The lymphatic system & ketogenesis: "dieter's edema" and swooshes

dietersedema
lymphology
lymphaticsystem
effleurage
swooshes

#1

The life processes in the body are amazing aren’t they? For example, the water & salt processes via the LCHF/ketogenic way of eating and fasting.

It’s a fact that the body fat may have times of more “wateriness” or “squishiness” before a new level of leanness is revealed. Water retention can be a protective process for the body’s changes. Meanwhile, all this is happening within a context of monthly lunar cycles which give the world’s oceans its high tides and low tides and affect the watery human body as well.

Once I embarked on Intermittent Fasting, the ‘water filtration processes’ sped up significantly, and water retention became less obvious and “swooshes” (water releases from fat cells) seem to happen more efficiently or with greater frequency.

Non-scale victories: All of the above is usually more obvious via measurements than on a weight scale, especially if you’re not obese or if you’re also adding resistance training for increasing muscle mass - in which case we may see very little change on a weight scale, though having a huge recomposition!

Doing some research, I learned that there’s an official thing called “dieter’s edema” and really that there’s a ton of stuff going on at a cellular level in relationship to sodium and inflammation (sometimes that inflammation may be from strength training, the breakdown of muscle cells to build them, etc). As Dr. Phinney has pointed out in recent lectures, though sodium excess is blamed, it is far more likely that sodium deficiency is the real issue. He recommends 2-3 grams a day and even says that up to 5 grams is safer than not enough!

So - water and salt work together in synchrony to help the body cope with recomposition, and this affects many things such as as assimilation & elimination - as pointed out on many threads in this forum.

The realm of “lymphology” is fascinating (Dr. Corwin Samuel West was a pioneer of it in the 1960s in the western world - and eastern sciences of ayurveda and chinese medicine had many, and even more, ways of naming bodily processes and cellular transformation). In western science language, plasma proteins get trapped/held in the interstitial spaces due to inflammation - therefore an anti-inflammation way of eating & fasting such as ketogenic meals and intermittent fasting is as much a lymphatic process as a fat loss process.

Also, I remembered that light-touch large movements/effleurage lymphatic self-massage activates the lymph system and is also reflexively relaxing - easy to do on the belly. Accompanied with deep breathing it’s apparently facilitative. According to the lymphology crowd, it assists the flushing or swooshing of adipose tissue. (Effleurage is totally different than “lymphatic massage” done by a practitioner on the lymph nodes of the body btw).

Water molecules play a HUGE part in attracting proteins and moving fats out. Nurse Cindy’s great short video about this is what got me started researching it a bit more - https://youtu.be/xF3rmi4DJAw


Looking For Pointers/Words Of Advice/Etc
#2

Thanks for the link. I’d not yet discovered Nurse Cindy. She’s great! A mature woman doing keto who has ‘been there’ herself.


(KCKO, KCFO) #3

Wow, she is awesome. I liked this one a lot, it is about why we stall, the scales aren’t moving.


(Jeanne Wagner) #4

Thanks for this post and sharing her video. Very informative. I love her visual props!! Sometimes people can retain the information better that way.


(Jeanne Wagner) #5

Yes I love her too. Will have to start following her.


(Melissa Marie) #6

I have actually felt like I was retaining water more times than not. I read a while back that with keto the body looses a lot of water weight initially, but I was not sure about what happened afterward once the system started to get used to using fat as fuel. I have to wonder if this edema is worse for women than men especially with our cycles. This is great info @SlowBurnMary! I wish I would have stumbled on to it sooner. I have had issues with inflammation for some time. This makes lots of sense! Now off to learn more about lymphatic self-massage. :+1:


#7

Effleurage and Ginger supplementation is a winning combo. Ginger is such a powerful anti-inflammatory and circulation enhancer, as well as all the other things it does! Everything in it’s own time. :slight_smile: :herb:

“The only thing constant in the world is Change.” ~ India Arie


(Jo) #8

Thanks that is great info. I used to use a lot of ginger but have not used it a lot lately. Do you use ginger powder or fresh ginger, and how does this measure up in the carb count?


#9

I use dry Ginger capsules for a standardized dosage (4 caps a day is 2.2gm of Ginger, and neglible carbs - like 1-2 per dose, however since its action is to reduce insulin spikes, it basically cancels any carb effect affect as far as I can tell). I’m 52 and plan to supplement w/ Ginger for prob the rest of my life - as it’s such a superfood.

I also eat fresh Ginger in cuisine whenever I can - when my lifestyle is such that I can cook a lot, there’s nothing like the aroma of some sauteed golden diced onions with fresh shredded Ginger added (I also love adding some chopped green chilli). I like the way Ginger perfumes my house nearly as much as I like its medicine <3


#10

I just purchased more ginger this morning. I use it in my apple cider vinegar concoction. I was able to find some ginger root that was beginning to grow, so will try to plant some.

A toast to Nurse Cindy!