Strange question about lactose intolerance

(Edith) #22

It could be as simple as lactose or it could be a reaction to the proteins in dairy. I can’t handle any diary, it gives me itchy rashes and painful joints. Unfortunately, it’s not the lactose. You might want to consider stopping ALL diary and see if that helps. If it does, slowly add lower lactose items back in first and see how you feel with them.

#23

Just eliminating all dairy is a pretty serious and potentially useful thing :slight_smile:
Something I couldn’t do but I have no problems with lactose either.
I am impressed I manage to keep my dairy intake low this week! But with the right motivation and lovely other food, no dairy is possible for most of us I imagine… Just for a while to see what happens.

Oh I forgot my SO and I did a lactose free year (except very rare occasions). That was easy but we had plenty of other items to eat and we kept zero carb cheese… My SO probably couldn’t survive without cheese…

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #24

That is certainly possible. The human genetic default is to become lactose-intolerant at some point between weaning and adulthood. This is true of all mammals, in fact. If you do not have one of the mutations to allow you to continue producting lactase in adulthood, then you will have trouble with lactose.

On the other hand, however, many people who tolerate lactose can be sensitive to one or more of the milk proteins, which is a separate issue. Try going without dairy products for thirty days, and see what happens.

Butter/ghee and heavy cream, being almost entirely fat, may not give you trouble, but that is apparently not a guarantee.

(Edith) #25

Yup! I can’t handle any of them. :cry:

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #26

Typical of me to start this experiment in an odd way. So yesterday I ate cream, cheese and much lactose.
More I would normally eat. During the night I’ve had pain, bloating, gas etc. Today was like an explosion!
Sadly I can’t rely on this, my experiment has been confused by getting Covid, not a mild version so far.

(KM) #27

Eeergh, sorry for the Covid! Get well!!!

I’d still say this is a pretty good indicator that Peter and Dairy are not a match made in heaven, but as you say, it could be covid-related. Maybe to be potentially kinder to yourself, cut out all dairy until you’re healed up, just in case it’s the culprit?

(Robin) #28

Yikes!
Tell Covid to play nice.
And maybe skip the experimentation till she’s gone.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #29

Given that lactose is made from glucose and galactose, I’d avoid it simply because I’d want to spend my carb allowance on other things.

Of course, these days my carb allowance is pretty much 0 g. . . . :bacon:

If one were able to eat dairy without a protein reaction, then the best dairy to consume is heavy cream and hard, aged cheeses, because they are mostly, if not entirely, sugar-free.

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #30

It was like giving up drink and smoking. The thought of quitting makes you want it even more. Ha Ho tomorrow I’ll start with no lactose. With or without Covid.
I’ve still no idea if my reaction was Lactose or Covid related.

#31

Meanwhile I can’t imagine a better thing to spend my non-egg, non-liver carbs (those aren’t much nowadays) on :wink: Dairy is awesome :heart_eyes:
And too fatty and non-satiating so I am careful with them. But I can afford some :smiley:

It’s another matter my fav dairy at the moment is butter… I still like all the others as well. Variety is important. And different dairy items have different roles though they overlap a bit.
I don’t think I would horribly miss any of my dairy items now (I would miss them a lot but couldn’t live without them) - but I need them for variety. I probably could skip them for a while if I had a wide variety of meats and seafood… Or at least plants…? I can’t live on my few meat options and eggs only. I can do a TINY dairy just not zero. Maybe later I will try it again, I do love my experiments. My no dairy carnivore experiments always ended after 1-2 days in the past.

I am looking forward to your experiences, @Pjam! Do you keep harder, zero carb cheese and ghee and skip the other items in the near future at least?

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #32

So, I’ve been experimenting and studying. And yes, I do have a problem with dairy, and I emphasise Dairy NOT Lactose!
Yes, there is a difference and that has been confusing me. I can eat dairy with little or no lactose and suffer in the same way as if I’d had high lactose foods.
So, bottom line is there’s Lactose intolerance and Dairy intolerance… they are different. Someone here may know the science but that’s not me … I wish it was.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #33

Lactose intolerance results from ceasing to produce the enzyme lactase at some point between weaning and adulthood. This is the default for all mammals on earth including the human race. The fact that some adult people can handle lactose is the result of at least two mutations, one among the Maasai, the other among Northern Europeans.

What you have is a sensitivity to one of the milk proteins, most likely casein. As you say, that is a distinct problem from lactose-intolerance.

(Edith) #34

The other milk protein is whey. I have troubles from both. Be careful reading labels, particularly for foods with seasonings. Some seasonings contain whey powder.

Also, when you first give up a food to which your body is allergic or has an intolerance, it becomes hypersensitive to the offending substance. You may find once you stop dairy, if you accidentally or on purpose have a tiny amount, your body will over react.

After your body heals from removing the dairy, if it is an intolerance, you may find you can have a tiny bit and be okay and not react, but if you overdo it, then you have problems.

After my seven month carnivore trial a few years ago, I am now able to eat a tiny amount of dairy (like a half ounce of hard cheese or a spoonful or two of yogurt, we’re still not talking a lot here) and not be crippled the following day. But, a tiny amount two days in a row, is too much. The nice thing is that the carnivore trial bought me the ability to make a mistake and not be in pain.

(Bob M) #35

That’s me - “Northern” European. 99.8% European and 7X% Eastern European, where the X changes every once in a while.

(Bob M) #36

Yikes, as always, everything is complex:

I do have A/G at rs4988235, which according to this, means I can digest lactose:

It’s quite complex, though.

(Rossi Luo) #37

After reading the below study ( 2.4. Oral Glucose Tolerance Tests), I realized that eating glucose in ketogenic diet can make one’s blood glucose higher than the people who are not in ketogenic diet in the first 240 minutes, therefore may we deduce that eating lactose in ketogenic diet would also do the same thing?

(B Creighton) #38

I quit drinking milk when I was in my early 20s because I began to get bad breath. I reasoned I had become lactose intolerant, and sure enough, my bad breath went away. However, I kept eating yogurt because the cultures eat the lactose. I now eat raw goat milk yogurt I make, and presume is very low in lactose, and what it does have is probably offset with included lactase.

As to your question, yes, without the lactase, you are going to get less lactose breakdown into glucose and galactose, but your gut microbiome is still going to break down some of that lactose in your lower intestines and feed on it, so I really don’t know how much you are going to absorb. Maybe someone with blood glucose meter will have a better idea.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #39

The problem with a lack of lactase is not that we can’t digest lactose, but that our intestinal bacteria can. So if the lactose passes through the small intestine, the bacteria in the large intestine get it and produce methane from it. That methane has to pass out of the digestive tract somehow, in one direction or the other, and it can cause pain along the way.

Interestingly, the methane people produce from eating an improper diet is not accounted for in environmentallists’ concerns about greenhouse gasses. . . . :man_shrugging: