Can I have a few more carbs if I exercise?

(Kristin) #1

Hi there! I’m on week 2! Started producing ketones after 2 days. I have been between 20-23 net carbs a day but finding it difficult to cut any more carbs than I have. If I exercise, does it allow me to add a few carbs to that net 20??

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #2

If you are already in ketosis at your current level of carb intake, then you are fine. You don’t need to exercise to “offset” your carbs. If you like exercise, then do it for its own sake—though you might find it stressful on the body for the next few weeks, until you are fully fat-adapted. For right now, you might want to keep your exercise light.

BTW, the reason we recommend a limit of 20g/day of carbohydrate is that it is a level at which pretty much everyone can be sure of getting into ketosis. Some people can get into ketosis at a higher level, and if you have a way of measuring your ketones, you can experiment to find your personal limit. But we do tend to advise beginners to stick to the lowest level they can manage, so that they can be sure to start producing ketones and become fat-adapted; it’s always easy to increase your carb intake after you reach full fat-adaptation.

(Michele) #3

Everyone is different - I can be in ketosis eating 40g net carbs but I stick to 20-25g now I’m fat adapted. You’re not going to do any harm eating a few extra carbs- just be wise with what you choose. Spinach, kale, Brussel sprouts etc.

(Kristin) #4

Thanks so much PaulL! I am just walking and spin biking (not hard core though) and I felt pretty good the last 2 weeks! Excited to start the journey, lol I think I’m just worried about the times I go over the 20 carbs!

(Kristin) #5

Thank you MicheleDee, that helps me put things in perspective a bit! I am definitely eating good carbs, veggies and what not, they just add up quickly!

(Chris Robertson) #6

There are a lot of people that can eat more carbs if they exercise. How many depends a bit on the person and how much exercise you are doing. I know a couple powerlifters on keto that eat 200g of carbs a day and stay in ketosis. Basically carbs are instant energy and if you use them all during your exercise then they won’t effect your ketosis. Keep in mind that this only applies to carbs that are low on the glycemic index. You still need to keep your insulin levels low so carb loading with sweet potatoes could be ok but carb loading with a snickers bar would kick you out of ketosis.

(Ken) #7

There’s another view on that. On TKD, simple carbs such as pure dextrose is eaten around workouts. It provides energy during training, and assists recovery afterwards. The carbs are quickly utilized, the insulin spike is gone in a couple of hours so the body can resume lipolysis. Complex carbs stay in the system much longer, delaying resumption of lipolysis. They’re more used when glycogen recompensation is desired.

A candy bar is a better post workout choice than a sweet potato. Lipolysis will be suspended for a shorter time.

(Robert C) #8

I think it depends on the type of exercise.

If you plan to run on a treadmill for an hour and watch the calorie counter run up to 300 and then give yourself a 75 gram carb allowance - I think that is a mistake. Those are horribly inaccurate even if you input weight, sex, age etc. Also, your body gets very efficient at things like running daily so your actual burn is much lower after just a week or two. Upping distance or speed is a trap you want to avoid because when you stop, you gain weight because you haven’t added muscle mass - you’ve just made yourself more efficient with the calories you intake.

On the other hand, (my opinion), adding some extra sweet potato because you are hitting the gym for some toning strength training while trying to incrementally increase the weight lifted and/or number of lifts - that sounds like a better way to go. When you take a break from that sort of training you have extra (hungry) toned muscle sitting around using calories for you.

(Ken) #9

Both resistance training and running type exercises deplete and therefore create glycogen deficits. Since the whole point of having a few carbs is within that context, the simpler the better. Throw in the need for repair after resistance training and it becomes more important.

Sweet potatoes and brown rice are really throwbacks to the old complex Carb based cut concept. It was really terrible, and very inefficient as you were constantly in a state of lipogenic hormonal resistance withdrawal. It’s the way I cut back in the 1980’s. The old “Supercuts” recipe book is a good example. Now I consider it absurd.

(Robert C) #10

I only mentioned sweet potato as it is a whole natural food - in contrast to a Quest bar or something. Also, suggesting eating a ton of broccoli or spinach for some extra carbs around a strength training workout doesn’t seem it would lead to compliance.

(Ken) #11

The typical protocol for carbs around workouts is 20 g before and 40 g afterwards. Using as simple carbs such as dextrose. The easiest is three rolls of Smarties before and six rolls after. I usually use a stick blender and blend them into water. Dextrose goes right into your system, no digestion required. Having a couple of pieces of fruit after training is common also.

(Chris Robertson) #12

Thomas Delouer recommends carb loading with fructose because it doesn’t effect insulin as much as glucose. Dr Fung says fructose is generally the worst form of sugar you can eat because it creates a bottleneck in the liver and causes insulin resistance, however, Delouer says if you are burning all of the fructose during a workout then there is no bottleneck. I don’t know if Delouer is correct or not but his youtube content is generally very good and I do trust him so if I were to carb load I’d do it with something like blueberries, raspberries, or strawberries.

(Ken) #13

Fructose requires a digestive process where dextrose/glucose does not. Fructose requires fructokinase to break it down. Within the context of a few pieces of fruit around a workout, it’s fairly minor. Too many self styled gurus get mired in minutiae, often over blowing things in an attempt to make their concepts unique, and rationalize a reason for people to buy their work.

(Kerin ) #14

Here is a confession…I over ate carbs on Fri. I had a few too many peppitas(pumpkin seed) and bought the wrong kind of porkrinds, (they were made with corn added). Now guess what? Sat I felt awful, comparison to a hangover. I had to work and still lagging a skill in the at work foods dept.
Today I am back on track. Plus a pound heavier.
Hope this changes as I further myself towards my goal.

(Robert C) #15

I would be careful with information coming from Thomas Delouer.

People that know steroid/drug use when they see it say they see it so that can make his personal take on nutritional information become very clouded. He can do carbs etc. (maybe a whole birthday cake) - without incident because he can go to the gym for 3 hours and actually completely work it off without recovery issues. A regular human has trouble running 3 miles to burn off a cupcake (usually making them hungry enough for a second).

He is good when he sticks to scripted topics (autophagy, HIIT, MCT etc.) - clear and usually concise.

(Kristin) #16

Thank you for the confession Kerin! I can relate and have often felt that hangover feeling after eating a bunch of carbs. I have felt better in the last 2 weeks than I ever did having a lot of carbs in my diet. I was worried about having more than 20 carbs and not being able to stay in ketosis, but I have found that 25-30 is keeping me still in deeper ketosis. I still want to strive to keep as close to 20 as possible most days, it’s nice to know though that a few bites of potatoes won’t throw me out.

(Raj Seth) #17

At the risk of sounding naive - Why would you want to?
What will the extra carbs do for you? What is this carby kryptonite? Maybe members here can provide you a delicious alternative to it!

(Chris Robertson) #18

Is it a known fact that Delouer uses steroids? Or is it an assumption based on his build? I know a lot of fitness nuts that don’t use performance enhancing drugs that are far more stacked than Delouer. That said, I do take what he says with a grain of salt. He does base his scripted material on scientific research and he often sites his sources which is why I like his videos but I certainly don’t believe everything he says.

When it comes to carb loading he never suggested eating junk food. He suggested “keto friendly” berries. Even Dr Fung says to eat berries. Obviously how many you eat would depend on your workouts. If you are not going to work off all the fructose during your workout then you shouldn’t be carb loading with them but that goes for any carb loading. It’s a tool that should only be used by some people.

(Robert C) #19

Honestly do not know what he might or might not be using.

He is 30 years old in 2018.
4 years ago he looked like the picture below but was 280 pounds (very fat) a few years before that (while focusing too much on his business in his early 20’s according to him).

He claims IF, healthy diet and exercise did the trick (I don’t see many of these on this site - with lots of IF going on).

I guess he could be an outlier - but that would be a true genetic freak outlier that only finally manifested in mid-twenties with a sudden muscle-tissue-only growth spurt.

He seems to be a positive person and a motivated straight shooter in his dialog but, (if he used PEDs) his unwillingness to be transparent in that area does a disservice to all. Imagine your SO saying “He did it, you do it, I want THAT in a couple of years!” or just the general feelings about yourself looking in the mirror - following his advice - and tending more toward dad-bod than Mr. Universe.

ThomasD

(Tony Phillips) #20

I think if you feel great with your level of exercise and the 20-23 carbs then you should stick with it. However, if you feel depleted and that your exercise is more difficult or less enjoyable, adding more carbs may help for some quicker energy. There is no rule that says you “must” have less than 20 carbs. It’s really more important to find the right level for you that make your successful while remaining in Ketosis.