WHY do we still feel hungry sometimes after eating a lot?


(Meeping up the Science!) #61

There is hunger and satiety. Hunger ideally sends a message to the organism to consume food for energy. Satiety signals the end of the need for this. How they are regulated is extremely complex and only quasi-understood.

Satiety has many components. It’s both chemical and physical. When we eat it triggers a cascade of reactions - the chemicals in food enzymes and hormones are secreted, and the physical presence of food also triggers enzymes and hormones.

If individuals have compulsively overeaten for a long period of time, they habituate to being overfull and retrain the brain in this fashion. This is because we don’t just have chemical satiety from fat and protein, but we also get a signal to stop eating from our stomach stretching. When we repeatedly overstretch this, or when we eat when not hungry, it then skews the satiety response. Similarly, if you eat for emotion regulation, or abstain from eating for control, it also alters how the brain receives signals. We actually have an entire and separate nervous system branch in the gut referred to as the enteric nervous system.


(Meeping up the Science!) #62

It’s normal to be hungry after exercise, actually. If you are at a healthy or low body fat percentage, then you don’t have many energy stores to draw from in ketosis, so your body does need the fuel. Even normal and average exercise signals the body to get fuel…I don’t think that’s odd at all.


(Doug) #63

Great paragraph, Donna. Well said and so true. Stretcher and ignorer here, for a long time. Age, patience (give the stomach time to fully communicate with the brain), and quitting after one plate of food - this is all helping. Yet the road is long.


(Bryan Ausinheiler) #64

Great thoughts Doug, and thanks for the correction on Metformin. I wasn’t able to find the original study, were you? It was cited “cell 2009”


#65

What really helps is fasting. I have kids so I am in the kitchen a lot. When fasting I know I am there to get them something. It helped to break the snack habit


#66

I just LOVE this term. Keto Purgatory. This is where I think I have been since starting keto over two months ago. Not one pound or inch dropped and the hunger continues…but I am in ketosis and there are other good signs, like improved sleep and energy. I wonder when my body will consider I’ve atoned for my carb-filled days. :neutral_face::grinning:


(Mel Soule) #67

@OldDoug Thank you for posting this. Great info on working of Metformin. Hopkins is right down the street from me and I know several of the researchers there.


(Mel Soule) #68

@Olivia1 I had to chuckle at this. Thanks for posting it. We’ve all spent time in Keto Purgatory especially in the beginning as we are metabolically remodeling our tissues. Old insulin resistant cells get replaced by happier cells every day everywhere. Each day we are getting closer to a healthier metabolism. That’s why IMHO Keep Calm and Keto On is such an important philosophy to hold onto. Helps us surf through the flat spots.


(mary6aros) #69

My husband is similar in that he usually eats nothing all day at work and eats a fairly large supper late in the afternoon, but turns to me 40 minutes later saying he’s so hungry. I try to include in his supper plenty of dark leafy greens and fats, because I want him to be satisfied (belly-wise) right before bed, but sometimes he needs some sausage and eggs to be good.


#70

I believe fat cells live for 10 years so 10% are replaced every year (I think the Dudes said it on a podcast). So after a few years you have fat cells that have never been IR. At that point you will notice a change, at least that is what I want to happen. Still waiting here


#71

So glad it gave you a chuckle. :smiley: KCKO has been my mantra, even after I disocvered my body and metabolism aren’t following most of the projected outcomes of keto (so far).

Another way I’m starting to look at not having budged since I started, is that I have around ten to twelve pounds to lose to my ideal weight (at least, the weight I feel most comfortable in), so maybe that fat is harder to shed than someone who had 30, 50, a hundred or more to shed. I’m looking at the other good effects of keto, like no heartburn (though I was never a huge strach eater, ate little bread and bakeries and pasta, every time I had any it was like throwing a lit torch down my esophagus) MUCH better sleep and energy, and no cravings (though HUNGER is still present). I’m SO waiting for those happier cells, and to that end I’m coddling my unhappy ones, and keep feeding them keto and telling them they’re good cells.

One thing I’m still not quite there in the keto WOE is that I miss sweets, and HATE all keto approved sweeteners with a passion that burns way more violently than my previous heartburns. I have tossed every drink or dessert I’ve made using any of them after a sip or a bite. I keep wondering if I’m alone in this as everyone keeps talking about keto desserts as if they’re not only edible, but delicious!

I have no idea if this will pass, too, or if I should just give up on the sweet side on the spectrum of my taste buds.


(Mel Soule) #72

IMHO when we get within the “redzone” of weight loss (inside of 20 lbs to go, pardon the NFL analogy) seems everything happens at a lower velocity. I too am within 20-25 lbs of a “idealized” weight. When I hit it that will represent a 110-120 lbs total loss since 2/17. No way do I expect to be traveling at the same speed going forward as the past several months. I need time for my skin to catch up to the weight loss train.

