Strict KETO/Carnivore + OMAD - Looking for analysis / tips

(Sid) #1

Hey y’all!

Hope everyone is doing well!

So I’ve just started KETO/Carnivore diet + OMAD(One Meal A Day) and was wondering if I’m doing everything correctly and if there are any improvements I can implement.

So since I’m on these very strict diets I only eat one meal per day and that meal currently only consists of Minced Beef or Chicken and I only eat about 1 lb/500 grams a meal.
I’ve in the past 2 days also started to incorporate Tea which I add about 1,5 Tbs of MCT C8 oil to.
This also means I’m fasting 23 hours of the day.

I started last week and weight was 273 lbs / 124 kg(6ft 2in / 190 cm) and in the first week I’ve lost 11.6 lbs / 5.3 kg in weight and I contribute most of that to initial water weight being shed as a part of depleting carbohydrate stores.

I’ve bought Ketostix which I’ve read are not entirely reliable but my first test came out to 4/5 on the scale so if I trust that I should be in Ketosis.

I’ve watched youtube and read the internet but I have not come across anyone doing it as “extreme” as I am doing.

I do take supplements and vitamins(Vitamin C, Vitamin D, Magnesium, Zink, Active Coal and MCT C8 Oil).

I’ve experienced that my mood is much more stable, I’m just “zen” all the time.
Also experienced better sleep, less stress, better ability to focus.

I do have hunger almost all the time but I have a strong will and it does not bother me too much, right now atleast.

So my questions are as follows:

  1. Are there any obvious errors I’m making that will either slow weight loss or hurt me in any way?

  2. Will this strict diet / fasting still make weight loss slower after first couple of weeks?

  3. Should I be taking any other Vitamins or Supplements if going at this?

  4. I use some mixed spices when eating minced beef - is that really an issue? I’ve read that you should stay away from those and mix your own but is it really that important?

  5. I do have some KETO/Carnivore recipe cheat meals but I don’t want to use those on set dates / weight goals, but rather use them for when I get really sick of the current foods I’m eating. Should I continue this mindset or is “rewards” important?

Thankful for any input!

Cheers,
Sid

(Geoffrey) #2

You are not doing anything extreme from your explanation. Nearly everyone I know who is carnivore, including me, eat only animal fat, meat, salt and water. That’s just basic carnivore.
The obvious error I’m seeing is that you are hungry all the time. If that’s the case then you aren’t eating enough. You didn’t say anything about eating fat and that’s the mainstay of eating this way. You should be getting most of your calories from fat. It’s what fuels us. You should be eating plenty of fat with every meal and eating until you are completely full and satiated. Meaning, eat until it doesn’t taste good anymore.
I personally don’t find this WOE to be strict at all. In fact it’s been the most freeing and easy diet if ever experienced. I eat as much as I want, whenever I want and it’s all food that I love.
Vitamins, I don’t see the need for the C, zinc or active coal but if it makes you feel better then go ahead
Your weight loss should not slow down but may actually pick up as you become fat adaptive but you will experience plateaus but just remember that a few days at the same weight is not a plateau but just your body adjusting.
Some people seem to do good taking electrolytes to help them for a supplement.
Spices are less bad as long as they don’t have and sugars, starches or seed oils in them but in the beginning you really should just stick with salt and butter in your meat. I’ve found that the longer I’m carnivore the better my food tastes so I don’t really need much in the way of spices.
In my opinion to think about “cheat meals” means you really aren’t dedicated to eating properly to get metabolically healthy. You may only be setting yourself up for failure.
When you eat for nutrition and not pleasure then the food doesn’t get boring because you are only eating it for it’s nutrients. Yes you can enjoy it but your focus is on what it’s doing for your body and health.
You are only limited to your imagination when it comes to eating a variety of food.
I eat a large variety of meats cooked in various ways and it’s never boring.
Don’t look at this as a diet but more of lifestyle. Diets come and go but lifestyles rarely change.
I don’t eat a carnivore diet…I am carnivore.

(Alec) #3
  1. I think you are eating too little. I would eat 2 meals a day and eat each time until you are comfortably stuffed. I would do more beef than chicken. Chicken is OK as a bit of something different, but it doesn’t have the nutrient profile of beef.
  2. Your current regime is OK, but my experience is that you will find it tough long term. My recommendation is you slow down a bit, and do 2 meals a day and don’t allow yourself to get hungry. Note that this diet is not focussed on calories… what we are doing is managing our hormones well (specifically insulin) to allow bodyfat burning and discourage fat storage.
  3. If you eat lots of fatty meat and salt, you should not need any supplements.
  4. I am carni, and I occasionally use a curry spice mix, but not often (once every 3 weeks). End of the day, our compromises on carni are all personal preferences. This is a volume game: anything is OK in very small quantities (apart maybe from strychnine! :joy::joy:), but don’t be eating loads of plants/carbs thinking they are OK: they aren’t.
  5. I would avoid treats/rewards completely. Don’t plan them or expect them. Just don’t do them. I would try to get some variety in early so you can avoid any boredom issue. Eat pork, lamb, turkey, fish, eggs, bacon, butter, pork skin/crackling, cheese, cream, anything animal based. No plants (if you want to be carni).

