Skin curtains: autophagy fasting vs. low calorie diet

#1

autophagy is about cell recycling. low calorie diets that involve autophagy result in skin curtains. so why don’t people with skin curtains simply do autophagy fasting at that stage of the diet?

(Eric - The patient needs to be patient!) #2

Good question. I’m not waiting for skin curtains. I’m doing clean fasting and then feasting. Last EF had a GKI of 2.4 and Dr Boz Ratio of 43 so I should have been deep into autophagy.

That is why I measure Ketones + BG near the end of my EF so I can tell how effective it is with at least the GKI value. this assumes that the GKI value, or the Dr. Boz ratio is reflective of autophagy.

(Karen) #3

How do you calculate GKI?

(Eric - The patient needs to be patient!) #4

BG mg/dl /18/ ketones mmol/L

I think I got the units right. Dr Boz Ratio

BG mg/dl / ketones mmol/L

An example

BG 80 mg/dL
ketones 2.0 mmol/L

GKI = 80/18/2 = 2.2
Boz = 80/2 = 40

(Windmill Tilter) #5

Fasting is not for everyone. That said, if you intend to do extended fasting, I think it makes more sense to do it towards the beginning of weight loss rather than at the end. Waiting for excess skin to develop before fasting for autophagy is like waiting to have a car accident before buying car insurance. Not the best strategy.

The more fat you have, the easier it is to fast. If you wait until you have excess skin to do extended fasting, it will be more difficult to fast because you have less fat, you are more at risk of losing actual muscle mass, you are at greater risk for metabolic adaptations from the fasting, and the number of fasts you can do is limited. Autophagy is also a slow process. Extended fasting at 15% bodyfat is very, very different than fasting at 40% bodyfat.

That’s my 2 cents. :slight_smile:

(Trudy) #6

After losing almost 50kg and losing weight in the past (then regaining) I have a lot of loose skin :slightly_frowning_face:. I IF most days but am the happiest I’ve ever been, this loose skin is a reminder that Keto has saved my life. I will be interested if I have any changes over the next few years of maintenance. I will be twelve months Keto on the 18th March and I feel my body is still repairing and finding its set point.

(Splotchy) #7

My impression (n=1) is that fat loss can be quick but connective tissue autophagy is slow. I started to develop a belly overhang at around the 25lb loss stage - I’ve now lost 45lb and the overhang/sag is slightly less. My weight loss is very slow now, maybe the autophagy is ‘catching up’? Anyways I don’t mind living with some sag, far better that than diabetes/strokes/cancer/dementia.

I do 1 day fast each week, and extend one of those into a 3 day fast each month.

(Windmill Tilter) #8

This sounds like a really sensible autophagy strategy, and it sounds like it’s working well for you. :+1:

Keep us posted! Mitigating post weight loss excess skin via with fasting induced autophagy is something tons of folks on the forums wonder about, but there really isn’t much data or n=1 results with respect to sucessful strategies. Folks figure they’d need to fast 4 days a week to get results, or try to cram fasting in at the end. Consider doing a progress thread when you hit maintenance to let folks know what worked for you.

If doing a one day fast once a week and a 3 day fast once a month is a winning strategy, folks should know about it! That’s something just about anybody can do.

(Splotchy) #9

Yep - it’s not difficult (once I was low carb) and completely flexible as I choose days where it won’t be noticed and doesn’t interfere with my social life. I was anxious in advance in case it made me groggy/faint (in case work or driving affected) and was amazed it didn’t.

I started it as an experiment and am continuing as it really does make a difference - ongoing gentle weight loss, and I am hoping autophagy.

(Door Girl) #10

I’m at 25 pounds lost, and trying on my new old clothes today I noticed that my skin suit doesn’t fit as tightly as it used to. :slight_smile: Hopefully it is a short bit of catch up as I comfortably wore (sat for over an hour in) jeans today I couldn’t zip last week, but either way I’ve decided that now is the time to step up my fasting game to see if autophagy can help me lose in a more proportional way.

I have up to 30 more pounds to go (rough target, need to recalibrate when I am closer), so if I’m going to properly nourish a fast I need to get after it. And I am. Once I go to bed I will have done my first sleep to sleep fast. :slight_smile: Wish I could go for a longer one, but social obligations make that impractical this time around.