Coffee enhancement - heavy whipping cream vs half and half

#61

That’s the difference for me. The half & half that I buy is whole milk and cream, not skim milk. And it literally shows 1/2 the carbs for 2T than the straight HWC has in 1T. I don’t know how it’s possible given they use whole milk for half of it, but I’m glad to see that at worst case it’s just equal to the carbs in HWC. I’d also be fine if it were a tiny bit over but it’s not. It’s actually under. Unless they are lying outright?

So if I understand correctly, those who warn about half & half must only have had experience with poorly made versions that use sugar ladened skim milk and such, and so always saw the carbs were more than HWC and were mostly concerned with keeping their carbs as low as possible so switched to HWC. I love HWC more anyway, but … I need to dial back the sheer amount of added fat, so for me the trade off is worth it because the half & half I buy is actually lower carb, and at worst the same. But not more. So unless I need the added richness and creaminess, for many things half and half will have much better macros for my dishes, especially lower fat and calories.

But I hope I understand correctly how concerns came to be in the first place. I’m glad it’s not something like “well lactose interferes with and stops ketosis” :rofl: That would keep me away.

(Bob M) #62

I drink raw milk basically every day. 6-8 ounces. And put cream in my coffee (though not that much). Still produce plenty of ketones.

(Robin) #63

HWC for me. For ever. :smiley:

#64

I do love it too!! It’s my favorite and first choice.

But I do have a present temporary problem of needing to dial back my fat just a bit. It’s way too high compared to my protein, and it eats up all my calories by noon!! (I’m not straight carni so at present calories matter for me.) I noticed I could cut back a good amount of fat by using half and half. Not as delicious but way better than milk. Lol

(KM) #65

I agree! I try hard to ignore calories but I can’t quite go there … I believe the body processes different nutrients in wholly different ways, but HH and HWC are almost an apples to apples comparison and one is providing a ton more fuel.

Do we only process a certain amount of fat and excrete the rest? If so, it doesn’t matter. If not …

Right now I’m more social and that means more food and/or not necessarily entirely on my time table; I feel like have to dial it back somewhere.

(Brian) #66

It’s an old thread. And I do things a little differently than I used to. I buy raw milk now and skim the cream off the top. That’s what I use for my coffee. The milk that’s left either gets used for making Greek yogurt or little bits of it for various recipes that just call for a little, or… the barn cats will get some on their feed, which they like. (We have about a dozen barn cats, outside cats only.)

So I’m not buying anything other than the raw cow’s milk. If I want half n half now, I gotta mix it myself. And FWIW, I generally do use it raw. Oddly enough, it seems to spoil faster when it gets pasteurized.

Since I originally posted, I am much more meat-based but not quite carnivore. Weight hasn’t changed much in the past couple of years. Still might like to drop a little but not much but I also know that summer time I am much more physically active and it tends to come off during that season. It’s come down a little already this spring.

I find the weight easiest to put on when I cheat and eat / drink way more carbs and sugar than I know I should. It’ll happen in social situations mostly. Sometimes I can be strong, other times I give in. The scale tells me what I’ve been doing. My wife is much less on-board with the idea of either strict keto or carnivore. It is what it is. Averaged out, we both eat way cleaner than we used to. Lots of room for improvement, though, to be honest about it.

To quantify the cream, we go through a little over a pint a week per person. So looking at calories, that’s 700 (typical) to 1000 (possible, not as typical) or so a week, not insignificant, but not the end of the world, either. Would it be a place to cut back? Sure. Do I want to? Not right now. Could I cut back the coffee consumption to need / want less cream? Could happen. It’s just not something I’m up nights worried about right now.

And that’s about it for where I am now. To each their own. Live and let live. Etc. :slight_smile: Figured since I started the thread and since it’s getting some play lately, I’d chime in.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #67

That’s what Dr. Anthony Chaffee claims.

(Bob M) #68

That’s what I buy, too, though I do buy regular cream.

(KM) #69

I knew someone has that theory going on, thanks. Is that only for a “pure carnivore” or is it basically all people, regardless of their diet?