You are doing fine right now, but your primary goal should be consistency… don’t sprint for 2 months and then fall off. Take is easy, go slow, but do this for 12 months minimum. You will lose your excess weight. You are where I was when I started. I am now 190lbs, and I am still carni after 26 months, and feeling excellent.

Good luck, and pls stay around on these forums: massive amount of great knowledge here. You got a problem? Someone on here has had it before and knows what to do.
Take care
Alec

(Alec) #4

Oooh, I love this. 100% spot on. I’ve never thought about it like that, but this is where I am. I tell people (who ask) “I am a carnivore”. They often haven’t a clue what that means, but I explain if they ask.

Geezy, I didn’t read your answer before I wrote mine, but I also love the essential consistency between our answers. Agree with all your points. :+1:

(Sid) #5

Thank you so much for the input!

Will definately take this in consideration!

And I didn’t mean to say this was strict or extreme in a braggy way - I just meant that most peaople I’ve read about who do OMAD eat whatever they way in that one meal and moste carnivore people eat multiple times a day. I should’ve just typed it out.

I will throw the cheat meals away and just focus on getting used to eating like this and making sure I’m full at the end of the meal.

Cheers

(Sid) #6

Hey and thanks for the response!

I will absolutely take this in consideration.

Some of the vitamins / supplements are for my mental health, I’ve lived with extreme stress and anxiety for about 3 years but it’s actually magically completely gone after I started this lifestyle :wink: and that’s what motivates me the most.

But will make a few changes based on the answers.

Try to eat with just Salt in the beginning.
Do a bigger variety of foods as you said.
I’m going to keep eating once a day but perhaps step the porton size up so that I actually feel full at the end of the meal. Although if I notice that I still get hungry after a while I might drop down to 16:8 fasting and throw in another meal.

Thanks, and ofcourse I will stay around - this seems like a super nice knowledge base with cool people! :blush:

Cheers

(Alec) #7

Sid
This is the most important thing you’ve said. This is crucial. More important than weight loss. So, you feeling better from stress and anxiety should be your highest priority. Do whatever it takes. I have been there… I didn’t know about diet affecting mood back then but I do now.

In case you don’t know, there is a fantastic doctor who analyses mental health and diet. Dr Chris Palmer… if you haven’t read his book, it comes highly recommended. Many keto doctors say this guy is THE guy on mental health and diet.

https://www.amazon.com.au/dp/1637741588?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_dp_R2JY538ZJRNWHABXKV8K

Also there is another excellent doctor, Dr Georgia Ede, who you can search in YouTube…. Many vids with her in. Lots and lots of plain sensible talk.

(Sid) #8

I couldn’t agree more!
I was wondering so much why I suddenly just felt… calm and okay with my life. After some research and talks with my therapist I realized just how big of an impact my old diet had on my mental wellness.

And you’re right, this should be my main cause for doing this even though if it started out as a weight loss journey.

I’ll definitely take a look on your tips! Thanks again!

#9

Ouch, I don’t think you have enough fat to pull off an extreme calorie deficit… I would eat MUCH more. (Okay, I couldn’t not to but wouldn’t want to either.)

Your questions…

  1. The very low amount of food…
  2. Considering the water weight loss, sure. You definitely don’t want to lose 5kg a week (not even… 2kg? some people can pull that off longer term but the ones I heard about were heavier), that sounds highly unhealthy with more than minimal muscle loss, metabolism slowing etc…
  3. With a normal amount of food, carnivore OMAD sounds fine to me with zero supplements - BUT it depends on the person. I never supplement and don’t feel the need, especially not on carnivore. But I do eat enough, sometimes too much.
  4. If you feel fine with spices, go ahead. Many carnivores use spices. I use very little on carnivore because my ingredients tend to be very tasty without (that’s why I eat them to begin with :wink: bl;and meat won’t be good with any amount of spice albeit it can help. but I choose some nicely fatty, very tasty meat with salt over some bland chicken with spices on it).
  5. You know how your mind works. I don’t understand the reward thing, carni food is the tastiest (it doesn’t mean one can’t miss or desire other, similarly delicious items…), oh yeah, you eat very little. I don’t think you need that at this point. My energy need is way less than yours for sure and I can’t lose fat eating what comes naturally anymore, I need to be as strict as my hedonistic self can get - but you probably would lose just fine while not being hungry!
    And the reward is the fat-loss and the knowledge you did it anyway… Oh well, we are different, that’s why you should do what works for in our individual case.
    I am too impulsive and can’t resist temptation - but carnivore helps enough that if I have momentum, I probably can wait until the weekend if I can’t imagine not having something non-carni - anyway, weekends are the most tempting as I am not the only cook then, big shopping and relative visits are there sometimes, they are harder. So I shouldn’t mess with my easier days when it’s not weekend, no relative visit, no great non-carni meat dish cooked over open fire… It’s very logical to me, I think it over and it makes me not so unnecessarily rebellious on workdays. If I can’t stand my carni food, that’s still a problem but I have a variety so it’s not as likely as probably in your case. That is my method too, keeping up variety even if I didn’t get bored of meat yet. It may come suddenly and yes, I have my eggs and dairy items but I need meat too, in significant amount if possible. Your 500g is borderline enough for me but that’s half of my food (sometimes more, sometimes less, depends on the fat content). Many carnivores eat way more meat, of course. They need it.
(Sid) #10

