Another Carnivore Thread

#762

I still need the same amount of salt or the leg cramps begin. I’ll try lowering my salt again down the road.

(Edith) #763

I was keeping up my salt at first, but I started not feeling well after my usual 1/2 teaspoon serving. It felt like it was giving me palpitations. Which is strange because on keto, the salt helped keep me from having palpitations. :woman_shrugging:

#764

Bone broth?

#765

I was thinking about a tour, eating around, the whole cow. Discovering different flavours. I wonder if there is a tour map like this that is labelled with the price of meat cuts?

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http://www.clovermeadowsbeef.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/Steak-Chart.jpg

#766

I know right? Thing is ‘the bear’ had no salt in like 40 plus years eating this carnivore way.

I am really wondering. It is always throw the salt at stuff, I was always told that also and it would never hurt us…but now my mind is turning on this big time.

a bit more research for me but I am thinking that ‘an overdue’ of anything is never a good thing in life for most things, so why should salt be different? I mean even animals only find natural salt licks/minerals in the ground and use them sparingly…so…me thinks we shake too much LOL

#767

agreed. if you need it, you need it for a reason. I so get that.

#768

kinda thing when you eliminated some foods and lowered your carbs down to like 0 on carnivore, your body is now getting too much salt.

when eating carbs our bodies keep water…carnivore your water retention is very low…that salt will float around in water, but without it, where does it settle, thicker in the blood or something??? I mean I don’t know…that is so wild. Listen to your body tho for sure

salt can raise BP and give palps. might be a big sign to cut back maybe

and and and I hit this fast:
4 Signs You’re Eating Too Much Salt

  1. You’re so swollen you feel like the Michelin woman.
  2. Your mouth is consistently parched.
  3. You notice that a lot of food tastes bland.
  4. Your doctor says you have high blood pressure.

#2 is me. I was just saying I had cotton mouth the other day and needed to suck in a ton of water.

yup, I am in a salty overdose situation. I am dropping it tomorrow.
time to change it up for me!

#769

@FrankoBear LOVE that beef map, thank you!

@Fangs Yeah, I had way too much salt today. I’ve got the dry mouth symptoms now as well.

#770

Harvard Health from their site.

hmmmm……I am finding this more curious all the time now. researching more LOL

---- The human body can’t live without some sodium. It’s needed to transmit nerve impulses, contract and relax muscle fibers (including those in the heart and blood vessels), and maintain a proper fluid balance. It doesn’t take much to do this. The Yanomamo people of the Amazon rainforest get by on just 200 mg of sodium a day (about the amount found in one-tenth teaspoon of salt). By comparison, the average American gets 3,400 mg (about 1½ teaspoons of salt), while in northern Japan the daily intake is a whopping 26,000 mg (more than 11 teaspoons of salt).

When sodium is in short supply, a host of chemical and hormonal messages signal the kidneys and sweat glands to hold onto water and conserve sodium. When you get more sodium than you need, the kidneys flush out the excess by making more, or saltier, urine. If they can’t get rid of enough sodium, though, it accumulates in the fluid between cells. Water inevitably follows sodium, and as the volume of this fluid increases, so does the volume of blood. This means more work for the heart and more pressure on blood vessels. Over time, this can stiffen blood vessels, leading to high blood pressure, heart attack, or stroke. It can also lead to heart failure.

There is also some evidence that salt can directly affect the heart, aorta, and kidneys without necessarily increasing blood pressure.

Some people are exquisitely sensitive to salt “” their blood pressure rises and falls as a direct result of how much salt they get. Others don’t seem to be affected at all. Unfortunately, there isn’t an easy test to determine who is salt-sensitive.

--------thing is the ‘real need’ of salt is very very low. the ‘recommendations’ are taking into effect the horrible food choices out there by the population…so it seems a higher recommendation is ‘allowable’ and ‘probably safe’ cause the food being eaten is so sodium heavy that ‘they can’t’ recommend only about 200mg of salt per day, cause if they did no one could eat the crap processed food out there LOL

it is wild on the info I am finding on it all :slight_smile:

My thinking is radically changing about salt ‘after adaption’ and what is truly needed. Kinda of a more approach to me now of ‘get rid of it mostly’ and use it only ‘when needed’ like for super hot weather and more if you feel you need it.

