So sick while fasting

(Amy) #1

So, I haven’t been here in a while. After following strict keto for several months, I transitioned into moderate keto/paleo (going into ketosis often, but not always). This went great until the holiday season, when I started eating sugar again. I’ve decided to go strict keto again for a couple weeks and then transition back into moderate keto. I’ve never had a weight or severe metabolic issue, so keeping my carbs at around 100 grams/day actually is when I feel my best.

To help me get back on the horse, I decided to fast for a couple days. At around hour 30, I felt very nauseous, dizzy and shaky, and was sweating profusely. My breath smelled like skunk. I tried going to the kitchen, but kept getting on all fours, in fear of passing out. I ate a salt/potasium tablet and went back to bed. In the morning, I did not feel any better, so I broke my fast with some bone broth and coconut cream. It’s been about 3 hours since I broke my fast and I’m feeling better.

What the hell? I never had trouble fasting before! Did I really lose my fat adaptation in 3 months? I took plenty of salt and electrolytes. Could I just be detoxing from something? I’ve been taking CBD oil to help me sleep, and I wonder if my liver doesn’t like it.

#2

You have to be careful with CBD products, they are not regulated and as of late, a lot of contaminations have been found, some of them very harmful. That may or may not be your issue now, but it is something you need to be aware of.

(Amy) #3

Thanks, velvet! I do use PlusCBD, which is third party tested and seems to be reputable. From my research, CBD oil raises liver enzymes in about 10% of the population. My liver enzymes looked great last time I had them tested, but my super-skunky breath makes me wonder if my body’s trying to get rid of it.

It’s been 5 or 6 hours since I broke my fast, and in addition to the bone broth, I’ve eaten some mac nuts and tea with cream. Feeling better, but still skunky breath.

(Rebecca ) #4

Maybe you need to eat?

(Bunny) #5

Sounds like glucose was getting too low (not enough uptake of existing ketones), if you had of eaten a little bit of protein, you could have released some glycogen and felt better immediately.

24 hour fasts are probably your limitation for now until your body gets use to it?

I can go without eating for three or 4 days sometimes and not experience any side effects other than being a little hungry but is not what I would consider fasting in the sense of real autophagy but more hormetic (hormesis[1]) adaption and what I’m doing is giving my body a sample or dose of what’s to come in the future and allow it to respond accordingly then the next time I do it, the longer I can go without eating, it is lot like adapting to cold weather or the cold thermal genesis that Wim Hof practices through breathing techniques and exposure timing.

You can be very moody and very protective over food after a real long fast also! (for 3 or 4 weeks after the extended fast)

References:

[1] “…Hormesis is any process in a cell or organism that exhibits a biphasic response to exposure to increasing amounts of a substance or condition. Within the hormetic zone, there is generally a favorable biological response to low exposures to toxins and other stressors. …” …Wikipedia

(Amy) #6

Probably so. I’m just shocked cuz I never used to have trouble going a couple days without eating. I’m going to stick to IF for now.

#7

I will first prep when doing longer fasts, such as a 3-5 day fast and only start when my blood numbers show I’m in ketosis. I will continue after as well. Having done Keto and IF for a period of about 8 years on and off, I cycle in and out of keto on a regular basis. Primarily LCH. I have very little experience with CBD and there does not seem to be a gold standard for testing.

#8

You also can’t rule out just seasonal sickness. I thought the other day I was just suffering from some sort of body response to a new workout when in fact is was a virus causing the symptoms. It went through the whole family. It could be the fast too, but you usually don’t respond that way. I wouldn’t worry too much about it if you are recovered.

(Jane Srygley) #9

I believe you can lose your fat adaptation in a day! The Jason Fung group on Facebook talks a lot about doing a fat fast for a few days before an extended fast. That way you can be sure to be fat adapted first.

When to use a fat fast?


A fat fast can be a useful tool to get started with fasting or when you want to get back on track. The idea is to eat lots of fatty foods until sated for a few days before you start fasting. Doing so will help your body reach fat burning mode faster and without as many negative side effects, such as headaches and hunger pangs.

  • Coming off a period of eating a diet high in carbohydrates
  • Extreme hunger or carbohydrate cravings
  • Periods of stress when fasting seems impossible

https://thefastingmethod.com/what-is-fat-fasting-and-when-should-you-do-it/

(Amy) #10

Yep, that’s what it turned out to be. I’ve been sick with a virus the past couple days. My daughter had it too.

(Amy) #11

I believe you can lose ketosis (fragile state), but not fat adaptation that easily. I did slowly give up carbs in the two weeks before my fast. It turns out I was just sick. I still have a fever and the runs.

#12

I don’t think you can lose fat adaptation in a day. Being fat adapted means having more mitochondria and basically up regulating the burning of fat and the usage of ketones. That doesn’t change in 24 hours.
I’ve been sometimes low carb, sometimes keto, sometimes fasting for years now, and even if I go much higher carb for weeks I can still fast pretty easily for several days.

(Bunny) #13

Yes! That is an awesome observation and I love it!

References:

[1] “…Muscle mitochondria rely on fatty acids and carbohydrates (in the form of pyruvate) as substrates for energy production. … (1963), there is a pronounced interaction between glucose and fatty acid oxidation at the whole body level. …” …Your mitochondria are what you eat: a high‐fat or a high‐sucrose diet eliminates metabolic flexibility in isolated mitochondria from rat skeletal muscle

[2] “…Impaired mitochondrial function often results in excessive production of reactive oxygen species (ROS) and is involved in the etiology of many chronic diseases, including cardiovascular disease, diabetes, neurodegenerative disorders, and cancer. Moderate levels of mitochondrial ROS, however, can protect against chronic disease by inducing upregulation of mitochondrial capacity and endogenous antioxidant defense. This phenomenon, referred to as mitohormesis, is induced through increased reliance on mitochondrial respiration, which can occur through diet or exercise. Nutritional ketosis is a safe and physiological metabolic state induced through a ketogenic diet low in carbohydrate and moderate in protein. Such a diet increases reliance on mitochondrial respiration and may, therefore, induce mitohormesis. Furthermore, the ketone β -hydroxybutyrate (BHB), which is elevated during nutritional ketosis to levels no greater than those resulting from fasting, acts as a signaling molecule in addition to its traditionally known role as an energy substrate. BHB signaling induces adaptations similar to mitohormesis, thereby expanding the potential benefit of nutritional ketosis beyond carbohydrate restriction. This review describes the evidence supporting enhancement of mitochondrial function and endogenous antioxidant defense in response to nutritional ketosis, as well as the potential mechanisms leading to these adaptations. …” … Nutritional Ketosis and Mitohormesis: Potential Implications for Mitochondrial Function and Human Health

[3] “…Fat Adapted Fueling Nutrition. As I mentioned previously, aerobic training does help the body to become more efficient at burning fat, but most of the adaptation happens within the muscles. The mitochondria in the muscles become more efficient at burning fat stored within the muscles (intramuscular triglycerides). …” … Fat Adapted Fueling - Enhance Your Body’s Ability to Burn Fat