Hey and thanks for the input!

I realize my meals may be to small and that I’m not getting enough fat, but I’m having trouble understanding exactly why that is a problem. Is it just to feel more full during fasting and giving me more energy or will it play a vital part in losing weight aswell?

I read somewhere that if you go to hard on low calorie deficit your body can adjust to it in negative ways such as just using less energy which I guess ultimately will cause less of a weight loss?

Cheers

(KM) #11

Hey, welcome!

Yes, that’s basically it. Our metabolisms will slow down in response to energy restriction, which means weight loss slows or stops. And if we start eating a typical number of calories again, our slow metabolism doesn’t necessarily reset itself, so we gain the weight back and then some.

I have had luck with “feasting or fasting” to avoid that, but it’s become less popular and now that I’ve been at my goal for half a year, I only do an extended fast quarterly, for health. I’m just basically … TMAD, I guess, but my first “meal” is just a huge cup of coffee with cream and beef collagen. My second meal is primarily carnivore, when I feel hungry, til I’m full.

Good luck and as they used to say, keep calm and keto on. :slightly_smiling_face:

(Sid) #12

Hey,

Thanks! :slight_smile:

Ah I see! I’ll try to add some more fat then!

What are some typical fats to add? Olive oil and butter?

(KM) #13

Butter, lard, tallow (rendered beef fat), ghee (clarified butter). Olive oil is okay but I think it’s had a lot of marketing hype. It’s not good to cook with. I avoid basically all plant oils except perhaps a little olive, coconut and avocado

#14

For some of us, going off is in evitable. My longest carni period was 2 weeks, it happened only once (with very little meat, I was determined, wow) and who knows if I will get a longer one this year? (I really hope so, I am curious even if I don’t need it.) It’s not really a problem for me as my goal isn’t long term carnivore just feeling right and eventually losing fat. And I get that from keeping my non-animal carbs pretty low on average (about zero on most days but occasional off days are quite fine as long as I drop my carbs again).
And the OP has a really strict, food restricted version, it’s not sustainable for most people, not even until they slim down.

But maybe it’s really a bad attitude, it depends on the situation. I couldn’t do something in a way where I think about and desire going off, I can’t do temporal strict diets either. I find some nice way to eat and that becomes my default. It helps a lot, I automatically eat close to carnivore unless there is some serious strong force pulling me into some direction. And nothing can keep me away for long. So some level of commitment is probably needed. Full commitment is great but some of us just can’t reach those heights and maybe don’t even want to - but it’s good not to decide about those things, we may change enough that we will be able to do what we can’t even imagine now. (I always thought I never will give up vegetables… I was wrong. Oh well. I feel better without them and I don’t mean physically.) So it’s important not to limit our thinkings too much - but we should be realistic to some level. Optimism (I have too much of it) made me go off too many times.

I eat for both. Joy from eating is a MAJOR enjoyment source for me and I don’t plan to give it up ever. I don’t think my personality allows big enough changes for that to happen. I would do almost anything before I would try to eat for fuel only… But my affordable carnivore food gives me the most joy (if I use my favs and a nice enough variety but of course I do, maximizing joy is priority #2 after health and feeling well) so I am lucky in that regard.