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #70

Well, I suspect that people on a high-insulin are going to be storing the fat they eat, since elevated insulin causes the body to store energy. When I joined these forums, it was considered common knowledge that eating sugar and fat together cause great fat gain.

The key to these better ways of eating, whether keto or carnivore, is to listen to our body. For example, Dr. Phinney’s advice is to eat to satiety, which comes from the Latin word for “enough.” So we are supposed to eat enough to satisfy our hunger, not to stuff as much food as possible down our throats, the way we needed to when high insulin was making us insatiably hungry.

(Bob M) #71

I’m not even sure it has to be sugar. When I was testing the theory that saturated fat causes feedback that you’re full, I used croissants and a wheat+butter-based dessert. I added more butter to both. I ate a lot, and wanted more.

I also tested home-made french fries fried in beef tallow I made myself from suet (high in saturated fat). Both my wife and I ate ALL of the fries and want more. And that’s on top of having these with burgers (no bun, on lettuce).

Those results caused me to give up on the idea that saturated fat causes feedback of being full. It might work in some people, or maybe on a cellular level, but it doesn’t work for me or on a whole-body level.

#72

I usually buy both and milk although I rarely have milk, that is for the family. When I went keto in 2017 I originally only used HWC unless the store or restaurant was out, by the way restaurant tip, when they tell you that HWC is not something they serve I suggest they go ask the chef because he or she must have it for cooking.

When my husband stopped doing keto (but kept drinking the HWC!) I started buying both as he did not need the extra fat while eating SAD. I mostly use the HWC for recipes or whipped cream . I prefer the taste of HnH because it is sweeter to me although I will use whatever is easier to get to in the fridge or is open. @Just_Juju appreciate the insight on the carb content. I always assumed different brands were similar for HnH. Will start checking. In my area there are definitely fewer carbs in HWC, it does not taste as sweet. I looked at some brands I buy regularly and the HWC is listed as 0 carbs per Tbs and the HnH is listed as 1 per 2 Tbs. Not sure what to make of that other than it really does not matter. Drinking coffee with either does not seem to change my BG if I have not otherwise been eating carbs

@Bellyman nice to see the response. I am never sure what to do if I see an old thread unless I know the person is still active. I recently had the same question as from 2017 so I referenced the thread and started a new one! Sounds like you have cut down a lot. I think I am still closer to the pint a day. Husband is home today and we bought a new container this morning and it feels like we have both made quite a dent in it

I would love to try raw milk but I don’t live anywhere near a farm so not an option. Raw milk can be sold in my state but there are constraints so that it is not simply available at my local 7-11 or Trader Joe’s

#73

I can relate (except it’s not noon for me). And calories totally matter on carnivore too. My macros should be modest for financial reasons too but I hate to overeat anyway.

For me, it’s using little dairy (and added fat but I do that since years) what solves the problem. And eating as lean meat as I comfortably can. Eggs play a little role.
Not having many meals without a good reason is important for me too. My eating abilities replenish after some hours even if I don’t need or want more food. So I CAN eat a lot if I start eating. (There are so many poor souls out there who could use such an ability but I have this, not them.)

That’s a bit sad to my hedonist self. I never sacrifice the deliciousness of my coffees - but I am lucky to find it great when it has very little cream :slight_smile: My fav coffee is tasty even black! Still better with a little cream :stuck_out_tongue: But I love it with milk too. Sometimes prefer it. Right now I prefer cream, how lucky I run out of milk and opened a bag of cream with a near expiration date… I enjoy myself a bit before I try to almost quit coffee again.

It does matter to me. I need to lose fat. So maintenance isn’t good enough for me. And anyway, wasting precious resources? Sounds bad to me, I personally don’t want that.

Nice! Sadly, I can’t buy raw milk anymore. There was a dairy truck business but it ceased to function that way :frowning:

If the calories are high, of course. As people lose fat just fine eating sugar and fat together too… Of course it’s way more complex than calories, people are different, hormones play a role… But that’s it, it’s complex, we can’t say HCHF always causes fat gain (obviously not, there are people with this diet all their life and they don’t get fatter and fatter :slight_smile: ) or that we can’t gain fat on carnivore. I do believe the latter is pretty hard and probably some serious fat force-feeding is required for most people for that to happen… And losing fat on HCHF is probably extra hard for most of us… But it’s still not white and black with very clearly drawn lines.