I know I am sucking up the salt way too much. I am gonna do the salt experiment on me and see what a day without salt will be for me.

the info out there is kinda of in the middle. like a bit more salt won’t hurt ya or link directly to fast troubles etc. but too little can kill ya but that isn’t likely to ever happen with the food available out there? Salt is a big debate issue as one would think from the info about it. One says eat it up, another site says limit it a lot.

huh, got more researching to do LOL

#771

Yeah, it’s a puzzle. I’ve not been adding any salt for a few weeks now but I also quit guzzling water non-stop.
I’m wondering if the need for so much salt is just a keto adaptation thing. Could it also be that since so many of us are conditioned to drink water continually that we’re peeing out our electrolytes hence the need to continuously replenish them. I cannot imagine our ancestors had to drink water constantly all day long. This is all a puzzle and worthy of research and experimentation.

I decided to do the Stephansson experiment and just quit adding it to see if anything happened. I’ve found that I don’t miss it. I even eat eggs without salt now.
I’ve noticed that I seem to like OMAD when feasable on carnivore whereas on keto I typically ate twice. Today my meal was about 2lbs ?oz of beef, some oven cooked fat trimmings, and a nice slice of raw frozen liver. No salt added to anything.

#772

I’ll share with you my thoughts on salt…this is just my opinion and something i’ve been noticing and thinking about. I read “The Salt Fix” and my keto experiences have led me to not fear the amount of salt I eat, since I season to taste. I have started to fear it in a psychological sense, though. We have a keto dietician in my country, he was the first one to bring keto and lchf to Slovenia and my husband went to him about 4 years ago for a consultation+diet plan. Back then, I thought keto was the most dangerous diet you can choose and we approached it in a very wrong way. Boy am I glad I was wrong… :wink: Anyways, in the diet plan he added hazelnuts and said to avoid salted nuts because the salted items can trigger snacking, since you can’t put them down due to the salty taste. Pre-keto, my vices were salty snacks, chips, nuts, etc and I have to avoid nuts because they trigger that snacking issue. Since junk food is scientifically designed to make us addicted, maybe it’s not just sugar and fat, maybe it’s the salt, as well. These past few months have been a little more stressful than usual, I did stuff my emotions with nuts and decided enough was enough a few weeks ago. Lately i’ve been craving coffee in the afternoon and I do like stronger tasting foods. What if we need saltier foods to replace the SAD we used to eat? Processed food has lots of salt and maybe our bodies need to get rid of that addiction, as well? Whenever I crave something salty, maybe it is not an electrolyte imbalance, but an actual craving for comfort foods that we cant have anymore? Once you eliminate sugar and get over the addictions, what if salt should be the next addiction to look into? Our brains could be compensating with salt… When you begin keto, you learn to interpret the hunger signals - am I physically hungry or just psychologically hungry? Then you learn that hunger can also be an electrolyte imbalance, so you have a ketoade and see if you’re still hungry, since our stupid bodies can send a hunger signal when electrolytes are off. I will play with this some more, compare the effect of the same meal with little salt vs seasoned to my liking.

#773

Being in the ocean daily, I love salt. I spend most of summer salt encrusted. If I lick my whiskers right now I taste salt.

When we say salt. Maybe we mean salts? As in electrolytes?

https://www.ketogenicforums.com/search?q=Salt

Recent ask around I did about salt.

https://www.ketogenicforums.com/t/salt-how-important-is-it-in-your-dietary-approach/95343

I think context is key. Body electrolyte losses need to be covered for some.

It is interesting that carnivores eating beef muscle meat seem to need less salt than standard Keto with very low insulin response. At an insulin contextualised guess, it may be that the carnivore approach is slightly more insulinogenic via increased dietary amino acids (in beef, and possibly, in particular glycine from connective tissue or bone broth.), than a strict minimal carb ketogenic approach with a more fat macro focus?

Totally agree that added salt is a psychological spur, a proven food additive, to overeat nuts as well as bland carbohydrates (e.g. starches)

#774

I’ve not found one with pricing attached to the cuts/regions. We price based on the cut and generally will check pricing online, at the co-op, and at the grocer’s.
I noticed that the beef cheeks weren’t on here. That is an amazing, flavorful cut- esp. when braised. Very tender. I think a couple of those are on the meal plan for this coming week. :slight_smile:

As for salt, I’m still into salt. I notice more in the way muscle cramps when I don’t have enough.