So I’m now turning to the finer points of metabolic management. Hydration has been of interest to me of late. It’s cold here (in Maryland) and I know in winter I drink less than I should. Sooooo I’ve been trying to push myself to drink my average daily water loss which is about 1,700 ml/day. First response so far has been some pesky peripheral edema on my ankles has disappeared in 10 days. Very interesting. Proper hydration is acting like a diuretic. Did’nt know that could happen.

Since I only weigh myself now at the start and end of each monthly Zornfast I’m clueless about my daily weight changes. I do know however that my belt is running out of holes again and these pants are 18 inches smaller than when I started. More importantly I’ve not touched an Advil or Aleve since March, 2017 as I no longer have joint pain. My blood pressure meds left the building back in August and I have only my daily baby aspirin to keep me company.

I’ve met some great folks at the pool 3 times a week poolwalking 2.5 miles/week and once a week in the gym on the weight machines. The Dr. McGuff protocols have really paid off with strength gains since August.

My guess is that the 10% of body fat cells I’ve replaced in the past year have been born in a lower basal insulin environment, with those arriving after August having the best chance of being really, really normal. So maybe August is my ketoversary for adipose resurrection. While we’re on the subject of resurrection my skeleton replaces itself at the same rate as my fat so let’s not forget the happy bones. And last but not least Mr. Liver is a regenerating superstar. My guess is that there are a lot of happy insulin sensitive campers there too.

Every 90 days new red blood cells arrive and the last HbA1c in October was 4.8, with ongoing fasting blood sugars averaging 78 for the last 90 days, so there should be happiness in blood city as well.

As to what I’m after going forward is to lock in my gains and explore where this can go. I am now sooooo past what I expected to happen last year, every day is something new. One thing I’m sure of now is that monthly fasting is my go to strategy for personal recharge. The brain on fire mental clarity is my new drug of choice. I’m hooked. And since I’ve now started Zornfast January, 2018 1 hour ago I’m on this cruise with you and the rest of the gang to enjoy the ride. See you on the party deck with @Brenda.


(Rick) #73

How are you doing on the D. McGuff protocol? I want to get started on it soon and any comment would be appreciated!


(Mel Soule) #74

@azviking Rick,

It has worked. Only do once a week and 5 machines. Bench press, rowing machine, leg press, leg extension and leg abduction/adduction (thigh master). 3 reps per machine. 10 seconds out/10 seconds back. One minute rest between reps. Slow as I can. All weights are up with legs the greatest gains since Aug.1.

If anyone had told me, before I watched Dr. McGuff’s video, that 25-30 mins once a week works wonders I would have looked at them cross eyed. No more. It works. Truly. Functional movements, walking, stairs, dancing lifting etc all better than before. Still trying to build the metabolic headroom. Have to remind myself that I have a new hip just last year. Even my surgeon is impressed.


(Rick) #75

Thanks! Looks like I’m headed in the right direction! Luck and success to you!


(Mel Soule) #76

You are. Success to you as well my friend


(Michele) #77

If I want/need that something after dinner I have berries and cream. If I don’t have fresh berries I use frozen and allow them to thaw slightly, then use the stick/wand to beat them to a frozen pulp which I then mix into whipped cream. It’s just enough to do trick especially when it’s a mouth feel of needing something else. I really am not a fan of stevia and would prefer to maintain my much reduced sweet tooth that is almost nil now.


#78

Thanks for the suggestions! Raspberries are the only sweet thing I eat now (whether fresh or mashed and heated into a sauce to eat with cream cheese or pancakes) along with coconut manna. I’ve given up on every so called “natural” sugar substitute as I found their taste not sweet at all, just weird and off putting. I guess my need for sweet things is psychological right now, not to mention that my sweet tooth has reduced dratiscally to the point I find raspberries really sweet when I always found them too sour.


(Jane Hull) #79

I’m 3 months in and have lost 29 lbs. I had been a little stalled and upped my fat and switched things up a little 2 weeks ago. I lost 5 mre lbs but now I’m hungry after lunch every day. Breakfast is coffee with coconut oil and golden paste (turmeric paste), lunch is usually a salad and protein with added fat, dinner is protein and veg cooked in fat. I try not to snack at all. I have been tracking for the past week and my ratios are fine. I’m eating 1300-1500 cal per day. I’m 5’1" and weigh 180. Do you think the hunger is just habit? Sometimes it goes away if I drink some hot tea but it sure is annoying all afternoon.


#80

If you’re still hungry after lunch - you’re probably not eating enough - especially if that doesn’t happen with other meals. The general rule is to eat to satiety - and my guess is you need to up the fat content (more dressing on the salad; maybe a bunch of bacon, fat bomb for dessert etc) Also noting you are monitoring calories (not a crime per se :blush:) but probably too low which would be fixed by eating more fat.
Re: hunger a habit - though that may be happening, I think more appropriate to suggest your metabolism is still adjusting and you are still learning to listen to your body. I find for me that its not so much hunger - but ‘eating’ that is the habit. Happens to me when I’m fasting - I know I’m not actually hungry; but I want something in my mouth.
Congratulations on your progress thus far - but be warned, stalls occur and slower weight loss is typical around this stage. And can be frustrating but stick with it because the alternative is not worth it. KCKO!!