Do you have any idea why it seems (I can’t check it often…) that carbs don’t make me hungry so much anymore? They seem to satiate me somewhat…? Maybe it’s just my body having a problem with them and I feel good but feel full…? I don’t know but it’s interesting. I used to seriously overeat when I ate higher carb (I always was/am satiated on every diet, it’s basic for me as a hedonist who hates being hungry. carbs made it easy to get very satiated eventually but it required A TON of fat and of course, high protein. I can’t get satiated without much protein) but I can avoid it now. Something has changed… :thinking:
Not very important, I don’t plan to go back to eating higher-carbs, it just happens on some days and I notice things.

I like to buy lactose free whipping cream (we don’t have HWC here), it’s sweet, works way better for my desserts! I don’t need that extra sweetness in my coffees but it doesn’t hurt.

(Brian) #74

Re: “I don’t need that extra sweetness in my coffees”…

When I went keto, I started putting SweetLeaf Sweet Drops in my coffee. Still do. What I have been finding, though, is that sometimes I like the coffee about as well with less sweetener and sometimes I feel like I need more. I haven’t quite figured it out yet. I am suspecting it is something I’m doing or not doing when making the coffee but not even sure of that.

I tend to like coffee that has a “Postum” flavor to it, more nutty, less fruity. When I hit it right with that, I feel like I need a lot less sweetener. Still messin’ with it.

I sometimes find something I like and then can’t find it again, or when I do, it’s not what I remembered. That happened to me a few years back with some kind of Brazilian coffee. Found it at a “bents bumps & bargains” kind of store, probably approaching being outdated. A couple of years later, I did find it at a grocery store, same brand, but it wasn’t the same. Tried a new package of Kona this morning. Pretty good. Not quite as good as I had remembered from some time back. So I’m not really sure, maybe the coffee beans just are not always the same, even in the same brands. (I do buy beans and grind them rather than already ground coffee.)

(Bob M) #75

If sweetener doesn’t cause cravings or overeating, it’s probably okay. There may be some insulin spike, but I’m not sure about that (can’t wait for pin-prick insulin meters).

#76

What you really have to check is the ingredients list. The two HWC and HnH I presently have show that the HnH is using solely whole milk and cream and nothing else. Maybe that’s why it’s lower carb? But my HWC brand is Walmart’s Great Value brand and I was shocked to see that even though the cream was listed first then the milk, it also contained carrageenan, mono- and diglycerides, and polysorbate 80. Why?? What’s wrong with just giving us the cream and milk?? :rofl: Maybe that’s why it has 1g carb in 1T?

And to @Bellyman, The reason I resurrected this old thread is I’ve read in quite a few different places that the creators of this website prefer we resurrect an old thread of same topic rather than create a brand new one so that all the discussion is in one place. I saw two threads in my search for my questions and your OP was written most closely to what I would have said in a new one. So after reading this one I chose to resurrect it to talk about confusions I still had. LOL No ill intent whatsoever just respecting what I read elsewhere about how to do things around here.

#77

I recently was turned on to a company called Black Rifle Coffee. I have an order coming so I’ll report back how it tastes. I really like what I read about the company (veteran founded) and I’m excited to try it!

(KM) #78

Did you gain weight from all that fat+carb, or did you just still want more food?

(KM) #79

My only covid symptom was suddenly being unable to smell or taste my coffee. A year later that still happens occasionally. One day it’s black gold and the next it’s hot water. The cream definitely adds appeal; for some reason I can always taste / sense that just fine.

#80

Do you taste it like cream+hot water then? That seems less appealing to me than a creamy coffee (or cream or water alone) but I have my specific tastes, can’t drink lukewarm water, for example, just cold or hot… I can drink coffee at all temperatures though I prefer it warm.
Cream surely has power, my creamy Irish Cream tea is close enough to my creamy coffee to aid me when I want to avoid coffee (part of it that I drink my coffee weak).