Type 2 Diabetic

(Paul H) #1

I am a Type 2 diabetic my Dr is old school and does not fully agree with my Keto and If plan. I have educated myself alot on them and am just getting into it more seriously as it takes awhile to learn the foods, portions, macro and micros needed. Along with possible issues along the way. So the problem is now I have so many things I could or should be taking while not Fasting. So let me give you a list of Meds and other things. Last A1c 9.4 taken 6 weeks ago. Has been 10.4 - 7.2 got off the wagon. The other day my BS dropped to 98 for the first time in years.

Levemir 30 units
Metformin 2000
Lisinopril 2.5 mg
Atorvastin 20mg
Actos 15mg
Bayer Low Dose
Vitamin D3 5000u
I have a pill case for all of these and have taken them together in the morning typically.

So things I have added and want to add.

AVC
Lemon Juice
Potassium
Magnesium
Tumeric
Callogen
Bone broth
Electrolites
and of course so many other suggestions but, I know relax…lol

I know talk to your DR first and foremost but, I need a new one…lol Just looking for some suggestions on how ya’ll incorporate all the things and still eat food…lol

Frankly I am about ready to drop all the meds and give it a go… Certainly the insulin is holding back my weight loss. I have no reactions from the meds and pretty healthy for the most part. Type 2 for 5 years.

Thanks for your input!

Paul

#2

N=2

Keto has been a far better treatment for my T2 diabetes than medications. I used to have an A1c of 7.3 while using insulin and metformin. Since starting keto over 2 years ago, it’s been as low as 5.2 without any diabetes medications.

My mom is also a T2 diabetic and just started keto recently. She takes repaglinide and struggled to keep blood sugar in the 140’s. Many times since starting keto, she’s had measurements under 100. She’s cut back on the repaglinide and is still seeing low numbers.

(Ethan) #3

Simply dropping medications cold turkey can have some unexpected and dangerous side effects. I would consult a doctor who will work with you to adjust medications based on your progress. If you need to start now and with your current unenthusiastic doctor, perhaps explaining to your doctor that you want to try this for a period (say, 6 months), will help him or her work with you to adjust doses based on your progress. Then, if you are still on some meds in the 6-month timeframe, just press the doctor for another 3-6 months. If you end up off most or all of the mediations in a safe manner and are maintaining proper blood markers (cholesterol will be a problem for this doctor, I know), just tell the doctor you want to make this a permanent lifestyle change, and the doctor will have no choice but to either drop you as a patient or work with you.

(Jody) #4

I definitely recommend Dr Jason Fung’s books if you haven’t found them. As a T2D, I referenced both The Diabetes Code and Guide to Fasting regularly in my first few months. His website has some good content, but you have to be willing to pay $40/month. I think it was worth the few months I paid, especially managing side effects of fasting and they have specific T2D video courses. Education is KEY. Your body will not do the same as anyone else and there is a TON of advice out there. The key to this journey is the n=1. And even when you think you have it all figured out, something changes.

The 2ketodudes podcast is a great source as well, you can listen to their journey/learnings.

If you don’t like your doctor, find one you do. I don’t agree with everything my doctor recommends, but she listens to me and I feel like it’s a partnership.

You don’t have to do everything at once, that is too overwhelming. Just start with cutting your carbs down. I wouldn’t be in any hurry to add supplementation until you need it. Learn about salt however, you will NEED salt if you go keto and fast.

I wouldn’t drop all your meds either. As you start feeling better, then you can cut your meds.

I started with metformin, lisinopril, vitamin D as well. I am now off metformin, but my blood pressure isn’t budging yet and fasting is a stressor on the body. I suspect BP will be the last dial to turn for me. Being fair and living in WI, I will probably NEVER get to stop taking vitamin D, I learned the hard way how lack of vitamin D can ruin quality of life.

My best advice, take it one step at a time. Start with getting the carbs out first.

#5

Definitely. I was able to drop my insulin immediately because I was taking it on a sliding scale based on blood glucose. Since I wasn’t hitting any of my trigger points, I never took another dosage of insulin.

But it was about 8 months before I worked with the doctor to stop Metformin. We cut it in half first. After seeing no dramatic changes in blood glucose, we cut it out completely. Again, no dramatic changes.

I’ve been free of both medications since.

(Roy D) #6

“I know talk to your DR first and foremost but, I need a new one…lol”

You could try to Google “keto friendly doctors” and see what pops up in your area. Or you could post your location to this board for possible suggestions for doctors who are keto friendly in your area.

Roy D

(mole person) #7

This is so true. And often it is the weight loss itself that leads the current protocol you are following to just stop working and you have to make an adjustment in order to continue making progress.

Exactly this. I’ve been keto for two years and use none of those supplements except added salt.

And definitely don’t go off meds without talking to your doctor about how to do it safely.

(Paul H) #8

Thank you for the responses!

I have been cutting carbs and changing what I eat for months actually… trying to find what I can tolerate, sustain and how to prepare. Portioning has been the issue of late but, Fasting has not. MY Dr did say I could adjust my Levemir as needed and did drop my Actos from 30mg. I was disappointed about a year ago as my weight jumped 20 lbs for no real reason. I did stop using Invokana weekly shots and started on the Actos and kinda blamed the Actos… Dr did say the Invokana might have helped keep the weight off and it wasn’t the Actos to blame directly when I last saw him. My last blood screen was actually good other than the higher glucose of course alone looks like a failure on the Dr’s part. I stopped taking all of my meds for months knowing they weren’t helping anything frankly…but planning to buckle with Keto and IF decided to see him first. Until he sees the Ac1 and weight come down I think he will be skeptical or unsupportive for legal reasons more than anything. June 3 is our next meeting and blood work.

