Anybody being picky about the Vaccine you take?

(Ethan) #102

Changes cells? Huh? mRNA is a delivery mechanism. It is used to deliver gene therapies, but that isn’t what this is doing. There is no cell dns change.

(GINA ) #103

No, they have not made an assessment of the risks and taken appropriate measures. I know them. You don’t.

#104

oh yea, being 93 mom was ‘thru it all’ and the war and more and tough as nails don’t describe her plus wild horses can’t get her to a doctor…she never goes LOL I hope I got her genes HA

I am super happy your mom pulled her statin…did you have a hand in that? Or did she do some research?

oh yes a pandemic etc is reasons for new laws, new rights that take away more from us, even tho they are for our own good ya know HAHA

it really will be interesting to see where this all lands.

#105

from the internet: The vaccine transfects molecules of synthetic RNA into immunity cells. Once inside the immune cells, the vaccine’s RNA functions as mRNA, causing the cells to build the foreign protein that would normally be produced by a pathogen (such as a virus) or by a cancer cell.

Yea not saying a dna change.
saying cell manipulated, forced altering and etc.
all geared at what long term effects might go down ya know. Now we hope that is a good thing LOL

it is giving instructions for cells to react and change and we can only hope the body does ONLY what it is told by this vaccine, but one knows thru life, you can’t control life cause life finds a way…it adapts, changes, does its own thing…so with my thoughts like that, I am drawing again toward the long term effects and what might go down.

time will tell I guess :slight_smile:

(Ethan) #106

It’s similar to how a virus makes your cells produce the virus—just a different cell doing it mostly

#107

I started it, I made her aware of all the downsides and that’s they’re pretty much no upsides and pointed out she was experiencing many of the downs, Then I showed her what podcasts where and had her add Ivor Cummins and she started binging it. She asked her doctor how she knew she was at risk without an NMR or a CAC, Doctor had nothing to say LOL! Little by little!

#108

@Ifod14, oh I like that, so good you were helping on that. Truly a great way to go about it and yea the downsides to those darn statins ain’t pretty for many! little by little, so agree :slight_smile:

@EZB, Mrna–This type of vaccine injects instructions, via a piece of genetic code, that tell your body how to make a certain protein essential to blocking the virus. “The mRNA vaccines instruct our cells to recognize COVID-19 and produce a harmless “spike” protein—blah blah

the old way, Vector vaccines are made from a modified version of a live virus, says Dr. Lee. Those harmless viruses—in this case, an adenovirus, which is a version of the common cold—are sent into your body containing an instruction manual that tells your cells to make a spike protein; a harmless piece of the SARS-CoV-2 virus (that’s the one that causes Covid-19)

To me personally there is a big diff in how they handle the job between the 2 but again, time tells on the mRNA.

(bulkbiker) #109

Can you please provide me with a link that shows the long term safety and efficacy of this mechanism please?
Where it has been tested in humans and has been shown to not cause harm.

(Ethan) #110

I didn’t claim that it was proven safe longterm. Please don’t do a straw man. I only stated that there is no DNA change

#111

The CDC states, on their Understanding and Explaining mRNA COVID-19 Vaccines page that:

  • mRNA from the vaccine never enters the nucleus of the cell and does not affect or interact with a person’s DNA.

But in their referenced publications, I’m not seeing where they’re backing that up. I could be missing it.

However, Moderna’s Tal Zaks, in his 2017 TED Talk, Rewriting the Genetic Code: A Cancer Cure In the Making, discussing mRNA vaccines, refers to it as “hacking the software of life”.

Zaks states:

“In every cell there’s this thing called messenger RNA or mRNA for short, that transmits the critical information from the DNA in our genes to the protein, which is really the stuff we’re all made out of. This is the critical information that determines what the cell will actually do. And so we think about it as an operating system. And it’s not just in every cell in our body, it’s actually in every cell in every organism alive. It’s the same thing. And so, if you could actually change that, which we call the software of life, if you could introduce a line of code, or change a line of code, it turns out, that has profound implications for everything, from the flu to cancer.”

Now I could be totally misunderstanding what he’s saying here, but it sounds to me like that’s exactly what mRNA vaccines are supposed to do. Especially when he starts talking about personalized vaccines for cancer patients.

What am I missing here, that explains the vaccines are not transforming our DNA?

(Ethan) #112

mRNA is used for gene therapy. They have specific applications where that can and does happen by design. It can also be used as a way to create immunity as a vaccine. Both use mRNA, but the target of what you are doing is different. In this application, there is no gene therapy.

#113

I don’t think it’s that simple.

(Todd Allen) #114

The vaccines have been tested and found efficacious for their ability to prevent severe covid and death for a few months post-vaccination. They have not been tested for their ability to reduce mild infections or infectiousness. There is not yet evidence of protection for anyone other than the person receiving the vaccine. Which is why they still recommend the vaccinated wear masks and social distance.