I realized boring food may mean different things. When I say I get bored of meat, it’s not just that I don’t find it particularly tempting, merely very tasty (as taste doesn’t change much in my case, no matter my actual state). I don’t like that wording but others may say they get sick of meat. It’s not just no joy, I have such days occasionally, that’s tolerable, I enjoy the hell out of my food on other days… No, it’s not being able to eat. Once I forced it despite it’s very much not my style and I started gagging, I just couldn’t eat that meat anymore. I enjoyed it for many bites, that’s it, I need something else. Variety is important for some of us, it’s not mere extra joy, it’s needed not to go off. And going off wouldn’t be good either as I don’t want plants, just not that kind of meat in front of me.
It’s normal not to be content with one single type of meat and nothing else. If we add carni items, it’s still carnivore but better for us who need variety - but I experienced that I can’t wait for meat boredom as at that point I am bored of all carni food or maybe of all food in existence. It’s not fun when one is very hungry. So some of us better never try some super strict diet. It wouldn’t end well. Maybe later but not right away.
I am totally for trying to eat some different carni food first when bored. It just may be too late at that point. If a strict diet probably results in going off, it may be better to make it less strict but if one knows that one off day per month will work fine, that may be better, it depends. I prefer the former - but if we are too relaxed, that can backfire. Eating ALL the carni food we may desire can be a super bad idea but some extra rules on carnivore doesn’t meat we need to give up variety.
I imagine most carnivores would get bored of 2 kinds of mincemeat only…

Low-key starvation isn’t good for your metabolism. You need much energy for your body to function well and you may not get enough from your tiny food and your bodyfat. IDK if 500g meat can gives you all the necessary nutrients, meat is pretty good at that and you supplement a little…
But you are HUNGRY. It’s not pleasant and as we know you eat little, it sounds very logical to eat more and feel no hunger. It’s almost certain you still would lose fat at a very nice pace and your metabolism will stay okay. Undereating works against you.

So eating more would be good in various ways.

If you do carnivore, definitely not the former.
I use little added fat as my ingredients can be as fatty as I want them to be. But I do use butter and lard when I need to. Butter even when I don’t need to but fancy to eat some :wink:

(Sid) #15

Low-key starvation isn’t good for your metabolism. You need much energy for your body to function well and you may not get enough from your tiny food and your bodyfat. IDK if 500g meat can gives you all the necessary nutrients, meat is pretty good at that and you supplement a little…
But you are HUNGRY. It’s not pleasant and as we know you eat little, it sounds very logical to eat more and feel no hunger. It’s almost certain you still would lose fat at a very nice pace and your metabolism will stay okay. Undereating works against you.
So eating more would be good in various ways.

Thanks for the input, I just need to change my mindset I think, I wanted as fast as possible results but reading this I understand that what I’m doing would probly act against that.

If you do carnivore, definitely not the former.
I use little added fat as my ingredients can be as fatty as I want them to be. But I do use butter and lard when I need to. Butter even when I don’t need to but fancy to eat some :wink:

Duh… of course! I brainfarted about the olive oil :laughing:

Cheers

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #16

Not eating enough food will slow weight loss, as the body lowers the metabolic rate to compensate for the lack of intake. If you are going to eat only one meal a day, be sure it’s enough food.

If you are eating a healthy diet, supplements should be unnecessary, unless you have some sort of condition that requires them. But by definition, “healthy diet” means that the vast majority of people don’t need supplements while eating that way. Beef provides all the essential amino acids in the correct proportions and enough of all the vitamins and minerals we require, that people can live healthily on beef and water alone. Recent research has shown that the vitamins in meat come in a form that is more easily assimilated than many forms that occur in plant foods or in pill form.

Most people on a carnivore diet find that it changes their relationship with food. Food stops being so much about taste and becomes more about providing nutrition to the body.

Carnivore is not actually monotonous, and I find I can eat the same foods, mostly beef and eggs, for many meals in succession without getting tired of them. If I’m hungry, the food is tasty; when it stops being tasty, I stop eating and save any leftovers for later.

(KM) #17

I’m going to paraphrase something @Geezy56 likes to say. “As a carnivore I’d like to welcome you to the tribe. Light the fire, toast the beast and be happy.” (He says ‘burn the beast’. I like toast the beast, because it’s got a double meaning. Yay, Beasts!)

#18

If you are so determined, there is extended fasting… You can get some quicker results with some here and there… You even may have much less hunger there. But there is nothing wrong with 0.5-1kg fat-loss a week. That’s a decent fat-loss if you ask me. Or almost anyone who knows what is realistic under normal circumstances.

(Sid) #19

Yea I’ve read about that too, at the moment I’ve changed the meals up a bit, added some more fat since almost everyone pointed out that I’m eating too small meals and not enough fat and I instantly felt more full and didn’t even finish the meal, that was yesterday around 5pm and it’s curently 7:40 am and I’m still full. So I think I’m sort of going in the right direction!

Might try extended fasting but at the moment I don’t feel the need, since Friday I’ve lost another 0.6 kg in weight, thank’s for the tip though! :blush:

(Robin) #20

Happy to hear this! It’s common to gradually and naturally slip into intermittent fasting without meaning to. No reason to force it when everything is going well, in my experience.