone as long as 7 days, but I usually do 2-4 days per week. 3 to 4 days is my norm. Honestly, it is easier for me to not eat than to try and count every bite I take. I like not having to keep track of every detail. So I am either eating (keto) or not. Pretty simple. I’m down a little over 50lbs (40 or so to go) since I started. Now, I didn’t have any health issues except hyperinsulinemia and pre-diabetes (I was probably getting close to needing meds in January) . Blood tests have always been normal for everything except insulin. Never even had gestational diabetes for my two pregnancies.

Dr. Fung talks about autophagy and HGH - I don’t have the details handy. I just remember they both spike between 24-36 hours and then stay high for a bit.


#13

I did a 5-day one last week and plan to do a 3-5 day one every month or so.


(John Somsky aka KetoGrinder) #14

Your experience definitely counts as an extended fast. You have to look at the reasons you are fasting to figure out what would be most advantageous.

For example I’ve heard that if you want to help prevent cancer, you should do a 7 day fast drinking only distilled water.

I believe I heard from Dr. Fung or Megan Ramos (I don’t remember where or when so I could be in error) that if you include fat in your fasts it will reduce the amount of human growth hormone you produce. There may have been something similar about autophagy.

However I believe you will still see results given that you are still at a small calorie count. (I seem to remember a suggestion of staying below 200 calories a day.) So you get more benefit if you don’t take any fat, but you will still get some benefit regardless.

In the end you need to do what you can tolerate. You could try a water/salt fast and see if that is for you. Otherwise continue doing what works for you. Progress not perfection. There is no Keto/Fasting rule book.


(Traci ) #15

I know this is an old post but Valter Longo has fast mimicking diet that is high in fat (I know it includes olives) moderate carb and low protein that he claims gets all the benefits of fasting without actually fasting. He doesn’t include dairy and I’m not sure why and it may just be because dairy might harder to incorporate into the prepacked fast mimicking Prolon diet he sells.