Zero Carb Carnivore - what if blood glucose is constantly high?

(Bunny) #21

Attacking the messenger and censoring real nutritional and medical science is real popular here?

It is amazing you don’t see any neurological BDNF factors around here? Now that’s SAD (no pun intended)! :slightly_smiling_face::slightly_smiling_face::slightly_smiling_face::joy::rofl::joy::rofl::joy:

(Elizabeth ) #22

So because everybody else does that you do it too and that makes it valid?

#23

Glucagon.

Is it possible that moving from a low carb ketogenic diet to a carnivore diet, may affect glucagon.

My last fasting insulin blood test was 9, which is normal, but high for someone on a ketogenic diet. That was more than 6 months ago.

Glucagon initiates endogenous blood glucose production through gluconeogenisis. Maybe GNG uses the amino acids from the carnivore diet. Insulin switches off the catabolism of the glucagon state.

If my insulin is low now, might the glucagon be disregulated? It shouldn’t push blood glucose out of normal ranges.

I need to get some more blood tests.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #24

Fatty liver disease is caused by overloading the liver with fructose and/or ethanol. They are both metabolised in the liver by the same pathway, and they both lead to a process called de novo lipogenesis if the pathway becomes overloaded. The process is what leads to fatty liver. Fatty liver disease, if not reversed, can progress to steatohepatitis, cirrhosis, and eventually death from liver failure.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #25

Without knowing what glucagon and insulin are doing when the glucose rises, you are trying to figure out what is going on in the absence of complete data. It’s not necessarily a problem that your glucose is rising. What happens to your HbA1C?

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #26

I often wonder whether ethanol/fructose constitute a fourth macro.

(Bunny) #27

Only when you have wolves guarding the Hen House?

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(PJ) #28

OK can I interrupt to go back to the start for a minute:

WHY did you go into the hospital? What specifically was the cause?

I get:
“Oxalate dumping”
“No such thing bwahaha”

But SOMETHING put you in the hospital FFS, so what was it? What were the symptoms?

Thanks,
PJ <— missed the memo apparently

PS: I’ve been to ER twice thanks to ‘doing keto badly.’ Both times (and I knew what it was the second time, but the first time, me and my family thought I’d had a stroke!) it was for being hypocalcemic. This despite I was supplementing, and despite I had not lost any further water weight in a week. Both times it was triggered by eating a lot of sodium which causes a calcium drop and apparently I was too close to the edge.

#29

I need more data Paul. I’ll check to see if I have a pathology request form. HBA1c, will be important to know. Previously it was 5.5. But you have reminded me that I have a continuous glucose monitor that I got for Christmas. So I’ll crack that present open. The carnivore challenge I’m on winds up this week.

#30

and we are going into June ya know…I was gonna post another thread to start a new one for us zc’ers :slight_smile: Are ya coming along for the ride? LOL

FB you have been on the May challenge and you have not ended up in the hospital at all right? On this go round of trying carnivore you have been ok, am I right on this one? Just checking. How have you felt thru this challenge right now you are handling? IF YOU continue carnivore and don’t go back, this ‘every time I try carnivore’ I get reactions in the 10-14 day range that could send me to the hospital…so isn’t the right way to continue on straight zero carb and see what improves if we go 60, 90, a year?

Am I getting this right in what you are asking about and wanting to chat about? If I am missing something more on all this let me know :slight_smile:

(Kristen Ann) #31

@FrankoBear You probably know all of this already, but I’ll share just in case… If you think oxalate dumping is what’s sending you to the hospital, you can try taking magnesium or calcium supplements or epsom salt baths to clear out the oxalates you’re dumping. I don’t get heart palpitations but this helps my oxalate dumping symptoms. Also oxalates can trigger the inflammasome and activate an immune response. Supposedly MSM, resveratrol, spirulina, (& other things I can’t remember right now…) can all block the activation of the inflammasome. Might be worth trying if your oxalate dumping symptoms are bad.

(Elizabeth ) #32

Just as an FYI, my HBA1C has been at 5.5 forever went to 5.7 at 2 and 1/2 years carnivore, but my doctor explained that’s because my red blood cells are living longer than normal, It’s not because my blood sugar stays high. Longer living blood cells will naturally pick up more glycation.

(Ian) #33

That’s a really interesting theory?

I was aware that A1c is variable based on the life expectancy of the red blood cells, but did your doctor explain what is it about the carnivore diet that might be causing them to live longer?

Could it be less glycation due to enhanced glycemic control?

(Elizabeth ) #34

Well there’s also adaptive glucose sparing, also known as physiological insulin resistance. I’m not an athlete but at 2 years carnivore Dr Baker had an HBA1C of 6.3. :woman_shrugging:

#35

Hi Fangs.

No hospital visits this go round. I did have heart palpitations and increased heart rate in mid-May. But I have learned how to settle everything down at home by adding extra supplements, extra micro-nutrients (via beef stock and pink salt supercharged beef bone broth), and, if I need to, I will take a pharmaceutical beta-blocker tablet.

I have settled in to an animal-based dietary pattern, 2MAD (sometimes OMAD) that is dictated by satiety. I’m careful with my fats and mainly (99%) take in animal fats.

As it is winter now, I have had a mouthful of wood-fire roasted pumpkin about once per week, and the chickens have gone off the lay, so I’m eating a few more sardines and these are packed (allegedly) in olive oil - but I might finesse that with getting the spring water packed sardines and drown them in butter or bacon fat. That way I miss out on any industrial seed oil adulteration of the ‘olive oil’.

I just kept going eating an animal-based diet after May Zero.

#36

A few things have been happening. Work is busier despite working online. I am grateful I have full-time employment. I gained a new health device; an 11 week-old black Labrador. She is on a ketogenic diet from the start, going against veterinary advice to feed processed ‘puppy food’.

My eating fell into automatic mode with 2MAD and daily 17 hour non eating window, animal-based foods. But I have had some in-season winter fruits (pumpkin, yanks call them squash), and a few avocados, and some seaweed.

@PaulL I just tested my blood glucose 90 min after a bacon, eggs, pumpkin, seaweed, butter breakfast. I have full satiety. Actually more than that, I feel calm and excited to do some more work (brain energised). These are symptoms of nutritional ketosis. I had a cup of black coffee with 15mL heavy cream about an hour before breakfast. My blood glucose is 4.2 mmol/l (76 mg/dl).

My n=1 is eating an animal-based keto-carnivore diet. But I don’t need to eat strictly carnivore zero-carb, and I find that less optimal for me. I do love the general feeling of well-being I have from being in nutritional ketosis, so I continue to pursue it. It has become a psychological goal more-so over the years. The plant foods I eat I am very fussy about. They need to be in-season, locally grown, pesticide and herbicide free, grown in cared-for soil by nice people. Then I apply food technology of cooking or fermenting (occasionally mixing with double cream) to detoxify those plants ready for eating. This is the way I feel my best. It’s a nice thing to test for and discover.

#37

Cool!! join us in Juniblee Zero :slight_smile: we got June thread running.