#775

I agree Bob. I am thinking the salt is so important thru adaption cause we dump water weight so fast. Salt goes bye bye and we need to replenish. After that I am leaning way towards we don’t need it to the level we do thru adaption.

I mean I love true science. In that if the bodies lowest amt of salt for survival is about 115-200mg to run on per day and it is all it requires to complete its’ functions…to up that 10xs the normal amount would be for what? I can’t think of any reason to walk that far from what our natural body needs.

Plus there is a toxicity level for sodium so again, showing a toxic level you can hit and be in jeopardy. Why do we want to go in that direction over our natural needs? Again, I can’t find any reasons for it at all.

An extra need per individual needs like for medical, some cramps etc. and salt helps. As we adapt thru and our body is healing someone might truly feel a need for a bit more salt and I get that.

I like how you walked into carnivore. I like you did the original way with Stephansson and dropped all that baggage of big sodium and just is eating a big old meat meal. You are changing in such a good way :slight_smile:

great post!!

#776

Love this! I am an ocean baby also :slight_smile: My goal is in full retirement which is heading this way to be coastal. Sell the farm and hit the coast. I so love that salty air, keeps my sinus open and I just love it LOL Avid and quite skilled boogie boarder here HAHA
Jealous of you and you being at the ocean!!

FB…I thought the video was good. I am still on that fence that what he is saying…3 to 5g…which is about 3K to 5Kmg. I get what he is saying, I think tho as much as we ‘feel that need of higher salt’ I don’t think anymore these higher numbers are needed on a daily basis.

BUT with that info you gave me I will research up more…thanks for throwing that at me LOL heehee!

(Davy) #777

8 oz of ribeye only have around 110 mg sodium. This Bear guy had a lot of things right, but nobody’s perfect. Didn’t he do a lot of LSD?

I’m going with the Japanese on this one. “According to the annual National Health and Nutrition Survey by the Health, Labor and Welfare Ministry, the average sodium intake in Japan was 10 grams a day in 2014.” And they have one of the very highest rates of longevity. Course I’m sure there may be more to it, like eating lots of fatty fish and their potassium ingesting is high.

I read a couple of articles yesterday by some Cardiologists.(who both btw take 5g of pink salt every day) They said electrolytes work synergistically and that it’s NOT the high salt that’s the problem, it’s the ratio of Potassium to Salt and lack of Potassium.
If you’re low on potassium, then yes, high sodium could be a problem. If your potassium intake is good, around 4200mg to 4700mg, then high salt is NO PROBLEM. Everyone might check how much potassium they’re getting.
According to this article the ideal ratio of salt to pot. is 1:2 (it should be a minimum of 1:1) So I’m going to shoot for 3g salt and 5g Pot.


I know I struggle getting enough potassium, but lately am making a point to get close to 5g of it. So I’m sticking with minimum of 3g Himilayan salt up to 5g.
If I pass in the next year, I’ll have a chat with all the Japanese in heaven and send ya’ll a postcard.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #778

He made some of the best acid back in the day, a chemistry wizard. Nothing wrong with great LSD! Definitely doesn’t give me any second thoughts about his intelligence and insights. :wink:

@Meerkatsandy mentions “The Salt Fix”. I haven’t read it but I enjoyed this video interview with Ken Berry MD. Two Carnivores talking salt.

:cowboy_hat_face:

#779

I’m not against salt, I just don’t know that we need to be eating so much if we aren’t eating vegetables. Thus my experiment.
I’ve noticed that

  • the more salt I consume, the thirstier I am
  • the thirstier I am, the more water I drink
  • the more water I drink, the more I pee
  • the more I pee, the more salt I consume

Let’s face it… vegetables really do taste like :poop: without salt, added meat, and spices. :laughing:

#780

@David_Stilley Yes, his book…something about DiNicolantonio rubs me the wrong way, I cant quite put my finger on it, but the book is good :slight_smile:

@FrankoBear I’m just trying to figure out if i’m compensating for something by salting my food, the way that I am now, as in a dopamine hit from stronger flavors, just like i’ve been in a coffee mood lately. My body’s starting to annoy me again…

#781

FYI
I don’t tell anyone to not eat salt.
I don’t tell anyone they should be carnivorous.

I am a self experimenter, chronicling my journey. Take my experiences… with a grain of salt. Hehe :smile: