Triglycerides and fat burning

(Erin Macfarland ) #1

If one has low triglycerides and higher total cholesterol is this an indication that one is utilizing fat efficiently as fuel?

When should I have a blood test?
Lab Results - I’m concerned
#2

Wow, no reply on this huh? I was exactly looking for this answer. As far as I had heard that triglycerides are the fuel and if you have low numbers then you are burning fat efficiently. I would love for someone to confirm that as well. Btw, what prompted you to ask that? Did you read that anywhere? Please share the link if you did.

#3

thanks for asking, i had no idea this is tied together, waiting for answers to know.

(Brian) #4

It’s been a while but I faintly recollect either Ivor Cummins or Dave Feldman mentioning some of this stuff. Wish I could remember. They are both good at helping to put complex things into language the common folk can understand.

(Erin Macfarland ) #5

@BadKetoPro I myself hav super high total cholesterol, low trigs and am athletic. I just listened to part one and two of the keto geek podcast that came out last week with Dave Feldman and he discussed this exact phenomenon! When someone is athletic and lean and eating ketogenically, their blood work will reflect this pattern, high total, low trigs, and high LDL. He called them “lean mass hyper responders.” This is essentially where someone with lower levels of body fat (stored energy) has lots of circulating fatty acids in their blood transporting energy, because they are using a high amount of energy for physics activity. I sent my blood work to the other guest on that show @siobhan, and she agreed I fit his description. So many months later I got my answer! For reference, at the time I had those labs done my total cholesterol was about 340, trigs were about 40 and my LDL around 150. I was around 10% body fat and running and lifting weights. Does that help? Pretty interesting!

(Erin Macfarland ) #6

@bojana read my response, and listen to the podcast I mentioned it’s very interesting!

#7

thank you! my husband is athletic and he will be interested in this too!

(Siobhan) #8

Yep :slight_smile:
LDL particles are the boat, triglycerides are the cargo, and LDL cholesterol is along for the ride.
So low triglycerides paired with high LDL shows lots of transportation of the cargo, but the cargo (fat) is getting all used up!

(Erin Macfarland ) #9

Expertly said as always :wink:

#10

@Emacfarland Fantastic! Well, I am glad that you are one of the “lean mass hyper responders" because that actually does not put you at high cholesterol risk even though the numbers are all high.

#11

@siobhan But what if someone had high triglycerides with high LDL and low HDL and if all this started after starting the Keto diet.

To better explain my sitaution, my cholesterol reading last year i.e. May 2017 were as follows:

  • CHOLESTEROL TOTAL 225 mg/dL
  • HDL CHOLESTEROL1 52 mg/dL
  • TRIGLYCERIDES1 126 mg/dL
  • LDL-CHOLESTEROL1 148 mg/dL
  • CHOL/HDLC RATIO1 4.3
  • NON HDL CHOLESTEROL1 173 mg/dL

And then I started the Keto Diet in mid Oct of 2017 and I struggled to get into Ketosis because I had carbs slipping in and keeping me from getting into deep Ketosis. But even I was trying I thought eating high fatty food would get me into ketosis and ate it all, mostly dairy though, cheeses and heavy cream and half and half (which is not keto approved… I know). My carbs were mostly from veggies, berries and some from the half and half. I don’t do bacon or red meats. I measured all my food and made sure I didn’t go over the carb limit and I also made sure that I never consumed more then 100-120 mg of total cholesterol at any given day.

I did get out of Ketosis for about 5 days in November meaning, my ketone meter showed the readings as Lo where it had always shown 0.4mmol/L - 0.5mmol/L. I was on vacation and I did indulge a bit. But then I started getting back into Ketosis starting December and I was in deep ketosis for about 3 weeks until the holidays.

Oh btw, I was working out all this while. I was lifting, monitoring my heart rate to be in the fat burning zone and cardio zone.

I got my blood work done recently the numbers went through the roof.

  • CHOLESTEROL TOTAL 301 mg/dL
  • HDL CHOLESTEROL1 42 mg/dL
  • TRIGLYCERIDES1 262 mg/dL
  • LDL-CHOLESTEROL1 212 mg/dL
  • CHOL/HDLC RATIO1 7.2

Now, I am not sure if this is because of my high fat diet or its because the way the Keto diet works? But I know for one thing that the high Triglycerides definitely is not a good thing for me.

Also, it means that while I was consuming fat, I was not burning fat with my low intensity workout that I maintained within the fat burning zone, right?

Does my Keto journey and the cholesterol numbers make sense? Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

(Siobhan) #12

Sorry for the delayed reply on this, I’m currently on vacation so reply time is a bit sporadic.
That does not seem to be the typical pattern we see with folks on keto…
When doing high fat, were you doing high fat and high​ carb, or high fat and low carb? How low is low - you said some carbs creeped in?

A couple more questions:

When you got that latest blood test how long did you fast before the test? Did you fast for the recommended 12-14 hours, multiday fast, or less than 12-14? Had a coffee with cream on the morning of the blood draw or anything like that?

#13

Hello @Siobhan, no worries, I hope you are enjoying your vacation. When I was doing high fat, I was not doing high carbs. I always had a history of high cholesterol, its in the family, so I always avoided egg yolks and cheeses and pretty much everything that had high cholesterol but with the Keto diet I had no choice because almost everything high fat is high cholesterol. My main source of fats was dairy, lot of cheese and moderate heavy whipping cream. I don’t ever eat pork or beef. I do some lamb. But I did use quiet a bit if half and half, about 150 ml everyday so about 5mg of carbs and 5mg sugars from that. I was also using Lakanto (Erythritol) as the sweetener to make chocolate almost every night during November and December.

Apart from this my only carb source was from veggies (Broccoli, Zucchini, spinach, mushrooms, Kale). I eat lots of veggies so my carb count is always around 30-35 g. I did consume Cacao and pecans so there is another source of carbs.

As I had mentioned there were two times, for 3-4 days that I got kicked out of ketosis because I was on vacation and I was on sugar and sweets but at that time I was not consuming high fats.

On the day of the blood test, I had fasted for at least 12 hours. I don’t do coffee with butter ever.

Does any of the above correlates with my high cholesterol numbers.?

(Siobhan) #14

I wonder if their might have been some carb creep or you were having a bad reaction to the sweetener. If possible, I would suggest tracking everything for a week or two and see what comes up, or cut the sweetener and see if that helps. Without any overly long or too short fasting period before the test it is probably a case of too many carbs. The high triglycerides are an indication that you have energy that isnt getting used, and @daveketo has commented this tends to be due to eating more carbs than you think you are on accident

Do you think this might be the issue?

(Vincent Hall) #15

Any update here? I’m in a similar boat so to speak and searching for any clues as to how to lower my trigs.
\v/

(Siobhan) #16

Yes — if it helps, since posting that I’ve learned in-depth that sources of inflammation (e.g. internal damage, even if minor), and insulin resistance can also raise triglycerides. If your other inflammation markers are higher (ferritin, hs-crp, plus insulin) it may indicate that’s an area to look at.
Assuming the test was originally fasted, no coffee, etc

(Vincent Hall) #17

Interesting, I damaged a shoulder early Feb, tore tendon and it’s still giving me problems.
It’s slowly getting better but real slow.
So this injury and consequential repair by my body could be adding to my Trig count?
Also I walk 5 miles a day usually, do some light weights at home 3 - 4 times a week. Body needs to repair after exercise as well, should I be exercising in the week/s before the test or relax somewhat?
\v/

(Siobhan) #18

It is certainly a possibility - triglycerides going up appears to be a part of the acute phase response, just like hs-CRP going up, etc. Tissue damage like a shoulder injury could cause inflammatory signalling (part of the healing process) and if it is a certain type of signalling it can, in theory, result in high triglycerides. I could speculate on why this is - likely to increase the amount of eventual LDL in the system that can be used for repair/rebuilding. I don’t know that for sure, just speculation.
One thing to do is just to get another test done in a few months and see if it has gone down, and also journal how your shoulder is feeling and see if the results line up at all.
My triglycerides went up when I got sick (another initiator of the acute phase response) and went back down when I got better.

Probably the reason triglycerides associate with heart disease, etc, is because in that case it’s a signal there’s chronic damage (progressively getting worse) of the heart. If it is a transitional thing like when getting sick or injured the only thing it’d signal is that you got injured or sick and then got better.

So, I would say re-test when the shoulder is a bit better and see what happens to your trigs.

As for exercise, typically in endurance athletes or even resistance trainers, their triglycerides tend to be lower. They are probably just relying on the LDL they already have (sometimes their LDL can be a bit lower). I think it is more of larger injuries and illness where TG can increase (of course I’m sure there are more situations than that, but just heavy exercise should not cause it afaik).

(Vincent Hall) #19

Thanks for your insight.
regarding the exercise, I was unsure whether one should exercise as normal in the 3 days prior to the fasting test doing Dave Feldman’s protocol.
\v/

(Siobhan) #20

If doing the two-part protocol, it can mess things up because it lowers LDL! He has a post on this here:

And has seen people who exercise during the protocol and don’t see a proper drop due to exercising while attempting it.

If doing the protocol, ease off exercise for about a week before the test. If getting a normal blood draw done do the same (or at least a few days) as it can confound other results (hs-CRP, among others).