I am testing my BS like 5 or 6 times a day at this point to better understand my reactions and timing. I know my Ac1 didn’t reflect my better eating that started about a month before the test so I know my numbers will improve.

Paul

(Consensus is Politics) #9

Welcome to the keto family

We have a lot of knowledge here to draw from, so the only silly question you have would be the one you didnt ask.

Maybe I missed it, but what I didnt see above was the actual foods you eat. It really matters. In my humble opinion, cold turkey on the carbs is the way to go; however, I’m not a doctor. Heck, no medical/health/nutritional education at all. But I am an accomplished troubleshooter. My experience ranges from vietnam era fighter aircraft weapons systems to state of the art Xerox and Canon copiers and computers and networking. Pretty much everything I do, from shoping to driving to mowing the lawn has the same thing in comon, I’m in a constant state of awareness of what I’m doing when/where/and why nots. Aka… S.A. Situational Awareness. Key to troubleshooting.

T2DM is a friking Ninja. I sneaks up out if nowhere. Zip! Bam! Slash! My kidney stone tests are sidelined because my BG level is 594 and every one is freaking out. My HbA1c was 11.8%. That was 28 Aug 2017. Six weeks later I went cold carb turkey. My BG went from Wally World wild ride to nice and consistent, in 24 hours.

I went cold turkey on my metformin. 1,000 mg 2x a day. And went cold turkey, because of life, things got in the way. My BG remained normal for weeks of no meds. More recently I decided to keep taking the metformin. There are reports that it has a regenerative effect for insulin resistance. And seeing as my side effects are mild at the most, I continue.

I tend to see a repeating patern for blood sugar fluctuations. Food. Usually hidden carbs. Or foods not listed as a carb that arent foods at all, but have a higher glycemic index than table sugar. Maltodextrine/maltodextrose is used in many powdery products as an anti caking agent. Morton iodized salt contains some. And the one that knocked me for a loop was labeled safe for diabetics, sugar free Metamucil. Turns out it had a larger effect on my BG than to use the regular sugar type. Maltodextrose has a glycemic index of 120 compare to table sugar with a GI of 55.

(Paul H) #10

Wow I didn’t know Morton salt did that. I picked on the Pink Sea Salt craze so good there…I use Konsyl and like it.Not real tastey though…lol I hear ya a the Malto stuff… gotta read labels…all labels. Thanks for sharing!

(Full Metal KETO AF) #11

I would be pro active on this and dump the doctor. He’ obviously living in the past. It’s well documented how a ketogenic diet puts diabetes in remission. There are thousands of people who have posted this on this site alone. Getting off insulin and metaformin are common after a couple of months. I have two doctors and a team of transplant nephrologists who are ALL behind my efforts and are amazed at how I have in 8 months gone from a 205# pre diabetic to a 169# not pre diabetic any longer. I have had two of those doctors tell me that they should follow my dietary example and they also related that they wished most of their patients would do the same.

No doctor cares about your health as much as you do, and they aren’t Demi-gods so I encourage you to take control of your own health regardless of the antiquated advice this doctor may give you. They want to deal with you the least amount of time they can, get on to the next patient and keep pumping them through. What you want requires more effort on their part and most doctors don’t feel comfortable recommending a ketogenic diet because dietary counseling is not their arena, drug prescription is. It just goes in the face of what they have dedicated their life to promoting even if times are changing and erroneous medical notions and myths are dispelled by new research. They will stick to their guns and I suggest you do the same. Get a new younger and more enlightened doctor before this one puts you in an early grave. :dizzy_face::skull::skull::skull::cowboy_hat_face:

(Paul H) #12

Budda Bing… I agree entirely David…

(Ethan) #13

Disagree! They have no problem recommending a vegan diet.

(Paul H) #14

Why is that? Just a animal issue or a fat issue? Sarcasm? lol

(Full Metal KETO AF) #15

I have never had a doctor recommend a vegan diet. I guess some do though. Medical schools teach them to promote a LFHC diet with lean meats, healthy whole grains, legumes and nuts, fruits and vegetables and moderate dairy. A “Well Balanced Healthy Diet”. They were wrong about it then and they’re still pushing it now. They just backed off on saturated fat quietly when it was found to promote Alzheimer’s and low fat people die earlier.

(Alec) #16

This is a bit inconvenient for the low fat brigade, isn’t it? And lines up with what we know about the low cholesterol CW bollox. So, eat fat, live long. Keys and that charlie McGovern have got a lot to answer for.

(mole person) #17

Mine did the last time I saw her. I told her I was on a ketogenic diet and she said “what kind of ketogenic diet?”. So I told her it was a very low carb, moderate protein, high fat diet. To which she said high fat was bad and would clog my arteries. Then she actually said “the vegan diet is the healthiest diet.” :roll_eyes::open_mouth::zipper_mouth_face:

(mole person) #18

What’s CW?

(Janet) #19

End of discussion with doctors who “do not agree” with very low carb diets: http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/diacare/early/2019/04/10/dci19-0014.full.pdf

(Janet) #20