#115

You are missing tRNA. Transcription writes the code that creates the RNA. That is what interacts with DNA. tRNA then finds a ribosome where translation occurs. At that point, the RNA is made. So, this vaccine skips the first few steps. Good, bad, or indifferent.

*also, RNA contains uracil and not thymine. Kind of hard to change DNA if the building blocks are different.

#116

Sorry, I’m not missing anything, because I don’t understand any of it. :wink:

The whole hypothesis just doesn’t seem as cut-and-dried as some are making it out to be.

It is well known that RNA can be “reverse transcribed” into DNA. Residing in our cells are enzymes called “reverse transcriptases”. These enzymes convert RNA into DNA. Multiple sources for this class of enzymes exist within our cells. These reverse transcriptases are normally made by other viruses termed “retroviruses”. HIV is a retrovirus and so is Hepatitis B, but there are many other retroviruses that fall in this category. In addition to these external viruses, there are viruses that are hard-wired into our genomic DNA called endogenous retroviruses (ERVs). These ERVs harbor instructions to produce reverse transcriptase. In addition to ERVs, there are mobile genetic elements residing in our DNA called LTR-retrotransposons that also encode for reverse transcriptase enzymes. To top it all off, reverse transcriptase is naturally used by our cells to extend the telomeres at the end of chromosomes.

These endogenous reverse transcriptase enzymes can essentially take single-stranded RNA and convert it into double-stranded DNA. This DNA can then be integrated into the DNA in the nucleus through an enzyme termed DNA integrase.

With so many sources of reverse transcriptase, it is quite probable that the RNA introduced into our cells via the vaccine could be reverse transcribed into a segment of double-stranded DNA, and then integrated into our core genetic material in the nucleus of the cell. A variety of specific conditions need to be present for this to occur, but it is possible if the right convergence occurs. Biology is messy and not always perfectly predictable, even when the “rules” are known a priori .

Will an RNA Vaccine Permanently Alter My DNA? – Science with Dr. Doug

… we’ve been told in no uncertain terms that it would be impossible for the mRNA in a vaccine to become integrated into our DNA, simply because “RNA doesn’t work that way.” Well, this current research which was released not too long after my original article demonstrates that yes, indeed, “RNA does work that way”. In my original article, I spelled out this exact molecular pathway.

Specifically, a new study by MIT and Harvard scientists demonstrates that segments of the RNA from the coronavirus itself are most likely becoming a permanent fixture in human DNA. (study linked below). This was once thought near impossible, for the same reasons which are presented to assure us that an RNA vaccine could accomplish no such feat. Against the tides of current biological dogma, these researchers found that the genetic segments of this RNA virus are more than likely making their way into our genome. They also found that the exact pathway that I laid out in in my original article is more than likely the pathway being used (retrotransposon, and in particular a LINE-1 element) for this retro-integration to occur.

And, unlike my previous blog where I hypothesize that such an occurrence would be extremely rare (mainly because I was attempting to temper expectations more conservatively due to the lack of empirical evidence), it appears that this integration of viral RNA segments into our DNA is not as rare as I initially hypothesized. It’s difficult for me to put a number on the probability due to data limitations present in the paper, but based on the frequency they were able to measure this phenomenon in both petri dishes and COVID patients, the probability is much greater than I initially anticipated. Due to this current research, I now place this risk as a more probable event than my original estimation.

Breaking Study Sheds More Light on Whether an RNA Vaccine Can Permanently Alter DNA – Science with Dr. Doug

#117

I didn’t mean to offend. I just used your wording because you asked the question “what am I missing?”. Now my biology degree is about 20 years old so I do have a lot to catch up on but, doesn’t reverse transcription only happen during mitosis and not during interphase of the cells life? I realize a lot can change in 20 years so I am open to new ideas.

#118

You didn’t offend me. I was just trying to humorously explain that I don’t know how mRNA vaccines work, and I get the feeling this issue is a lot more complicated than it seems.

I don’t have a biology degree, so I appreciate your input. But I’ve posted a couple of things, with my limited understanding, which suggest that others with greater minds than mine are still debating this issue.

#119

This may help. It may not but I’ll post it for balance.

#120

It is so hard to tell if I offend. I try to tread extra carefully because i often feel like everything I type seems harsh even when I am happily typing along. I do find it strange that now that there is an mRNA vaccine, more information is coming out that says what we once knew, is no longer true. I am just suspicious that way though. My opinion, I am just super excited about this new tech. It is definitely clouding my judgment so I try to be cautious. Unfortunately, it is something I never even really considered and that makes it even more fascinating. I actually leaned more towards environmental biology in school so I am far from any sort of expert.

#121

I know that feeling! :tired_face: