Strange fasting experience

[KetoSnaps]

I take thyroid hormones and was wondering also if anybody had a healing effect of Keto on the antibodies against the thyroid? Some anti-inflammatory effect?Because it felt like I was overdosed.

I’m post-radioiodine and am on Levothyroxine. Since starting keto my dose has been adjusted downwards twice - the last time was last month. I had noticed symptoms of overactivity for a while coming up to it. Interestingly since I reduced my thyroxine intake I haven’t been needing to take as much insulin (am T1D). BUT in my experience thyroid over/underdosing takes a while - many weeks - to become apparent - not overnight. So I don’t know if your hyperness is directly thyroid related - maybe it’s that keto high that I’ve read about? Don’t know, though!

[David_Stilley]

I did a whole day fast with zero effort! And I felt wonderful and energetic. Weirdly energetic. So energetic that when i turned out my lights to go to sleep at midnight, I tossed and turned the whole night. I got up finally and went downstairs at 3:30 and messed around watching TV or on the internet. I think I finally fell asleep on the sofa at 5am for 2 hours. And when I got up, my heart was racing too

You described the fasting high which many fat adapted people experience when fasting, myself included.

So at around 9 I figured maybe if I ate something I might feel better- so I had some scrambled eggs. They did help for a while, but I just did NOT feel good.

This is often my experience post fasting as well. The idea of food is much more appealing than the actual feeling of eating that first meal post fast. Many report the same on this too. I did a 96 hour fast easily when I tried it, I felt better before I ate again even though I was genuinely hungry. Start lighter than eggs breaking a fast is my suggestion. And just a few bites and some broth is a good way to break, if you’re feeling great an hour later a semi light meal is next.

[Chantarella]

@David_Stilley
It is very comforting to know that what happened to me happened to you all too. So I guess this was fat adaptation- how exciting. Racing heart too? Eating anything just made my heart beat slow down, And I just dont get that. What I am saying is that the eggs actually made me feel BETTER. Go figure???
@KetoSnaps
I just had my blood checked and my thyroid was well adjusted. That would be 2 weeks ago. Hard to imagine that my thyroid could have changed in just 2 weeks? But it definitely crossed my mind.
@amwassil I dont think it was blood glucose. But who knows with all the new things happening to my body.

[Teb_Tengri]

“As for cor- tisol, both plasma epinephrine and norepinephrine concentrations fluctuated in a circadian rhythm with increases at about 5:30-8:30 PM and decreases at about 2:30-5:30 AM every day (Fig. 7). The 24-h mean levels of plasma epinephrine increased significantly from 8.4 3.7 (SE) ng/l the first day to 15.2 6.5 ng/l the second day (P 0.005) and to 20.9 6.7 ng/l the third day (P 0.001). Likewise, the 24-h mean levels of norepinephrine rose significantly from 115.6 30.6 ng/l the first day to 130.6 32.0 ng/l the second day”

The circadian decrease around 0530 even when fasted might explain your ability to sleep at 0700 and as others have said, this is the fasting/keto high.

SOURCE:

(PDF) Reference intervals for glucose, β-cell polypeptides, and...

[Chantarella]

and I actually thought that being fat adapted means BETTER sleep. Oh well.

[amwassil]

@Chantarella you may find the following interesting and related. I’ve been keto for 3+ years, in ketosis 99% of the time, and pretty well fat adapted.

Glucose Response to a 12-Hour Overnight Fast

2020/03/12-13 17 hour fast Fasted from 16:15 - 09:15. Went to bed at 00:15 and got up at 08:00. [2020-03-12-13-IF-plot] 03/12 15:45 - 16:15 Secondary meal 03/13 09:15 - 10:15 Keto coffee This was an interesting experience. My eating was disrupted due to my work schedule (11:30 - 20:00) which did not give me time for a second meal before work and got me home too late for another meal then. So I decided to start the fast as of the end of my meal at work, which I finished about 16:15. You c…

[Chantarella]

@amwassil
Could you give me a short summary of what you are trying to tell me? That I was in ketosis all night long and this is a new thing? Or that my blood glucose was behaving erratically? I am not only wondering why I was awake all night long, but also the racing heart I got with this hyper feeling like I was on steroids. Are you saying that this is ketosis or that this is hypoglycaemia? I don’t get the point you are trying to make. Please explain in less technical terms.

[amwassil]

@Chantarella I’m just throwing it out as information that may or may not be related to your experience. It seems like it very well might be. Although I’ve been keto for 3+ years and I generally IF for 8-10 hours most but not all nights, this was my first 17 hour experiment. It was also unusual in that I actually started the fast mid-afternoon while I was at work and physically active. I did not get home again until after 9pm, already 5 hours into the fast and it would be 3 more hours before I went to bed.

This is different from my previous fasts which all started in the evening. On work days, that was after I got home from work and usually had an evening meal. On the previous fasts I had no issues sleeping normally. I generally awaken periodically during the night, so that’s not unusual and I just decided that since I’m awake anyway I may as well measure glucose. But last night was different because I was pretty much wide awake from about 3 am on. In addition, my glucose remained lower than previously right up until I actually got out of bed to start the day at 8 am. That’s why I decided to check my BrAce at 7 am. I suspected it might be higher than my normal at that time of day and it was. So that’s why I suspect I was more awake much of the night.

No, keto does not necessarily interfere with one’s sleep. It never did mine until last night. The only thing different was I was further along in the fast than previously, very low glucose so maybe my metabolism decided to ramp up ketones to take up the slack. Possibly.

The fat-fueled brain: unnatural or advantageous?

[Chantarella]

@amwassil
Never had a problem sleeping doing 18/6 either. This was a full day fast - my first extended fast. I got up and skipped all meals that day and went to bed. So you can add the night to it also. 2 nights! And I felt so hyper BEFORE I went to bed- like full of energy. So I don’t know if this pertains.
It might have been my thyroid. For those who are interested- my thyroid healed once due to psychotherapy. I finally got in touch with my deep rage against my mother and yelled my heart out- and my thyroid began to heal after that. I was then overdosed. I got off all thyroid meds for maybe 5 years, and then it returned, sadly. Now I have been on thyroid hormones for decades and I can live with a pill every morning. But I am just saying that I know it IS possible for a thyroid to heal, even though the professor of endocrinology told me my thyroid was burned out and would never recover.

[atomicspacebunny]

And I felt wonderful and energetic. Weirdly energetic. So energetic that when i turned out my lights to go to sleep at midnight, I tossed and turned the whole night. I got up finally and went downstairs at 3:30 and messed around watching TV or on the internet.

I think about it like this, you are hunting at night, I’m persuaded by insight and anthropology that human circadian cycle is designed to hunt at night when food is scarce.

But refined grains and sugars slow me down and make me feel paralyzed almost as if my nervous system is drugged.

[timebuster]

Somehow this made sense

[Chantarella]

@atomicspacebunny

“I`m persuaded by insight and anthropology that human circadian cycle is designed to hunt at night when food is scarce.”

How does this make any sense? Why would a prehistoric human hunt at night when it is dark, they cannot see, and most animals are in their burrows or hiding? Or when food is scarce? It really makes little sense for humans to hunt at night. Its not like they have night vision. So I don’t get that.

[atomicspacebunny]

How does this make any sense?

I guess you would have to read more about it?

Why would a prehistoric human hunt at night when it is dark, they cannot see, and most animals are in their burrows or hiding?

Behavior of animals in response to human activity, animals retreat farther away, so the only way to catch up to them is at night while hiding in their burrows…lol

Or when food is scarce?

Food can’t be scarce for ancient humans?

When food is scarce biologically (fasted state) cortisol and adrenaline over power insulin (why you could not sleep).

It really makes little sense for humans to hunt at night. Its not like they have night vision. So I don’t get that.

Ibid.

[Chantarella]

@atomicspacebunny
I don’t think you make much sense. Sorry. Humans were built to SLEEP at night. Even cavemen didn’t go hunting at night.

[atomicspacebunny]

Since nothing makes any sense to you I apologize for responding to your post and will refrain from any future replies.

Have a wonderful day!

[amwassil]

@Chantarella Thyroid introduces complexities. In addition to the below, I would add that a lot of stuff can be affected and triggered by things you least expect, not just weight which was my dad’s biggest issue.

Can you be Keto and get really fat?

@GME @Shinita As a younger man my dad had hyperthoroidism. No matter what or how much he ate he could not gain weight. He was and looked emaciated. He received the standard ‘treatment’ of the day, which was to irradiate his thyroid sufficiently to burn it into a lump of charcoal. That ‘fixed’ it alright. From then on no matter what nor how little he ate he gained weight. Quantity didn’t matter; calories didn’t matter. He suffered the next 50 years growing steadily more obese, got T2D and CVD. He…

[Chantarella]

yes- thyroid is complex.

[PaulL]

and I actually thought that being fat adapted means BETTER sleep. Oh well.

A lot of people find that they need much less sleep on a ketogenic diet. Go by how you feel, not by how many hours you spend sleeping. If you feel refreshed and energetic after only five hours’ sleep, then you are doing fine.

[Chantarella]

@PaulL
I usually don’t feel refreshed. When I fasted and felt so hyper- I felt exhausted while hyper and would have loved some sleep. But it has been years since I got an 8 hr night. I think the body actually does need 8 hours, even though we oftentimes get less.

[planes]

My first post is an answer to your question I came across on a search I was doing. The reason your system went a little loopy is probably because fasting depletes minerals and electrolytes. You were probably low on potassium and maybe the other ones too. Whenever you do a fast, always take electrolytes and minerals. Salt, potassium, calcium, magnesium and trace if you can.